Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 5:01 PM (in response to artistjoh)
I thought Ethmoid's advice was good about finding another host. What makes you think the blog won't work this way?
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 5:04 PM (in response to Ethmoid)
Ethmoid is right, my wife still uses Apple works even though I always suggest Pages and Numbers. It still works as will iweb. We'll just have to find another web host. Pain in the ars, but probably doable. I think Apple needs to clarify this issue with it's users who depend on iweb. Secrecy is one thing but creating a lot of stress is another.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 6:03 PM (in response to Joeswell)
Just wondered what others are discovering by researching the alternatives to iWeb… but first the 'disclaimers'...
Yes, I'm pretty sure we all know iWeb will "work" without MobileMe, perhaps not in "Lion".
My personal choice is to not keep beating a dead horse… time to move on… so I downloaded demo's of SandVox, RapidWeaver, Freeway Express, DreamWeaver, Kompozer, and I've looked at a few online website designers.. like Google… I think Weebly is that way? I could be wrong about Weebly.
So far what I've discovered is that while 'more' powerful in some ways, different ways for each of them, I don't think any of them match all the tools of iWeb… seriously… blogging, slideshows, other's do not have the option, have time intensive alternatives, or $$ add ons. And as far as 'intuitive' and 'easy to use'… it's not even a competition… iWeb blows them all out of the water. True, I don't 'know' the others yet, but I know them well enough to know that I when learning iWeb it was MUCH quicker to become proficient.
I agree with what other's have said… SandVox appears to be the most similar to iWeb alternative. But it's still not very close. The drag and drop of shapes, text boxes, the "arranging"… with iWeb simply can't be found in any of the others, or at least the 'ease' of doing it in iWeb.
RapidWeaver looks to be very nice… no argument from me, but intuitive? Maybe if you're stepping DOWN from something like DreamWeaver but changing from iWeb? It's an alien being. Of the 4 demo's the most difficult for me has been testing RapidWeaver… I even got further, quicker, with DreamWeaver than RapidWeaver. Never the less.. it seems to be the one you can do the most with, (power), considering the add ons… meaning more $… and a LOT more $$$$… .and I mean 'besides' DreamWeaver. I'm leaning RapidWeaver.
Freeway Express I think is close to RapidWeaver, maybe surpassing it, in 'power'… and everyone say's it's easy and intuitive… this was the second most difficult demo I tried, after RapidWeaver, maybe the most difficult.. it was close. Nothing intuitive about it, to me…. now don't get yourself in a snit… I do not know these programs and I'm NOT saying it's not good or even 'easy' to learn… but firing it up and taking a quick look I couldn't do ANYthing, well, much of anything anyway. I WANTED Freeway Express to be the easiest… because I "think", not 100% sure, it's the only one of the three cheaper I've listed, (not counting DreamWeaver), that allows for the most "Theme" customization. I plan on testing it a lot more.
DreamWeaver… the King of the Hill. Way to much for my needs… I HAVE it, but I doubt if I use it.
Kompozer ain't bad for being 'free'… but it lacks all the little 'perks' of the others, or most of them anyway. Which leads me to:
I've seen some, what I consider, 'good advice' posted about taking the time to 'learn' another web designing application… I agree… BUT…. and I have no idea why this is… in the 'tech' world it's just assumed you MUST be very near a programmer or willing to spend hours if not weeks or months learning to be proficient OR… don't complain. That's odd to me… Auto manufacturers don't expect you to understand every aspect of how an engine works… I was a farmer… I don't expect you to know how to 'tweak' and 'repair' my harvester before you sit down to dinner… why is this just taken for granted in the Tech World? iWeb, IMHO, was pretty darn 'brilliant' in NOT expecting you to overhaul your engine, or change out the bearings on a combine header….
