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  • 1,755. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dbk9999 Level 1 Level 1 (55 points)
    Well, we've gotten some answers. Not from Apple, but:

    1. Reports of the Call Guard app as a workaround.

    2. My videos that show how normal movement can change the distance of how the sensor turns off the screen - thus a chance to minimize it happening simply by being aware of it.

    3. Also in my video, how to reset the distance while still on a call if it does screw up.

    Unfortunately, we don't yet know if this accounts for all, most, or just some of the problems with the sensors.

    If more people would try last test (with the card) and report back, we might be able to make a solid theory on that:

    http://picturehawaii.blogspot.com/201009_01archive.html
  • 1,756. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    Monty1945 Level 3 Level 3 (690 points)
    Greetings,

    Weird - My iPhone 4/4.1 does no off the wall strange behavior. I can pull it away from my ear, do something else with the phone, and bring it back to my ear, and it all works fine, as I'm back to chatting with whom ever called. It never hangs up, or makes an errant call, etc - nothing unusual. Once I end the call, it goes back to it's usual routines.

    Works perfect, as does many more iPhones of my acquaintance. Wow, you folks are getting way out there with this thread, and coming up wit some really bazaar stuff - I bet you folks stay up late nights dreaming up this stuff.

    I suppose if you keep at it, someone will throw in another placebo at some point.

    ****, as long as your having fun, what's the harm........

    Cheers,
    M.
    ***
  • 1,757. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dbk9999 Level 1 Level 1 (55 points)
    Have you taken the test shown in my third video - the one with the card used to block the sensor?

    Since you don't have issues normally, it would be a big help to have you do the test and report back on what happens - distance the sensor reacts at during the test.

    This would help us know if your phone has no change at all during the test or just one small enough to not really matter.

    Thanks.

    http://picturehawaii.blogspot.com/201009_01archive.html
  • 1,758. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    zeroio Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    First, I am saddened that I had to return to this forum. I had exchanged my phone many times in June then finally got word from Apple to wait for a phone update (4.1). I updated to 4.1 yesterday (3 months later) and the problem still persists. So I called Apple Support...

    Apple suggests that the problem is not yet known nor completely verified for every scenario. I was told to backup my phone, then restore my phone and before I choose which backup to restore from, disconnect the sync cable. With a new install, and without any of my apps, I then need to test and report back if there is an issue. I'm going to go through that process a little later.

    The basic symptom is that when I talk on the phone I can see the screen light up and my face can press buttons.
  • 1,759. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dbk9999 Level 1 Level 1 (55 points)
    Try my test on the third video. At least it will give you something relatively precise to measure.
  • 1,760. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    sn4p2k Level 4 Level 4 (1,215 points)
    I have it worse it used to work without the update then I updated and now the proximity sensor is a problem
  • 1,761. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    rbrylawski Level 6 Level 6 (10,790 points)
    dbk9999 wrote:
    dbk.....this is fascinating. I tried, but my phone doesn't do this at all. I would honestly take your phone back to Apple and get a replacement...... <</div>

    Holy crap! Okay, we're on a roll here! Obviously I'd like you to check your wife's phone when she is back since you said both your phone never showed any problems.

    Also, I'd like as much detail as you can give on your attempt with my latest test. Such as:

    Did it still first turn off the screen at about 2 inches? My video test for some reason did it at 2.5 rather than the usual 2 inches (I've also had cases where it was at 1.5 to start). So multiple tests on the same phone might be important.

    As you ran my test, did it not change at all or what? If it changed some, how much? And did you move the card as I did, repeatedly - just in case one effort didn't create the problem for some reason we haven't accounted for yet.

    When you have both phones to test, it would also be great to actually have a video of your test because it is different. I doubt I'll see anything in your steps that will matter, but it is always possible and only a video would help me do that.

    Okay, so what does this mean? I don't know - at least not yet! While my tests tend to emphasize software as the most likely problem (reducing power), if you got no change at all, that might give more weight to the idea of faulty sensors - lots of them - that somehow only show the flaw with my test. But no one can explain how that is possible yet.

    There is also the possibility that YOU HAVE A FAULTY SENSOR! Yep, you heard me right. What if the software is the problem, but for your sensor is faulty and thus instructions to reduce power fail because of a problem in your sensor?

    If we can establish a pattern that phones that really work (not just someone who's calling habits don't activate it) do not show any change on this new test while those which have a problem do fail it, we have a relatively quick way for people to check phones they get!

    I assume there is no way to run the test until the phone is activated so that is a bit inconvenient, but they could do this test before leaving the store.

    Of course, that is only if we find a solid pattern. I expect exceptions - just the nature of electronics. But if, say, 80% of the "good" phones pass the test and 80% of those that don't work fail the test, that is more than enough to make a strong case.

    Oh, one other thing. Have you noticed any difference in how dark your screen is compared to those that don't work?

    I've never been able to establish a difference and I really think, at the very least, you have to compare them side by side unless the difference is obvious.

    On my present phone, I can only see the sensor slot under fairly bright sunlight, if I get the light on it just right. I've never checked it with a strong flashlight like some have described.

    Anyway, since yours works, you have friends you say have no problem and I assume some who do, maybe you can make those comparisons.

    I do suspect at least some of those with "no problems" probably just don't experience them normally, but would still fail my test, but we have to start someplace. If they pass the test, we can fairly safely say they really do work 100%. If they don't, then even if the user has no problem in their use, it still wouldn't be like yours.

    Got your excited, eh?? LOL Won't be able to try the other phone for a few more days, but really doubt it will exhibit anything different from mine. The other phone get's used much differently from mine. It's all over the place during a call, and her face is often directly placed on the phone, which as you are well aware, caused lot's of unfortunate things for most people pre 4.1, but never seemed to be an issue with that phone.......

