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  • 1,020. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    FightTheFuture Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Fedux, you mentioned in a previous post that you had phoned Apple support twice and had two different answers. What did you ask them yesterday that led you to this new answer?

    I'm not trying to find fault in your logic, I'm wondering if Apple had recently looked into this matter.
  • 1,021. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    adrisen Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Thanks Rod Apple replaced my battery about a year ago because I was having issues with it. I was not having issues with it before the upgrade. I guess I will just have to wait for Apple to fix the situation.
  • 1,022. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Fedux Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    If I have to be honest I have to say that they were a lot different from my last call that was made 2 months ago.
    The thing that made them speak was reading them FatMac email, they completely changed mood!
    They recognized immediately that Apple knows the problem and assured me they will fix it.... Hope I can believe it....
    I also told them I was very very annoyed 'cause I bought a Laptop, not an iMac and so I ask them what could I do... I can't buy a new battery 'cause it's just the same! Do I have to buy a new computer? They told me not to worry that a fix will be provided...
  • 1,023. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Rod Hagen Level 7 Level 7 (31,985 points)
    73% of a maximum capacity of 1283 mAh means that your battery cut out with about 935 mAh left in the battery, parisontour.

    That means it cut out at about 16.7% of its original full capacity of 5600mAh. Your battery is very clearly way past normal operating parameters. Even its maximum capacity *is less than 23% of its original capacity*. Lithium batteries, unfortunately, can become unreliable below 80% of normal maximum capacity. Yours , like many others reported here, is far, far, below that level

    Please don't let anyone here mislead you into believing that any OS tweak from Apple or new Flash plug-in tweak from Adobe is going to resolve your particular situation. You simply have a battery that is far, far beyond being able to sustain normal operation without unpredicted shutdowns whenever it is called on to provide even a moderate spike in power demands. If you do, you are simply kidding yourself.

    Take it to an Apple repair centre (or an independent battery specialist if you don't "trust" Apple), and get it tested.

    Cheers

    Rod
  • 1,024. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Rod Hagen Level 7 Level 7 (31,985 points)
    adrisen wrote:
    Thanks Rod Apple replaced my battery about a year ago because I was having issues with it.


    If you don't believe that "lightning can strike twice in the same place " with the batteries fitted in earlier MBPs like yours, adrisen, have a look at http://www.anttikupila.com/mac/macbook-pro-battery-problems/

    As I have tried to point out on numerous occasions in this thread (despite the very silly suggestions from some that "Apple" is my "God" and the like from people who would think very differently if they had been around here a bit longer than a few weeks) the batteries fitted to earlier MBPs do not have a particularly good reliability record.

    Before you jump to assumptions about miraculous OS fixes, even if you don't want to post your battery details here, you should take your battery to an Apple service centre, or an independent battery expert if you don't trust Apple, and get it tested.

    Cheers

    Rod
  • 1,025. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    STCav Level 1 Level 1 (30 points)
    Hi all,
    I wouldn't read too much into two different answers from Apple; it might not be that they have reconsidered the issue or found any new information.
    When I reported my battery problem to the Apple Support, I was told that they *would not* replace my battery for free because they had already done so once. While I was talking to the Apple operator the call was cut off, apparently accidentally, in mid sentence.
    I immediately rang back and spoke to a different operator, who told me they would replace my battery for free because they had already done so once! Same facts, same history, different answer, all within five minutes.
    I suspect it depends on how the operators record the incident, but it might be as simple as how they feel at any particular time, or how the problems are expressed.

    Stephen
  • 1,026. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Rod Hagen Level 7 Level 7 (31,985 points)
    don montalvo wrote:
    Unfortunately, that would negatively impact his desire to reach the 10,000 post milestone.

    Don

    Hah!

    Don, if you had been around a bit more often over the years you would know just how silly that is. I've been chucked off Apple's various boards a couple of times. First in 1997, for complaining about the very real issue at that time of problems caused by a new version of "Drive Set-up", which had the unfortunate effect of wiping out people's boot drives in their entirety if they were using Macs equipped with the "Archimedes" logicboard. I guess the fact that I also gave interviews about the matter in the Australian media - including most of our main line daily newspapers and to programs broadcast nationally by our national broadcasting organisation, and that even made it as far as the US mainstream papers, played a part in it!

    But even more relevant to your, lets face it, somewhat offensive claims (though far less importantly when it comes to dealing with real Mac problems) , when the current "points/ posts" based system was introduced I got into terrible trouble for suggesting that it was really a dumb idea to base notions of "merit" on post counts and the like, and had to spend some time on the sidelines for that, too.

    I don't give a monkey's cuss about "posts" or "points" here. Never have and never will. What on earth do you think doing so would gain me, even if I did "play the game" about such things?