SandVox, RapidWeaver, Freeway Express… while ALL good applications… require some major input on your part. So as I've said… I'm leaning RapidWeaver… you can change my mind, however. - JamesJM
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 6:03 PM (in response to hooktrunk)
Ethmoid is only partially right. iWeb will only work so long as Apple updates it to work on the current OS. I would be surprised if your wife is using Appleworks on a current computer running Snow Leopard. I have lots of software that used to work on PPC which never made the leap to Intel and therefore can't be used again except on my antique computers. Neither will a lot of modern software work on those old computers.
But despite the possibility that iWeb will cease to be a viable program at some future point many important features of iWeb will cease to work once Mobile Me turns off if the iWeb service is not transferred to icloud.
Ethmoid seems to be content with hosting an iWeb site on a third party server. He doesn't mind that it is a hobbled option. I would not be content with that. Several iWeb features do not work when published to another server. The hit counter does not work, password protection does not work, blog search does not work, and most importantly commenting does not work. The point of a blog and photo albums is to get customer feedback and interaction via comments on blog posts and photos. Maybe if it was just a personal blog it wouldn't matter but mine is a business web site and it is important for my income that all services remain intact otherwise I lose money. It is not like I have been using a free service. I have been paying top dollar to use the service and it is reasonable to expect responsibility to customers in that case. Since posting blog posts is no longer a one click option when hosting elsewhere the whole iWeb site becomes more trouble than it is worth and I then have to spend the 3 weeks or so it will take to build a completely new site on other software, and then suffer the drop in Google ranking while I make the necessary changes.
This is the second time Apple has cancelled a service that I used of theirs. No more. I can no longer trust that Pages will remain in place in a serious format for the next several years so I will be going back to Office and likely getting a PC next time I need to replace my computer. I cannot run my life around services and a computer system that is so capricious. Business needs certainty.
I think it is ironic that Steve Jobs made a joke about the Mobile Me debacle as if it was something he wasn't going to repeat and yet he doesn't realize that by not giving details and certainty to important services like iWeb and Photo Galleries that last more than 30 days he personally creates the next debacle but this time he can't blame someone else.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 6:08 PM (in response to Joeswell)
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 6:13 PM (in response to artistjoh)
Well, that's the thing, Artistjoh… the 'what's getting the axe next' thing that you, me, and several others, have mentioned. Why trust Apple software? Heck, I'm even wondering about hardware… how long do they keep making iMacs, Mac Pro's… they certainly want you going mobile and NOT sitting in an office or at home. But that's another issue.
Software, however, IS the issue. Like I mentioned before… if iWeb can go… so can iMovie, Page, Numbers, Keynote, iPhoto… and others. Do I really want to invest my time in those products knowing they can cut me off in a heartbeat and WITHOUT some type of transitional strategy?
iLife… interesting name considering what seems to be looming…. but Apple is apparently referring to a darn short Life. - JamesJM
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 7:00 PM (in response to Ric Donato)
I have to admit I was more than a little disappointed in your response. First, in a forum like this, I have always assumed that the "give and take" was an informal, almost conversational exchange of ideas, opinions, and answers. Second, in my opinion, in the context of that sentence, it is pretty clear that I am not referring to the state of Oklahoma. "OK" means "alright" or "not bad. The expression "OK" has been in use for many years and it's meaning is quite clear. As a teacher, I do not have the luxury of a personal secretary to proof read all my written correspondence, especially in posts in online forums.
I have a "pet peeve" too. In the context of today's political climate, as a teacher, I have become very sensitive to what I perceive are "cheap shots" at teachers. I would also take issue with your assertion that the skills of today's students are "atrocious." These types of comments may sound great on talk radio or at a tea party meeting, but cannot be verified with facts. I believe your comments are based on what is called "anecdotal evidence." I do not find it to be true that the majority of new high school and college graduates basic lack writing skills. What most young folks lack is "experience." That is not the same as not having the skills needed to function effectively as part of their employment.
