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Lion - Horrible MacBook Pro Battery Life

550475 Views 2,725 Replies Latest reply: Dec 5, 2013 6:55 AM by Nickofari RSS Branched to a new discussion.
  • Rayced Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
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    Jan 18, 2012 6:53 AM (in response to Csound1)

    Csound1 wrote:

     

    Rayced wrote:

     

    Csound1 wrote:

    Do you think we are stupid? files have names!

     

    Right! Even my flying cows have a name.

    I am sure that you have spent much time with your flying cows, that you give them names does not surprise me.

    Of course! They're cute! And it's better than making fake statistics to try to prove my ideas as you do.

  • Rayced Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
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    Jan 18, 2012 6:59 AM (in response to Franc_Iphone)

    Franc_Iphone wrote:

     

    As some may know, I've been working with Apple/Engineering for about 6 weeks. After about 4 days now, of "fixing" my LION MACBOOK pro according to Apples instructions, I am now getting 7-8 hours of usage (double what I was getting). I have actually seen, in full idle mode, my battery life show as much as 13hrs and 12mins!! Apple engineering helped identify at least 2 "drivers" that were running on my machine, consuming huge amounts of battery life but not showing up anywhere (that I could see). They sent me, and I ran, their capture program that gave them low level details of what my machine was doing. They gave me instructions to remove and hey presto. 5 momths of pain, fixed for me in 15 mins in the end!

     

    I asked Apple if there was anyway I could have found these "hidden" drivers and they didn't think so, not easiliy at least. Although deleting all the startup drivers/old programs fully, would ensure it too!

     

    Apple also acknowledged that some programs, that have not been optimized for LION, actually perform worse (Battery life) under LION. I suspect Apple will work on trying to make the OLD code calls more efficient (or at least, not worse) or put out a bulletin to *ALL* MAC developers to quickly tweak their code! We shall see.

     

    I know some of you say you do not have any "legacy" programs running, but if you've ever inserted a USB device and loaded a driver, you may! Or some piece of garbage, maybe came down from the web, or whatever.. I just dont know. Anyway, in my case it was a driver from a USB drive *AND* a driver from a USB 3G stick! After removing both of these, I went from 4 hours to double that. And it's been like that now for 4 days. I've had this MAC from new (but migrated from my old machine).

     

    I am currently typing this with safari, mac mail, google music, dropbox and a number of other programs and showing 4hrs:41 remaining at 55%. I can point now to at least 10 or so other programs that will still kill my battery when they are running. I suspect the developers need to be told of the legacy code problems under LION.

     

    What does this have to do with any GUI and Gfx Cards?

  • Franc_Iphone Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
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    Jan 18, 2012 7:10 AM (in response to Rayced)

    Rayced, you tell me. Did running GFXcardstatus impact the demon drivers positively as well? So, once I removed the drivers, I saw significant battery increase without having to run gfxcardstatus, as I said. However, when running a number of other programs on my machine, it still helps improve my battery life when I run GFXcardstatus. There are a lot of moving parts and multiple things going on here. The good news is as I've repeated, that smarter people than us, (Apple Engineering) are working on it.

  • chipmason Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
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    Jan 18, 2012 7:34 AM (in response to Rayced)

    There are no absolutes here, because the issue is not yet understood or solved by Apple (or us users either). Therefore, there isn't *one* solution, including SCM reset, running GFXcardstatus or anything...well aside from reinstalling Snow Leopard.

     

    What is intriguing and hopefully helpful for Apple is all these things seem to help, a bit, but often temporarily. I have found GFXcardstatus useful not because it does anything to improve battery life itself, but because it tells me when the discrete graphics are running, something that will KILL battery life for sure. In Snow Leopard, on battery, only Photoshop would do this, so I didn't run Photoshop on battery or at least didn't let it run unless I needed it. Now with GFXcardstatus, I see when something requests the discrete graphics, I can kill that app, or use GFXcardstatus to force integrated graphics.

     

    I still get 4 hours life on battery, where GFXcardstatus has improved it perhaps to 'real' four hours perhaps up one hour.