    By the way, this might cheer you up. I was on a very long call tonight. I did your slow roll, then put the phone back to my face very quickly. And low and behold, the screen flickered for a very brief second (a really brief second), then never came back on. Whereas watching your video, the screen blinks on and off several times. That simply didn't happen after the very brief blink on my phone tonight. Again, to me this is simply not an issue. Just thought I'd share.......
  • 1,762. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dbk9999 Level 1 Level 1 (55 points)
    Always excited when new info comes in - even when it might, at first, make it harder to be sure of one single cause!

    So, on the test, did the distance stay the same (say within a quarter inched) or what? The amount of variance, if any, might matter as more data comes in.

    The face all over the phone thing would only matter if there is actually a problem. If the screen never comes on, it normally shouldn't matter - though I did have that one phone where it would activate buttons with the screen OFF and I'm not close to touching it. Haven't seen any pattern to that from others, so I'm assuming it was just a bad phone.

    Not cheered up at all by the minor flaw you had tonight. It is much easier to track things if they are very consistent so I want your phone to be PERFECT every single time! Not that I expect perfection or an absolutely consistent pattern, but it would be nice!

    I would say this about your phone, based on that single experience. It is possible, via the shape of your ear or the better sensor (whatever) that you have a very tiny area where your ear is deep enough to cause a problem, thus a certain amount of bad luck to actually experience it.

    But that doesn't explain the test with the card if you saw no change at all - which is why I need more detail. If you always had the screen stay off at, say, 1.5 inches or more, then I'd chalk tonight's episode up to a fluke for now.

    If you do get a reduction, but much less than mine - let's say always off at 1 inch or less - it MIGHT be possible to activate it if held just right and you have a deep enough ear.

    When it came on, did you continue to slightly slide it around your ear? That's what I do, simply to repeatedly find the bad area. For mine, it is easy to do.

    Can't wait till you can check the other phone and use one to video the other doing the card test.
  • 1,763. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    himoura Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    if lawski's phone does hit a spot in his ear that is so deep it triggers the screen to come on then what exactly does that prove?

    i can see why you guys think that this is a universal problem because the defective phones seem to react the same. i also know that diego is convinced that every phone behaves exactly the same unless someone can shoot video convincing him that it does not.

    so here is a question for you. how do you know this behavior is not a result of the 4.1 update? does anyone know if their phone did this before the update or would care to roll back? i know my phone behaved completely different before the update. i had to really work to get it to act up...
  • 1,764. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dbk9999 Level 1 Level 1 (55 points)
    It doesn't "prove" anything. It is simply another data point. We need more of them to determine more from it. I also need more detail of the results he got from the card test. Right now I only know he didn't get my results. I don't know exactly what results he got.

    Again, I don't know if it is a universal problem. I need more test results to help determine that. All I know is that I have not found a phone that I can't make do the same thing so it certainly seems to be fairly widespread.

    Don't know about the effect of the update either. That's why I keep saying we need people who have not updated to do the test and report on it. That way, when any of those do update and things get better or worse, we can get them to run the test again. Once they update, it is too late to go back and test the old OS.

    You want conclusions before I have enough data. I know some things - such as that I can reduce the sensor range for sure. I am pretty sure I can narrow things down some more with more data from tests.
  • 1,765. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dm2017 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    not sure of the reasons behind it myself, but i am on my 3rd iphone 4 now. this one has iOS 4.0.2 my first one came with 4.1 and was always acting up, the 2nd one i updated right as soon as i got home so i didnt know how it acted before but as with the first the sensor issue was really annoying, i am going to test this out over the next few days on ios 4.0.2 and see how it goes, so far i have FAILED to have any sensor issues at all with this 3d device....i am now scared to update to 4.1 after testing lol
  • 1,766. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dm2017 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    dbk999 where did your testers needed thread go? it appears to have been deleted..? i cannot find it anymore
  • 1,767. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dbk9999 Level 1 Level 1 (55 points)
    Oh great, looks like Apple deleted it. Maybe they know the problem isn't solved very well and don't want people to know there is an easy test to find out.

    I know when I've gone into Apple stores recently (since the update), everyone talks about how the problem is fixed and it is just a few complainers blowing it out of proportion.

    If many people did my test, that may not hold up well.

    Well, maybe more people will report on the test in this thread - or maybe the individual posts are getting deleted too. Might have to go back and see if I see anything later.

    Might have to go to another - non-apple site - and get feedback on my test.
  • 1,768. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    dbk9999 Level 1 Level 1 (55 points)
    Just got an email from the forum. Said my thread was a "poll" and went on to say:

    "These forums are intended for technical questions that can be answered by the community."

    Well, duh, I'm asking a technical question and need the community to give me answers - which may lead to some useful results.
  • 1,769. Re: Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued v2
    JPBOSS Level 1 Level 1 (70 points)
    Yes, I figured it would be deleted eventually. I had posted thread a while back asking first 5 of serial numbers to try to ascertain which if any of the manufacturing facilities along with build week could be implicated of having working or failing units pertaining to the prox. sensor issue. They will only let us stray so far here off our leashes which surprises me as to why they allow this thread to continue to exist. Just weird as all of this is polling, speculation and the like if you ask me. They could be laughing at us wasting our time testing and discussing it as well. Would be unfortunate and shameful if they were. Of course we should expect this since them not releasing any useful data since Jobs spoke about it at Antenna-Gate conference pretty much proves that they are laughing at us.
    dbk9999 wrote:
    Just got an email from the forum. Said my thread was a "poll" and went on to say:

    "These forums are intended for technical questions that can be answered by the community."

    Well, duh, I'm asking a technical question and need the community to give me answers - which may lead to some useful results.