In the Gospel of John, Chapter 8 - Verse 7, Jesus says,"Let He Who Is Without Sin Cast The First Stone." I find the morality and ethics of many folks in the business community appalling. The financial disaster that has so negatively impacted our country's economy recently was caused in a large part by unscrupulous, unethical, and illegal behaviors by the folks in the business and financial sectors of our economy. I would suggest that honestly and personal integrity may be more important than grammar.
Since all I wanted to say was that I preferred to use iWeb for my class website and I was unhappy with the demise of Mobile Me. In the context of this forum, I believe that your comments were off topic.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 7:04 PM (in response to JamesJM)
If you are going to learn to use another program then RapidWeaver is an excellent choice. I am very familiar with and use regularly DreamWeaver, Komposer, RapidWeaver, TypePad, and iWeb. I have various sites usually somewhere between 12 and 20 active websites at any given time and I am one of these odd balls who actually likes code because it is so logical.
You should perhaps look into SquareSpace. Great templates, great modular system for building sites, and hosting included. http://www.squarespace.com/ It would be the quickest option for you.
RapidWeaver is cheap to buy and has the advantage of a huge community making plugins etc for it. It may seem difficult at first but you would soon get the hang of it. I would regard it as dead easy compared to some alternatives. Forget DreamWeaver. It is better left as a professional tool for complex projects. I have it on my computer but do most of my work in Kompozer - it is a great little program really easy to use and can do 95% of everything possible and I just use DW for those odd jobs which require it. I hate the program, and steer clear of it unless I have to use it.
RapidWeaver or SquareSpace are better ways for you to go.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 8:00 PM (in response to artistjoh)
Much appreciated Artistjoh…. as I mentioned, I'm leaning that way. I like the 'community' involved in the project and I have found plugins for nearly everything I've wanted to address those things that didn't work 'as is'… except blogging - although it may… I'm still exploring it.
I have used Kompozer.. although a long time ago… I remember it fondly, however.
You basically hit on the right considerations I'm making… whichever I choose I'm going back to school… and if I'm going to do that then I want something well supported, good community support, and I'm willing to accept that 'it's easy' once you know it because I haven't heard a single person say otherwise. You'll have to excuse my 'testing the water' jitters. - JamesJM
Currently Being ModeratedJun 16, 2011 9:05 PM (in response to artistjoh)
No, seriously. I have an Intel imac running Snow Leopard and Appleworks6 works on it. We have old files we occasionally need to open up and she still actually composes stuff on it, amazingly. I think you are right however that as an unsupported program for the internet it might be dangerous to use security wise if all this supposition about iweb is true. I am going to wait and see what Lion does for us in July.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 17, 2011 12:27 AM (in response to artistjoh)
A small update. This evening I was doing some more comparisons… taking a task I wanted accomplished then trying them in the various applications… I've given up on Freeway Express… I don't get it, at all…. that leaves:
RapidWeaver and SandVox. This evening I made discoveries using both… and really came to like SandVox. It is so much easier than RapidWeaver. There are two things about SandVox that are giving me grave doubts, however…. very few themes and absolutely NO way around using one of them… with very little, if any, modifications. I can't even use my own image in the header. Also, very few plugins, that I've seen anyway.
Same problem with RapidWeaver BUT… I think a little more 'modification' ability and certainly FAR more themes available counting 3rd parties. RapidWeaver has this… plugins for nearly everything… that's a huge plus. I HATE, however, the editing page. Edit then preview, then tweak tweak tweak tweak tweak… granted, I would, hopefully, get by that when I'm more proficient but like it? Never. While trying to do a very simple thing, (in iWeb anyway), wrapping text around an image… I somewhat struggled with both SandVox and RapidWeaver… but much more so with RapidWeaver. That's when I made an interesting discovery….
