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Last Post
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Jul 29, 2008 12:19 PM
by: FlameFlash
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Posts:
10
Registered:
Jul 21, 2008
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Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 22, 2008 11:26 PM
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Apple updated their support site on the issue here:
http://support.apple.com/kb/TS1953
in addition users connecting to me.com are greeted with a message explaining that the service is unavaolable and providing a link to the support site.
They are working hard to solve the problem. By contacting support through the chat i asked on how to raise a claim... support advised that this outage is inexcusable and if a compensation is to be made it will be for everyone affected automatically.
Also the affected server had worldwide based accounts (i'm from Greece).
I used to think that a year of free service would be a good compensation but now that i can not work for a fifth day, i realise i am loosing money out of this... at least an iphone 3g would ease my pain 
Macbook
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
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Posts:
11
From:
United Kingdom
Registered:
Sep 26, 2007
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 22, 2008 11:38 PM
in response to: myhime
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Helpful
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That's a very smart suggestion, myhime. I'm counting the cost of the workrounds and emergency arrangements I've had to make to keep my business going through all of this and, by heck, it's adding up. As this has all been in the pursuit of establishing a platform for 3G iPhone (which I don't have), I think that the least Apple could do, in addition to any membership extension they might offer, is to do a deal on the iPhone for mobileme victims.
MacBook 2GHz Intel Core Duo 1Gb
Mac OS X (10.4.10)
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Posts:
5,043
Registered:
Oct 3, 2001
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 3:29 AM
in response to: scudlet
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Just as a reminder for those who use or want to use their MobileMe accounts for their businesses, from the MoblieMe Terms of Service:
The Service is designed for personal use and not intended to be used for commercial business purposes, including, but not limited to, transacting online sales or software distribution via an e-commerce site.
Not an apology for Apple, simply a reminder that those running businesses should be using a different email provider for that purpose.
Quad 2.5 GHz G5, 5 GB | 2.33 GHz MBP C2D 2 GB
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
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Posts:
47
Registered:
May 6, 2005
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 4:47 AM
in response to: William Kucharski
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Please correct me if I'm wrong since this is just a personal observation but my understanding is that using a MobileMe account for "business" is different from using it for "commercial business". I don't know what the law is in the U.S (and doubtlessly a non U.S citizen must still abide by the laws of the country in which the contract is made) but in India the same distinction is made in property law where business IS allowed in a residential home PROVIDING one is selling a skill based service, e,g accountancy. The ruling was made on the basis that, since any client is simply paying for the BENEFIT of that skill, you are not therefore selling the actual skill itself and so it still remains for your "personal use". Only if you are selling something specific which actually "changes hands" so to speak does it become "commercial". If so, it might explain why the T+Cs specifically mention software distribution - a rather grey area that one if it's downloaded online!
G4
Mac OS X (10.4.11)
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Posts:
17,561
From:
Bedford, Texas
Registered:
Jan 29, 2005
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 5:23 AM
in response to: purnima
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That might be a distinction for zoning purposes at your house, but it would not impact this type of agreement/contract. In this case deleting the word "commercial" would have no impact except possibly you are operating a "business" in which you receive no form of payment for your services.
MacPro Dual Core 2.66 Ghz, MacBook Pro 15", iPhone 3G
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
AEXs, Red 2G Nano, Red Shuffle, 16GB Touch, 160 GB Classic, White 60GB 5G
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Posts:
60
From:
London, UK
Registered:
Apr 5, 2005
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 5:31 AM
in response to: deggie
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I disagee. The inclusion of the word "commercial" , in my opinion, is a specific clarification to the type of business one can conduct within the terms of conditions.