     

    Note that if you have a 13" Macbook pro, this will be useless for you, this is only useful for Macbook's with discrete graphics.

  • enriquep Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 18, 2012 8:45 AM (in response to Michael Empric)

    Hi, I'm new here and thanks to this thread I realized that it was the update to OSX lion was causing my horrible battery life (I have a 15" mid 2010 MacBook Pro). Thanks to your suggestions I have done a few things that have helped a lot:

     

    1. Reset PRAM
    2. Kill all unnecesary startup applications
    3. Disable Sync between Outlook calendar and Calendar (Syncservicesagent process was taking A LOT of CPU capacity)
    4. Use GFX Cardstatus to monitor the graphics card in use

     

    So far, I've gone from 2 hours of battery life to 6 hours which seems to be in the "acceptable" range (at least for me).

     

    I hope Apple takes care of this soon with a more certain and permanent fix.

  • Redarm Level 4 Level 4 (2,565 points)
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    Jan 18, 2012 9:15 AM (in response to Franc_Iphone)

    Franc_Iphone wrote:

     

    Redarm; I looked at the package and the unix program is called Capture Data. The ACCD most likely stands for something like Apple Capture ? Data. I looked at the data it captures and there's about 100+ detailed bullets under such as ; File System Usage; Packet traces; Time Machine; Mail;Bluetooth;crash reports; logs;nidump;io reg (gets kit registry info);kextstatl;drutil; and much much more..

    Hm, thanks.  Seems to be a collection of all sorts.  Nothing specific, which seems to suggest they're looking for something in common (if more people were approached) or a combination of things and can't put a finger on something yet.

  • rmatullo Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 18, 2012 1:08 PM (in response to Michael Empric)

    Finally got around to calling Apple about this and they said my MBP 15" Late 2011 with Lion pre-installed had a flag on it, and after doing an SMC reset they kicked me up a tech support level. I've never been kicked up so quickly and easily, so I took it that there is an obvious problem with this unit.They offered to replace the computer itself ASAP, but being a fixer, I resisted, so they said I should at least get the battery tested. I opted for the test at an Apple Certified Dealer (they have to connect with Apple to do the test), and I saw the readout, everything was A O.K.

     

    I'll keep everyone updated as I move along.

     

    Note: the low level tech seemed to have an idea about it, but the upper level tech knew well that there is a serious issue/outright defect, or maybe apple just offers to replace all their units willy-nilly?

  • htmanning Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
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    Jan 18, 2012 1:20 PM (in response to rmatullo)

    Funny, I called Apple on the second day I had my MBP 15 and the rep said, "We can't help you with that.  Take it to an Apple Store and have them run a diagnostic on it."

  • Franc_Iphone Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 18, 2012 5:56 PM (in response to Michael Empric)

    So, for fun tonight and at 90% battery life, I did the following.

    Logged out and logged back in holding down the shift key.

    Immediately started GFXcardstatus. Set to integrated ONLY

    Then I started the following programs;

         Safari (This web site and another with known flash video running, and anohter playing a Youtube video)

         Mac Mail                                   Preview

         Adium                                        Itunes

         ICal                                            Face Time (Viewing my ugly mug)

         Ichat                                           Evernote

         Skype                                         Drop Box

         Address Book                              Google Music

         Iphoto                                          App Store

         AudioNote                                    Twitter

         TweetDeck                                   Word 2011, Powerpoint 2011, Outlook 2011, Excel 2011

         Chatter (Salesforce)                        Activity Monitor

         On WIFI                                           Half Brightness

     

    And my battery life, whilst typing these and all those programs running is 3 hours.

     

    There is meaning to this. Just running one or two of some of these older programs without GFX card status running would have dropped me to under 2 hours.

     

    This shows what this beast is REALLY capable of. And has been capable of for the last 6 months.

     

    I didn't think to try this since getting the updated seed program, removing the old Demon porgrams *and* running GFXcardstatus.

     

    So, I've been running these apps for about 15 mins and battery life has been consistent at around the 3 hours.

