Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 2:46 AM (in response to Jonny Apple Seed)
Jonny Apple Seed wrote:
OSX Lion is more show then go in my opinion to date. It's unnecessary animations and irritating iphone gestures that are not the direction Mac users are looking for.
I have to agree with this. If I wanted an iPhone or an iPad, I'd buy one. I don't; I want a MacBook Pro, and I'd like my MBP to behave like a computer, not an "iGadget".
Yes, Lion is a bit faster than SL. And I haven't had as many problems as some users have. But still, I'm not really sure what Lion adds other than the slight speed boost. Other than that, it's a lot of features that I won't use/find irritating. Launch Pad is OK I guess, but it's nothing spectacular.
IMO of course.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 3:14 AM (in response to Kittenmommy)
I could not agree more with this comment. Running Lion for two weeks now on my Macbook Pro nothing special and not quicker, mail was ruined and is now incredibly slow, DVD freezes and I have wifi problems. Safari is quicker but I use Chrome because of the automatic translation. I have an Ipad and Iphone and the ease of use should be commended, but my computer now feels like a toy for the first time and I have been using macs for 14 years. SL had a much more proffessional feel about it. Change back is an option but we will all have to progress with Lion at some stage so no point. The look and feel of this OS is toy like and I hope it is changed in the future. My opinion stay with SL unti you really have to change.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 3:24 AM (in response to Timothy Rock)
Timothy Rock wrote:
I'm afraid I have to agree with techcafe. People should be allowed to dislike Lion without being berated.
I totally agree -- but I think what those who love Lion and who are having no problems with the OS find annoying are are comments "Lion is like a toy OS" or "This is Apple's Vista!!"
I mean we're using and enjoying Lion so such comments just don't ring true to us. Especially true for me because I've found Lion has improved my work flow. I'm learning new tricks/features almost daily.
So when someone just dismisses Lion across the board some folks want to come up for air. I've been quite excited about Lion since installing it and this is coming from somone who opted out on the iphone and the ipad because they simply have no place in my life/workstyle. My MBP is generally glued to me hip so both devices ar somewhat redundant.
If Lion had diminished my MPB in the slghtest way I would be here screaming the loudest.
As it is I've been reading the Lion-rage and the hate and left scratchign my head (and feeling fortunate that my upgrade was mostly positive.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 3:50 AM (in response to Jolly Blackburn1)
I have no problem with what you say Jolly. I didn't have that many problems with Lion while I was running it. I just didn't like it. For what I do with my iMac and MBP, it had little to offer. I was hoping for more. The question for this thread is pretty simple. So people can answer yes or no and tell why they feel that way. No one is asking these clowns to pontificate or butt in after someone has let their feelings known. If respondents want to sing the praises of Lion, that's fine. If someone wants to berate Apple and Lion, that's fine. But quit berating the respondents. The people who are having problems with Lion for whatever reason get just as annoyed as those who aren't. Just read it.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 4:47 AM (in response to Timothy Rock)
You are right, people shouldn't be berated. But the very fact that someone has posted in here means you are looking for a response! So don't get upset when people respond like I do, where I ask questions and try to help.
You'll notice that the TOPIC of this thread is a question, so I agreem people are free to state their case.
But when they say wildly ridiculous things, like how installing Lion deleted all their very valuable Final Cut data, and that NO ONE should install Lion because they will lose all their data, too, well... that is where I step in.
People who are considering their first mac purchase come In these forums, and I do my part to make sure they at least get the other side--the truth.
I don't make assumptions, I provide references and testimony from other users.
And most of all--I HELP. That is, after all, what these forums are about.
For people who just want to vent to the world and get no response, there is FACEBOOK and TWITTER for that.
This forum is a community of users to help us get the most out of our systems, and learn from each other.
Finally, and this OS tangential, I cannot for the life of me figure out why people are going on about a "toy OS"
Lion can be configured to behave just like Snow Leopard for 98% of people and their preferences. That's pretty darned amazing , considering how many users there are. There are quite a number of security features and usability enhancements that make Lion an VERY worthy upgrade.
There are TWO items being introduced to Mac OS from the success of iOS on iPad and iPhone--and that's the new scrolling paradigm and the launchpad. Launchpad is CLEARLY to help people who are new to Mac OS and for those who haven't used computers but are coming to mac because they enjoy iOS, it's great for them.
Those of use who DO know what we are doing never have to use or even SEE it. Just drag it off the dock. The new scrolling method (I actually used it for a day and now it feels natural so I've left it on) can be turned off with a check-box.