15" 2.5Ghz Macbook Pro 4GB RAM LED 250GB HDD
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
1GB Ipod Shuffle, 16GB Iphone 3G, 80GB 5.5G Ipod Video
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Posts:
5
From:
USA
Registered:
Jul 21, 2008
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 6:27 AM
in response to: William Kucharski
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Just as a reminder for those who use or want to use their MobileMe accounts for their businesses, from the MoblieMe Terms of Service:
The Service is designed for personal use and not intended to be used for commercial business purposes, including, but not limited to, transacting online sales or software distribution via an e-commerce site.
Not an apology for Apple, simply a reminder that those running businesses should be using a different email provider for that purpose.
or getting a utility bill online
certainly that is acceptable use
it has occurred to me that apple may not "fix" this problem and may solve it by simply ignoring us until we go away.
eMac
Mac OS X (10.4.11)
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Posts:
47
Registered:
May 6, 2005
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 7:07 AM
in response to: deggie
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I'm by no means saying that I'm right here deggie and as I'm not a lawyer, I don't know what exactly defines a "commercial business" but I do think the distinction runs deeper than my local housing regulations.
Just for an e.g if I ran an independent accountancy consultancy from my home would you call that "a commercial business"? I wouldn't as no goods are exchanged (nor would I be paying a work force).
However, I would still call it "a business" as I would be doing business with my clients who paid me for my services. On that basis then surely I would also be within the T+C's if I used my MobileMe email?
G4
Mac OS X (10.4.11)
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Posts:
3
From:
Midwest usa
Registered:
Jul 19, 2008
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 7:20 AM
in response to: calamaya48
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That's an interesting point. I do work as a freelance Director of Photography/DIT. Most people, should they be interested in contacting me, do so over email. I use the homepage to host my reel. I'm not saying i'm losing work, as I cannot see if there is email to dictate such, but there is always the reality that I could. I have a gmail account, but even such, I have always preferred my DOTMAC. I am upset that I have been without email for 5 days, but the "break" has been nice. I don't think that pointing things out to people will make a difference. We all pay to have an email service. If in the process of changing our service, the company drops, looses or breaks contact we have the right to understand why. I am frustrated it took apple this long to make a public post about it, aside from the 1%'s.
iMac 20"
Mac OS X (10.4.11)
iPhone
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Posts:
12
Registered:
Oct 7, 2005
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 8:14 AM
in response to: William Kucharski
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Just as a reminder for those who use or want to use their MobileMe accounts for their businesses, from the MoblieMe Terms of Service:
The Service is designed for personal use and not intended to be used for commercial business purposes, including, but not limited to, transacting online sales or software distribution via an e-commerce site.
I'm reading between the lines here, but what I recognize is the "commercial" part of the text. Sending a simple email communication with or without a small attachment be it personal or business in nature is a lot different than distributing software or conducting e-commerce. I'm sure that's what they're alluding to here. It would make sense that they'd like to avoid the server load associated with large data streams deluging their servers and the risk and liability associated with e-commerce. It's ludicrous to presume they'd request their higher-tech customer base to preclude ANY use of their email functions for simple communications given their goal of wrestling a larger piece of the MS PC business pie
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Posts:
4
From:
California
Registered:
Jul 21, 2008
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 8:37 AM
in response to: myhime
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Things are going from bad to worse! I was told over the weekend that we would not be loosing any of our emails - implication was clear that these were being archived - but now after 5 full days - I am getting word that emails are now being returned as "undeliverable" - Great Apple - thanks!
PowerBook G4
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
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Posts:
17,561
From:
Bedford, Texas
Registered:
Jan 29, 2005
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 3:27 PM
in response to: purnima
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Yes, if you ran an accounting practice it would be a commercial business. Commercial does not mean manufacturing, retailing, etc. and in most contracts is used to distinguish from a non-profit. It is pretty standard language in all contracts.
The specific reason that Apple's lawyers include it is to protect themselves from damages. Several people here have made posts saying their income/business has been hurt by not being able to receive email. So say one of these people attempt to sue Apple and claim a loss of $25,000 as they were not able to respond to a potential client fast enough. Apple's lawyers are going to point to the specific clause cited in the Terms of Use for MobileMe and they will not be found liable.