    If I thought that the suggestion that Snow Leopard really had anything to do with people's real battery life here I'd be the first to say it, but I don't think it does. I think a lot of people with old batteries are getting a new message that lets them get a more honest appraisal of their battery status than they received in the past. 90% of the original posts in this thread come down to this , and those who suggest otherwise are simply kidding themselves.

    Yep. Lithium Batteries wear out. They wear out when they are two to three years old mostly. The Apple batteries in MBps are certainly no better than this. Sometime they die before. Sometimes after. I wish they were better too. I've already had to pay for a new one out of my own, emptier than I would like, pocket.

    Snow Leopard provides a bit more warning of this with its "Service Battery" warning than early versions of the OS. People who worry about the threat of data loss should be glad about this. They should also realise that unpredicted shutdowns have always occurred on notebook computers because of ageing batteries regardless of the OS involved since the first battery powered computers arrived on the scene.

    I guess if, as you hint, you are running your MBPs in "kiosk" mode, rather than creating new stuff on them, this might not matter much at all to you and it just comes down to "downtime" while you reload the image, rather than genuinely lost data, but people who use their MBPs to create things really need such warnings. Let's hope, for the sake of such people, that the hysteria here doesn't convince Apple to "fix" the "problem" by simply pulling such warnings altogether!

    Let's face it. The "new" arrivals here, like "parisontour" have batteries that are as dead as the proverbial Dodo. The only answer to the problems of someone like "parisontour" is to get a new battery. Many others who have posted here have found just the same. Suggesting, as others have, that people like these hang out for some sort of "mystery fix", allegedly mentioned over a phone line by some unknown, unidentified, person in Italy, allegedly connected in some unknown fashion with Apple, is simply nonsense. If people have bad batteries they have bad batteries. I've always had a soft spot for Cervantes and Don Quixote, but some of the stuff in this thread makes even Voltaire's Doctor Pangloss look hard headed!

    For anyone else other than Don (Montalvo, who seems to have his own agenda, not Quixote ) , simply put, if you have a battery that comes out with a bad message get it checked out. If you want suggestions beforehand post your System profiler data about the battery here for comment. There may, indeed, be some things, like the Adobe Flash issue in Safari when run in 64 bit mode, that will make a bad battery look even worse, and, very rarely, there at least seem to be some situations where battery reporting is erratic. But if you have a bad battery already no OS system tweak is going to fix it. Snow Leopard is simply providing you with better warnings of such things than you might have had in the past.

    Cheers

    Rod
  • 1,027. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Fedux Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    All you're saying still doesn't explain why, running Leopard, my battery lasts more than 3 hours and acts normally with all the warnings when the power is going to end.
    You still don't provide an explanation of why a society that produces batteries says not to buy a new one 'cause it will act the same of my old one.
    In the end, you don't explain, again, why Apple itself said to wait a fix.
    I'm not here to invent anything, I report facts; this will be my last post 'cause I see that this thread won't lead to anything, I just want to repeat that, if I could be sure it will fix it, I simply would buy a new battery and I would be the most happy person in the world!
    I didn't want to offend you, Rod, but I like constructive conversation, not fixed point of view.
    Have a good day.
  • 1,028. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    don montalvo Level 2 Level 2 (345 points)
    Rod Hagen wrote:
    Snow Leopard is simply providing you with better warnings of such things than you might have had in the past.


    Rod,

    This is what's annoying people. The problem is reduced battery life and sudden shutdowns - which all started for many people after the 10.6 upgrade. The warnings would be a welcome feature if the problems didn't come with it.

    Rod, I'm sure you're trying to help. But your snipes at those who are convinced it's a Snow Leopard is not winning you any fans. I think you might need to step away from the keyboard for a while. Get some fresh air.

    Don
  • 1,029. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Rod Hagen Level 7 Level 7 (31,985 points)
    Sorry fedux, but can you explain why my own battery on essentially the same computer, with the same battery, lasts no longer and no less under Snow Leopard than it does under Leopard if the OS is really the issue here?

    I'm sorry, too, but you have already posted your battery stats here and if you can get 3 hours genuine usage out of a battery with 1053mAh maximum capacity then I'm a monkey's uncle.

    If your situation, and your battery, is as you say it is then you are very obviously one of those who suffers as a result of claims by others that some magic fix for a "bug" is going to help you. It won't.

    You talk about a conversation with someone on an Apple phone line as if they are "Apple". I'm sorry , here, too, but no Apple phone help operator knows what is in an up and coming OS update. Heck, even major Apple dealerships rarely know what the specs of a new computer are until the day before they come out, let alone a system update! Those who do know, aren't allowed to tell. Those who tell are usually talking through their hats. Apple are very, very good at being secretive about such things.