This won't be 'news' to any of you, I'm sure, but it surprised me. Opening up my iWeb and copying my text, lists, images WITH wrapping, (various objects), I could paste them into RapidWeaver and it worked… from what I saw, almost perfectly. Same with SandVox… WOW… create in iWeb then copy and paste… it's not that bad of a solution… until I learn all the ins and outs of whichever other application I choose.
Yes, of course, I know. If the 'copy and paste' works from iWeb then you don't need iWeb… it can be done within those two applications…. but it's still a very quick and easy fix until I learn a 'new' way. - JamesJM
Currently Being ModeratedJun 17, 2011 1:23 AM (in response to JamesJM)
Isn't it strange James, I have gone through the same process as you, albeit not as thorough, like a film if it doesn't grab me in the first 5 minutes . I hated RapidWeaver but I like Freeway Express.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 17, 2011 1:43 AM (in response to Joeswell)
First sorry for the spelling I am dislex....
Hi there the easey answer to the first part of your post is KEEP USING iWeb but STOP using mobil me.
iWeb CAN plublish to the computer your using hears how:-
1: Open "System Preferences"
2: in "System Preferences" open "Sharing"
3: in "Sharing" tick "Web Sharing" it will show you the information you will need to look/use the pages you make in iWeb but perhaps it looks a bit strange "http://n.n.n.n/~user" where n=number I would user "http://localhost/~user" where user=your username. Put the "http" line into a webbrowser and up comes the default page.
4: Make you pages in iWeb as you normaily do but on the side bar that has all your pages you will see the toppage has a icon of the globe if you chous that page/icon the "Site Publishing Settings" page comes up. The first pull down menu has "Mobile Me", "FTP Server" and "Local Folder" chose "Local Folder"
4a: If your version of iWeb dose not have this then you will need to upgrade to iWeb 3 whitch I think is in iLife 8
5: Once you chose "Local Folder" goto "Folder Location" can chose "/Users/your-username/Sites"
6: Website URL set to "http://localhost/~/your-username"
7: Publish Site
8: Yepy you can view your site.
I hope this helps.
P.S. you could use any host and the FTP settings in iWeb
Currently Being ModeratedJun 17, 2011 1:57 AM (in response to artistjoh)
Look, firstly, do not make sweeping statements with lots of assumptions on your part about me that are incorrect.
Next, iWeb 09 has been updated to work with Intel Mac's, which is why it works on Snow Leopard. iWeb 06 will not work with Intel Mac's but only with Power Mac's, so as an app, iWeb will still work with Lion, being of the same ilc.
Yes, I am also perfectly happy to host my site built using iWeb on an external server and have done this for a long time. As I have a business website I have never hosted it on MobileMe because as I have said before, MobileMe was never intended for business sites, but personal sites, which is why external hosts offer more in that way for businesses such as databases etc.
I do have a hit counter on my site and it was added via an html snippet from one of the companies that provide hit counters.
I do have a blog attached to my site, but it is not an iWeb blog. I use a WordPress blog and as I have a domain name and hosting I have uploaded WordPress.org to my server so my blog is http://www.domain.com/Blog. I have also designed my blog in WordPress to look very much like my site using the same colours so that you would not know that it was any different. People can leave as many comments on my blog as they want to with no restrictions, unless I want to disallow the comments.
As my site is for business, I have no reason for password protection, so visitors can look at all pages.
I have photos in my site but have no need for photo albums or for comments on the photos - I am not a photographer so don't need this kind of site. I use photos on my site to enhance it and to break up text and for no other reason than this.
I have worked round all the things that I need to on my site and I am very happy with it and I am happy with external hosting because it is a business site and everything works. As I am proficient with html and css I even have a drop down menu integrated into my site.
There is nothing that I cannot do with iWeb that I have ever want to and I am very happy with the external hosting.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 17, 2011 1:59 AM (in response to JamesJM)
Here is one more for you to have a look at and try - WebAcappella. There is a download that can be obtained from http://www.webacappella.fr and apparently it is the closest to iWeb that you will get.