MacPro Dual Core 2.66 Ghz, MacBook Pro 15", iPhone 3G
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
AEXs, Red 2G Nano, Red Shuffle, 16GB Touch, 160 GB Classic, White 60GB 5G
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Posts:
10
Registered:
Jul 21, 2008
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 3:41 PM
in response to: myhime
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I see the points raised on the term of service however still business has a very broad meaning.
I will explain a real case that really can cost me $35 just like that.
On Friday i registered as a e-shop client and i registered with my .me account. A registration mail containing my password was sent. . I placed an order MAIL went OUTand later a placed a second order. I realized that the shipping cost is 35$ so i wanted to advise customer support from the e-shop that i want both orders to be shipped combined. I sent an email from a different account. Guess what... Privacy policy of the store required that i should log in to my account provide my password and change my email address from .mr to gmail As i could not access my mails there was no way i could validate who i was. So isn't Apple liable for me paying the $35 in freight costs?
This case is not related with any commercial use of my account and has nothing to do with busness. Me as a person lost money from this outage in a very simple way that might happened to more people. If you add the frustration generated and my IBS condition (stress cause me physical pain and not normal visits to the toilet) kicking in 6 days now, what amount should be compensated? That's why i proposed a year of free service + iphone 3G as a compensation, although now that i think of it maybe they should also print a T-Shirt "i was an 1%er" like other members proposed on other threads.
A support repressentative proposed me that he/she could beat the engineers for me and i said that this is not required (seriously, i have the transcript), i even was kind enough to say that maybe we as customers might be too rude with support and engineers but that was 2 days ago when i could converse in a civilised manner.
<Edited by Moderator>
Macbook
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
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Posts:
2
From:
Australia
Registered:
Jul 21, 2008
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 3:51 PM
in response to: tlaw53a
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Helpful
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I have two points to make on this matter (my email has been down since Friday - I've been a .mac user for four years).
- The whole "personal" vs "commercial use" question assumes that we value our commercial uses more highly than our personal uses. Sorry Apple, I use the service for personal use only but I am affronted by the implication that this reduces the seriousness of the problem or might mitigate some of the legal obligations on Apple. I happen to value my personal life more highly than my commercial life and view damage to this through negligence and/ or incompetence more dimly than I would a commercial email failure.
- Apple's minimal moral and legal obligation to users is to advise on the status of email arriving during this outage. Will it be received by users after when the fault is corrected, or will it disappear into the cloud? (Apple may come to regret the "cloud" for its etheresque connotations.) This information will give users reasonable on what action they should take to mitigate impact and losses from the outage. Failure to provide this information might be construed as wilful negligence as the impact of this failure mounts by day. One might liken the situation to an airline that has been forced to cancel a flight but simply fails to advise the passengers of anything except that there is no aircraft at the gate and that airline personnel are working to address this. After five days, an airline's failure to fully declare the details of the delay / service failure, such that travellers are not provided with appropriate information from which they might make a decision to mitigate the impact, would be viewed dimly in a damages claim.
MacBook Pro / Power Mac / Final Cut / Logic Pro / Aperture /etc etc
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
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Posts:
10
Registered:
Jul 21, 2008
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Re: Apple updated on the issue
Posted:
Jul 23, 2008 6:04 PM
in response to: myhime
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i managed to connect to the support chat. While i was chatting with S....D... from support i informed of my intention to claim a compensation in a legal way. The repressentative apeared as "typing" for 30 mins (i send a few requests to come back to me) but nothing happened i assumed that there was a communication issue or that the working hours ended however when i finally closed the chat window, the "requeste a transcript sent to your email" window appeard and dissapeared in a second without allowing me to request the transcript. Has something similar happened to anyone else?
Macbook
Mac OS X (10.5.4)
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