Now I've been using computers every day for 28 years, mostly PC, but have always used and come to appreciate Mac OSmore over time. I don't think it's been dumbed down, so I don't know where all these folks get off with all their righteous indignation about this being a "TOY OS". People, if you understood more, you'd go tweak settings and get things the way you want them--like other power users do. The only new feature that I'm not sure how to turn off is versions, and there is no reason to be peeved by it.
Lion is NOT a toy OS, and it's already serving at the heart of my media production business very well. It's running on my DAW and edit/scoring bay quite very well.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 4:56 AM (in response to Mike 2)
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 4:58 AM (in response to jarturoe)
I like the look and functionality of Lion, agree with posts that advise waiting a few months before installing. Here's why:
1. NO MORE FRONT ROW.....
2. No Power PC support - goodbye WINDOWS MEDIA PLAYER capability, goodbye EPSON DIRECT PRINT CD, Trouble with MS OFFICE.
Sweet Murphy, I've had a hard time having to find workarounds for all of these, but they are out there, just have to search for them. Kind of ANGERED AT APPLE for doing this though with no real notice to their HUGE and exponentially growing Mac fan base out there.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 5:03 AM (in response to Sunny Kaura)
You can't hold on to the past. If you insist on staying on SL for Power PC programs you are going to be so far behind in a few years when new programs require Lion.
And Office works fine if you don't have an ancient version.
By the way, SL does not support MacWrite, you should have never got rid of your Apple II.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 5:04 AM (in response to techcafe)
Did you install Snow Leopard with no problems? Did you try downloading the Lion installer again?
If you are receiving lots of error messages during the process, then you clearly have data corruption or hardware failure.
I have installed Lion, as an upgrade on a machine with lots of software and peripherals, on 5 machines, with no problems at all. This includes hardware from the past year, as well as the VERY LOWEST spec machine that Lion will run on--a first generation Core 2 Duo 1.8 Mac Mini with 2GB of RAM and dual monitors. All software, including ALL of the Pro Aps still work, as they do on a late-08 unibody MacBook Pro 2.53 with 8GB of RAM--in fact it made the MBP MUCH faster, quantifiable in boot times as well as a couple benchmarks.
Have you tried to find solutions to your problems?
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 5:14 AM (in response to tromba25)
Have you tried removing and re-installing iMovie '09?
Have you tried using the "optimize Media" command?
What format is this footage in? Was it acquired from DV, AVCHD, or some time of mpeg? If so, have you tried re-importing the footage from the original media?
Do you have ANY third-party codecs installed? Possibly Perian? Update each one. If no update is available, remove them and check again.
Have you tried signing in as another user and accessing the footage from a shAred location? This could point to corrupted settings in your user /Library folder, or preferences.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 5:18 AM (in response to Landrix)
But the very fact that someone has posted in here means you are looking for a response!
Well, followning your own logic, let me give you the response you are apparently looking for.
People tend to signal their desire for a response with a question mark, as did the OP. A lot of people have given their response to that question. It doesn't follow that they too are looking for a response. Yours and others unwanted denials and objections to their responses are nothing other than an attempt to counter their views and to re-assert your own opinion.
Moreover, this thread is not a typical support forum discussion. The OP was clearly trying to gain an overview of other people's experience, not look for a definitive answer to a technical question. Your self-confessed "altruistic" motivation to help the intellectually challenged figure out whether other responses are valid by shining the light of your own inner wisdom on each and every response that doesn't fit in with your opinion isn't what the OP, or anyone else, requested.
Do you recommend Lion or not? If you've already answered that question, then anything else you post in here is just self-indulgence and off-topic. Such is the nature of online discussion forums, but let's not pretend you're involved in some great service to the Apple community here.
Yes, by my own logic, this post is self-indulgent, off topic and does not seek a response. With that settled, perhaps we could now let people post their own responses to the question without unwelcome interference.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 5:22 AM (in response to Jonny Apple Seed)
There is no reason for you to use these "irritating iPhone gestures."
There is obviously something wrong with your installation--those startup times are not normal even for the lowest supported specs.
Have you run out of hard drive space? You need 15-20% of your drive free (minimum) for OS to perform properly. This is in all MAC OS versions documentations.
When you start, hold the option key, then select the "Recovery" option. This will boot a hidden Lion OS partition installed on your machine by Lion for troubleshooting. Does the machine start up more quickly in Recovery?
If so, you need to examine the startup items deep within OS X.
Unless you have data corruption in your installation media or your hardware is failing, then your problem can be remedied by installing Lion on a freshly formatted drive. After installation, you can THEN easily migrate your applications, user folder, and all your settings.
Did you ever post the specs of your machine?