    If you really want to resolve this issue for yourself you don't need to go and "buy a new battery". You simply need to go and get your present one tested. If you don't trust Apple take it to an independent battery specialist and see what they have to say.

    Given the stats you have presented so far you, too, are someone who would gain no benefit at all from waiting for any alleged possible OS "fix". As you have said yourself, your battery is dead or dying. Even if Apple, or other players in this issue like Abobe, can tweak the power usage of their software under SL it is not really going to give you back your battery life.

    But why the adversity to even getting your battery tested? It poses no obligation upon you and would give you a better basis for making your own decision about what to do. Knowing the facts may sometimes be painful, but it is always better to be aware of them whether they prove good or bad. If you don't trust Apple get someone else to do it. There are plenty of people with the necessary skills and equipment out there to test a battery! Just about any computer repair centre or qualified electrician could do it for you!

    Cheers

    Rod
  • 1,030. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Rod Hagen Level 7 Level 7 (31,985 points)
    Don,

    Sudden shutdowns don't come from a bug in Snow Leopard. They come from a battery unable to meet power demands. They have happened under every OS that has been around while Apple have been making notebooks when batteries reach a certain point in their inevitable decline. They aren't caused or precipitated by the OS. They are caused by the amount of power available to the computer not meeting its requirements. They happen in spite of the OS, which tries, when it gets the chance, to do shut down in a much more measured fashion.

    The "Service Battery" warnings are intended to provide some additional "early warning" of such possibilities. If people ignore them , then so be it. If you get a "Service Battery" warning and then subsequently suffer a "sudden shutdown" you can hardly say you haven't been warned!

    As for "winning fans" , Don, I gave that up long ago. I'm sure that there are far more easy acolytes to be won by crying "there is a bug in Snow Leopard" than there are by saying "well , lets think about this and look at the facts", but that's the way life always is, don't you think?

    Thanks for your concern, but don't worry about me. I'm happy to say what I honestly think about such things, regardless of whether it wins me "fans" or loses them.

    Rod
  • 1,031. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    jmgomezg Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Rod, not sure if you read my last post, but sudden shutdowns are not just because batteries unable to meet power demands, if a battery gets more demand of energy, they just discharge faster, only if this over-demand persists, the battery will overheat and eventually may get damage, like cells failing, dropping performance...

    As I posted, my theory is Snow Leopard makes those batteries we had to struggle due to more demand of energy from the new OS, and making them to die sooner. It may not be a OS bug as we understand, I see that, and we may not have the best batteries, also understand, but that doesn't hide the fact that if we were had continuing using Leopard, our batteries would have live longer, and that it's the main concern of people on this forum.

    It's like if tobacco companies wouldn't say to you "smoke can kill you", so you smoke cos you don't know is killing you, then one day, when it's already late, you discover you are dying, that doesn't seems fair, does it? We all die sooner or later, but man, the later the better!

    It may be right to say "if you want to use Snow Leopard, then get a new battery", but again, doesn't mean Apple is not responsible, they should have alert users of an incompatibility hardware like this, of course it's difficult to test on every single device, but, as there are millions of MBP with this type of battery, I believe the OS was just not tested enough. Maybe they were struggling to release it before Windows 7, who knows.
  • 1,032. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Johnny Storm Level 1 Level 1 (90 points)
    jmgomezg wrote:
    It may be right to say "if you want to use Snow Leopard, then get a new battery", but again, doesn't mean Apple is not responsible, they should have alert users of an incompatibility hardware like this, of course it's difficult to test on every single device, but, as there are millions of MBP with this type of battery, I believe the OS was just not tested enough. Maybe they were struggling to release it before Windows 7, who knows.


    That's my biggest complaint. If Snow Leopard requires more power demands then Leopard, that's fine, I'm ok with certain hardware requirements for software updates, ie switching from PowerMac to Intel. I would just like Apple to be up front about it. My problem is that my time machine back up is not compatible with Snow Leopard, so if I want to downgrade, I loose 4 months worth of work.

    Simply put, had I known about this ahead of time, I wouldn't have bothered since I don't really gain anything from Snow Leopard but a faulty battery.

    I would like to point out that its unfortunate that I don't have the stats of my battery pre-Snow Leopard. I would have liked to have been able to compare it 4 months ago to what I have now.

    Its easy to look at the current stats and say that my battery is simply bad, but I would have liked to have been able to have seen that before snow leopard, to see if that was indeed the case.
  • 1,033. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    madrich Level 1 Level 1 (120 points)
    Having watched this thread, what I do not understand is when Snow Leopard was under development and tested with "outside" Apple developers why did not this problem surface with them; or did it?
  • 1,034. Re: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade
    Alex Martin Ensemble Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Any news on a fix for this issue? Everyone got bored and bought a new unibody MacBook Pro?
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