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Is Logic 8 a 64 Bit App?

Is Logic 8 64 Bit? It doesn't really say this anywhere in the specs. After all this time are we still confiined by the memory limitations of a 32 app when Leopard comes out next month? Still we will not be able to load large numbers of sample library presets. This can't be. Someone tell me I'm wrong.

Mac Pro 8-core, Mac OS X (10.4.10)

Posted on Sep 12, 2007 11:58 AM

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269 replies

Sep 12, 2007 12:06 PM in response to 63strat

Nobody knows yet. Hopefully apple will clarify or someone will be able to figure out from the app itself.

I know Band on the Run is a developer and is running leopard, I'd be curious to hear if Logic runs on it and if the ram limitation is higher.

Apple does make the cryptic comment "support for sampled instruments of near-limitless size" on their website, although I'm not making any assumptions based on that.

Sep 12, 2007 12:25 PM in response to Brian Peat

That's a different thing. In other words, those things could (probably would) still be true if Logic is a 64-bit application.

The biggest feature with 64-bit applications on a 64-bit operating system is the ability for an application to easily use more than 2 or 4 gigs of RAM. For Logic, the biggest advantage of 64-bit would be to load many more large samples into EXS24.

Sep 12, 2007 12:46 PM in response to Bontempi

No Dongle, whole new interface and Lep 64 bit OS around the corner=new from ground up.

Surprised they didn't wait for Lep. I guess that's when we'll see FCP (new). Spoke with someone who SAW it and stated "not like iMovie, ut very, very APPLE like"...
32 float is normally the best way to record audio.....64 will allow for more RAM and a speed bump of about 30-40% (original poster), so lets say we have out MBP or Macbook or Mac Pro, simply adding the new OS, will bring a 40% CPU usage down to 20%. And with Leopard coming out in a few weeks, yes, it has to be 64 bit ready...they wouldn't take 5 years to release if it was simply a re-write and half the price...maybe that will be the PT killer (the price), don't see any mention of PT though whereas the older logic talked about PT compatibility all the time.

Hope this helps.

Message was edited by: Hi I'm A Mac

Sep 12, 2007 1:23 PM in response to Hi I'm A Mac

32 float is normally the best way to record audio.....64 will allow for more RAM and a speed bump of about 30-40% (original poster), so lets say we have out MBP or Macbook or Mac Pro, simply adding the new OS, will bring a 40% CPU usage down to 20%.


I'd bet against the speed bump. The current processors already peform operations internally on 64-bit values, when programmed that way, and have data paths to the RAM system wider than 64-bits. The advantage of 64-bit OS X will be the increased per-process address space.

On the contrary, I won't be surprised at all if there's a performance drop when applications go to 64-bits, except in cases where the larger per-process RAM is an advantage.

Sep 12, 2007 2:25 PM in response to Stephen Siegel

Stephen Siegel wrote:
My guess is that the current release is not 64 bit, but it seems possible that Apple is readying a 64bit update for release after Leopard is released......


It will take someone having a build of 10.5 and Logic 8 to confirm. A truly 64bit Logic 8 would require 10.5 on either PPC G5 or Intel C2D to execute.

I think it is very bad sign that none of the provided pdf manuals or documentation online mentions anything about 64bit, or requiring a 64bit CPU for certain features. Still I am quite happy with all of the improvements and low price.

Sep 12, 2007 2:45 PM in response to tele_player

you've gotta get away from this 64-bit application misconception. even logic 7 had 64 bit components - many of the plug-ins are 64-bit. the application will not be made 32-bit because it would then no longer be compatible with your 3rd party plug-ins.

memory addressing for samples is not necessarily determined by the bit depth of the program. logic 8 it seems has overcome the 4Gb memory limit for the exs. also CAF basically allows for more than 4Gb file length (aif is 2 Gb, wav is 4Gb).

but there seems to be huge misconception about bit depth and how it affects working with a DAW.

believe me, i would be pretty annoyed if they tried to revamp the program so much that i couldn't use my plug-ins. feck that for a joke.

Sep 12, 2007 3:20 PM in response to Rohan Stevenson1

OK, now I'm confused... I thought the reason that Logic 7 couldn't address more than 4G's of RAM was because it was a 32-bit application. As was explained to me by software engineer, the math works out like this: 2^32 = a bit more than 4 billion (i.e., 4G's), meaning, that Logic (or any other 32-bit app) simply can't calculate numbers higher than 4G. And if it can't calculate a number higher than 4G, it can't physically make a call to a memory location higher than 4G.

So is this "logic" out the window now?

Sep 12, 2007 4:42 PM in response to iSchwartz

32bit float really has nothing to do with an application being compiled as a 64bit application. The bit depth of the sample also has nothing to do with application code and how much RAM it can address.

As far as the number of samples that can be loaded at any one time, yes that is limited by address space -- I suppose samples can be swapped in and out of RAM to stay within the 32bit limited address space, but that would be very worky for real time audio (aka bounce and continue). But as I understand it, 32bit GUI on OS X can use a 64bit address space.

On the Microsoft side, products like Cakewalk Sonar 6 offer a 64bit version for the very reason that high quality samples with a ton of FX processing and toss in surround and you VERY quickly hit 32bit limited address space.

Some Myth's of OS X 32bit/64bit:
http://developer.apple.com/documentation/Darwin/Conceptual/64bitPorting/index.ht ml

Another good read: http://developer.apple.com/macosx/64bit.html

Based on these specs http://www.apple.com/logicstudio/logicpro/specs.html
It would be my guess Logic Pro 8 is again 32bit GUI code. No mention of it using 64bit address space which would be a huge "selling" point if it were and certainly listed in the specifications. "Internal audio resolution: 32-bit floating point; 64-bit precision where required..." does NOT mean it is 64bit code using a 64bit address space nor does it mean it is 32bit GUI code using 64bit address space.

Here is a good read on what 64bit computing will do for you:
http://www.cakewalk.com/Press/CakewalkWhite%20Paper_Benefits_of_Modern_CPU_Architectures_for_Digital_AudioApplications.pdf

Yes this is Cakewalk's info, but still valid and accurate -- don't read this as me trying to say one is better than the other. I'm not, I use both and when I hit the wall I bounce and proceed. The wall is just a lot further away in 64bit world -- both tools are great.

To find out if this is 32bit GUI with 64bit address space -- one would just have to load up 5GB of samples (that's A LOT of very high quality samples) and see what happens. Personally I'd think one's CPU power and FSB bandwidth to RAM would be the bottle neck.

That said, how many of you have hit the wall in Logic Pro 7.2? or Logic Pro 8? I'll be picking up Logic Pro 8 upgrade tonight regardless of it's 32bit or 64bit base.

Rob.

Is Logic 8 a 64 Bit App?

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