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 5:31 AM (in response to Landrix)
When I see post making patently false statements ('Lion ate my data!', 'Lion caused my hard drive to fail!', 'Lion made my system unbootable/unusable/slow!', etc.) I tend to reply, asking for more information on a point-by-point basis. In the vast majority of such cases I don't expect a reply from the person who made the original post, and indeed I almost never get one in those cases. In a few of those posts I think the poster was actually sincere and not just trolling, and in those I usually get a response... and in some cases can offer a fix for the problem.
I personally do not use Lion, and will be using Snow Leopard for an extended period, because of certain very real problems with Lion, including the lack of Rosetta (which will never be back, so the only thing I can do would be to replace any PPC software and any hardware which relies on PPC drivers) and the lack of proper communications with WinServer 2003 Active Directory Domains (there are numerous problems, in various stages of being fixed, mostly due to Lion's new SMBX SMB stack, which is a work in progress and which probably will be made to work properly sooner or later) and my dislike for Resume, Autosave, and Versions (which also won't ever go away, so if I ever go to Lion I'll just have to like 'em or lump 'em), plus a few other items.
Lion does not destroy your data.
Lion does not destroy your hard drive.
Lion does not cause directory problems, though it may reveal a pre-existing directory problem.
Lion does not slow down your Mac... if you have sufficient RAM (4 GB is the practical low limit) and if you let mds finish indexing your system.
Lion does make your Mac into a monochrome system which can be harder to use than Snow Leopard because all the useful color cues have been deleted.
Lion does use more RAM, especially thanks to the new Safari (which can be retrofitted to Snow Leopard and Windows, and which uses too much RAM in SL and Windows, too, so this isn't strictly a Lion problem, it's a Safari problem).
Lion does render some older software and hardware unusable, because those items rely on Rosetta and Rosetta's gone.
Lion does have potential security holes in the form of Resume and Autosave and Versions. You can turn Resume off, but so far as I know there's no way to turn the other two off. This is, in my opinion, a mistake. Apple disagrees. My opinion on the matter counts for exactly as much as the opinion of anyone else posting here: absolutely nothing. (Some people seem to have a problem with that fact. That's a pity, as facts don't care whether you like them or not. They just are, and there is nothing you can do about it.)
And, oh, Lion costs $30 (unless you have a way to get it for free; I got a perfectly legal copy for free) and you can, if you want to, get your $30 back... if you go about it the right way. Ranting and raving on one of Apple's forums about how bad Lion is is NOT the right way. At least two people on this thread have suggested the right way. If someone wants a refund, they can look it up... or not. I'm way past the point of giving a **** anymore, so they'll be on their own. But as it's on the thread and I found it without problems, they can bloody well look for themselves. Or not. Their choice.
And it is simple to remove Lion... if you have a backup. And, if you don't have a backup, well stupidity is its own reward. And that is another fact that some posters here have a problem with. How sad. Too bad. I still have old floppy backups for my beige G3, and I've long since tossed floppy backups for older Macs I no longer have. I also still have floppy backups for a WinBox about as old as the beige. I've been backing up, to floppy, optical disk, tape, and external hard drive for literal decades, because I don't want to lose my data and I know that if it's not backed up it will die. Anyone who doesn't have a backup will get burned sooner or later, and will get absolutely no sympathy from me. Backing up should be part of everyone's normal operational procedure. Apple has made it simple to back up. There's no excuse for not having a backup. None.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 5:32 AM (in response to Sunny Kaura)
Look..I understand your frustration, but PowerPc apps ran like crap anyway.
But look, you can't say there was no real notice.
It has been OVER FOUR YEARS AGO since Apple said they were moving to intel. About 5 years!
Rosetta was created to give program makers a way to keep using PowerPC software by translating it (hence the name ROSETTA).
If you want to be angry, put it were it belongs: on EPSON, on Office, on blah blah blah, because they have had almost FIVE YEARS to make simple upgrades to their software to make it compatible. The Blame is NOT Apple's. We have been hearing since SEPTEMBER LAST YEAR that Lion would NOT have Rosetta/PowerPC app capability.
Currently Being ModeratedAug 4, 2011 5:40 AM (in response to Sunny Kaura)
1. NO MORE FRONT ROW.....
yep. It's dead.
2. No Power PC support - goodbye WINDOWS MEDIA PLAYER capability,
Talk to Microosft about that, they had years to fix that.
goodbye EPSON DIRECT PRINT CD,
Talk to Epson about that.
Trouble with MS OFFICE.
Most of Office 2008 and 2011 work without major problems, and the rest, well, talk to Microsoft about the problems. It's not Apple's fault if Microsoft and Epson screw up.