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3296 Views 14 Replies Latest reply: Jan 27, 2012 10:30 PM by MAC ATTACKED RSS
pvcooper Level 1 Level 1 (20 points)
Currently Being Moderated
Aug 8, 2011 10:36 AM

I have now done timing tests between a samba client on osx and a LINUX based NAS and on a fully 1Gbit Cat 6 all switches fully 1GBIT the speed performance to open a share is 2X as long on lion vs Snow Leopard. The file transfer of a 2Gbit file is 20% slower. Smaller files because of the Client not taking advantage of the various features in SAMBA is up to 30% slower. Please Apple tell us people who communicate using SMB and SAMBA to and from Microsoft networks why we should put up with this degredation. Tell us the truth. I use GPL licenses in the software, I ship to businesses and pay nothing. I will revert to snow leopard as well. Everybody on this list should know and I will spread the word that if you use microsoft or samba machines, apple has no solid upgrade fot you at this point and to stay away from Lion.


I love the full screen iOS like features but they should not have been packaged with this pi** poor Walmart version of microsoft networking IMNSHO.  I have 32+ years in Software Development, Some in the original SAMBA implementatopns. It looks to me like the Team who replaced SAMBA missed things and/or did not test the performance. This is probably why only some people seem to have speed problems with lion. If you are at home and only have apple machines using the AFP (Apple File Protocol) then you may find no speed problems (I have not done an exhustive test), however if a the replaced SAMBA client and/or

server software produced by pple gets involved you may see significant degradation. The first share on a machine is horrinly slow. I am faced with mounting shares leaving them open as long as possible along with coping files to edit to my desktop instead of editing them on the SAMBA share. These are actions I shiould not have to take.


Restore Mircosoft Networking performang. It is so bad I may refotmat my drive and remove lion on at least 2 machines. I see no excuse for this beign thrust upon loyal apple Apple users. I belierve that the legal restrictions may be outweighed by the poor SMB omplementation. Only time will tell. Hoe much will apple loose if their first attempt at iOS integration crashes and burns like VISTA.


                    -- The pastor of the church of no opinion. :-(

  • baltwo Level 9 Level 9 (59,145 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 8, 2011 10:52 AM (in response to pvcooper)

    Ranting here serves no useful purpose, since these are user-to-user forums. If you want to report this issue to Apple's engineering, send a bug report or an enhancement request via its Bug Reporter system. To do this, register as an Apple Developer—it's free and available for all Mac users and gets you a look at some development software. Since you already have an Apple username/ID, use that. Once a member, go to Apple BugReporter and file your bug report or enhancement request. You'll get a response and a follow-up number; thus, starting a dialog with engineering.

    27" i7 iMac 10.6 , Mac OS X (10.7), G4 450 MP 1.5 GB RAM w/(10.5.8/10.4.11/9.2.2)
  • etresoft Level 7 Level 7 (23,865 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 8, 2011 11:04 AM (in response to pvcooper)

    In all likelihood, Apple focused their testing on genuine Windows file servers. All bets are off about Apple's reimplementation of SMB working with someone else's reimplementation of SMB. There may be some specific combination of client and server settings to make it work better - maybe not.


    It is pretty clear that Apple will not touch anything GPLv3 like recent versions of Samba. For Apple to go through the hassle of reimplementing it shows they know how important it is. They aren't rewriting Bash after all. It is going to take some time before Apple's version of SMB is as robust as Samba that has been under development and worldwide test for many years. I'm sure Apple didn't undertake this decision lightly. In Apple's legal opinion, the GPLv3 license is unacceptable - and Apple will take on anybody in the courtroom.


    You are free to download and install the latest version of Samba if you want. I'm sure many people would appreciate it in the true spirit of open-source. Just check with your lawyers before shipping it to anyone if you own any patents.

  • deggie Level 8 Level 8 (44,795 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 8, 2011 11:06 AM (in response to baltwo)
  • deggie Level 8 Level 8 (44,795 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 8, 2011 11:39 AM (in response to pvcooper)



    1 Infinite Loop
    Cupertino, CA 95014



    But posting here to other users will do nothing.

  • Alan Edinger Level 4 Level 4 (1,615 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 13, 2011 2:06 PM (in response to pvcooper)

    1.     Since you have all this development experience and worked on some of the original SAMBA implementations, why don't you just compile your own tool set and load it up.


    2.     I hope you are also posting these thoughts over at Microsoft for Windows 7, XBox, since they them selves are so fond of SMB working correctly.

  • Alan Edinger Level 4 Level 4 (1,615 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 13, 2011 3:07 PM (in response to pvcooper)

    I made no pretense that it was a snap, easy or even straight forward.


    I did level the playing field philosophically in that you are a victim of an action and are blaming the worng party, and very heavily.


    But even you understand that Microsoft is swift at crippling their own systems, so thank you for that acknowledgement. But the culpret is more than that, in so much as the holder of the SAMBA keys has retracted its availability.


    As for searching for a Snow Leopard machine, if you have the disk space, why don't you just partition out your deive and install Snow Leopard and boot to that for research?



  • davidh Level 4 Level 4 (1,890 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 7, 2011 1:32 PM (in response to pvcooper)

    Apple can't just ignore the licensing terms - required terms of use as put in place by Samba.or for use of any current version of Samba.


    The old versions of Samba that Apple had beed using do not support Windows Vista nor - especially - Windows 7 for domain-style accounts (anything other than basic filesharing, ie, no domain-style profiles hosted on the server). That incompatibility was fixed in a version of Samba that Apple *can't* use.


    You don't have to like it, and I'm sure Apple would love for Samba to loosen their requirements, but it hasn't happened yet and isn't likely to.


    So rail against and complain to Samba instead of Apple. Changing this isn't in Apple's power to fix alone, wish it though you/one/we might.

  • MAC ATTACKED Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 27, 2012 10:30 PM (in response to pvcooper)

    Agreed.  Apple doesn't sell software so it has no investment in whether or not it works.  It is in the business of selling hardware and licenses to use entertainment media.  I can't say my first experience has been a good one.  I have no personal investment in MAC.  I stumbled upon my MacBook Pro because I was tired of buying poorly constructed HP, DELL, ACER and Toshiba laptops.  I have found Lion to have a lot of excentricities that are not intuitive (to me) as well as a few allarming security issues.  All I can say is that my MacBook does make a great Win 7 machine and I am content to use it as such.  I cannot find any advantage to using Lion over Windows 7.    


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