     

    I'm going to shut down GFXcard status and see what happens... Getting "better" all the time

  • Rayced Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 19, 2012 8:20 AM (in response to Franc_Iphone)

    Franc_Iphone wrote:

     

    Rayced, you tell me. Did running GFXcardstatus impact the demon drivers positively as well? So, once I removed the drivers, I saw significant battery increase without having to run gfxcardstatus, as I said. However, when running a number of other programs on my machine, it still helps improve my battery life when I run GFXcardstatus. There are a lot of moving parts and multiple things going on here. The good news is as I've repeated, that smarter people than us, (Apple Engineering) are working on it.

    Excuse me, you tell me what two USB device drivers (one of em for a 3g modem and the othe for a drive) have to do with the GPU, the GUI, or whatever. Cause these are the two items you mentioned at first as to be responsible of the battery drain on your laptop under Lion.

  • chipmason Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
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    Jan 19, 2012 8:38 AM (in response to Rayced)

     

    Excuse me, you tell me what two USB device drivers (one of em for a 3g modem and the othe for a drive) have to do with the GPU, the GUI, or whatever. Cause these are the two items you mentioned at first as to be responsible of the battery drain on your laptop under Lion.

     

    This is a very complex issue, and without understanding the OS X architecture, at first glance, it doesn't make sense: how can USB drivers mess up GUI or impact battery drain. The key to understanding how this might happen is to know that the Mach kernel supports key device drivers including I/O below the Core Services layer, such that problems with these can impact the entire system.

     

    This is well illustrated in Amit Sigh's book on the subject, and here is a link to a drawing of older versions of Mac OS X.

     

    http://osxbook.com/book/bonus/ancient/whatismacosx/arch.html

     

    While more recent versions of OS X have changed a bit, especially with respect to Cocoa vs Carbon, this gives a good visualization of how OS X is architected.

     

    Most of the Graphics elements sit very high level, so its likely that OS X has a fine degree of control of such things as GUI that write to Core Graphics or even OpenGL.  However, device drivers are very low, and applications that need access to them must request it thru Apple APIs (since Graphic services are several layers above Core Services which is above the Kernel. Frank_iphone has reported that there were changes in API behaviors in Lion that may have some impacts in this area, which makes sense.

  • enriquep Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 19, 2012 9:20 AM (in response to Franc_Iphone)

    Franc: I have a noob question for you. How do you remove faulty/obsolete drivers?

     

    Thanks!

  • Rayced Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 19, 2012 10:02 AM (in response to chipmason)

    chipmason wrote:

     

     

    Excuse me, you tell me what two USB device drivers (one of em for a 3g modem and the othe for a drive) have to do with the GPU, the GUI, or whatever. Cause these are the two items you mentioned at first as to be responsible of the battery drain on your laptop under Lion.

     

    This is a very complex issue, and without understanding the OS X architecture, at first glance, it doesn't make sense: how can USB drivers mess up GUI or impact battery drain. The key to understanding how this might happen is to know that the Mach kernel supports key device drivers including I/O below the Core Services layer, such that problems with these can impact the entire system.

     

    This is well illustrated in Amit Sigh's book on the subject, and here is a link to a drawing of older versions of Mac OS X.

     

    http://osxbook.com/book/bonus/ancient/whatismacosx/arch.html

     

    While more recent versions of OS X have changed a bit, especially with respect to Cocoa vs Carbon, this gives a good visualization of how OS X is architected.

     

    Most of the Graphics elements sit very high level, so its likely that OS X has a fine degree of control of such things as GUI that write to Core Graphics or even OpenGL.  However, device drivers are very low, and applications that need access to them must request it thru Apple APIs (since Graphic services are several layers above Core Services which is above the Kernel. Frank_iphone has reported that there were changes in API behaviors in Lion that may have some impacts in this area, which makes sense.

     

    Sure. And this has a lot to do with the GPU switch. Especially on those laptops having only the integrated one. Not to talk about the sleep mode battery drain.

  • milwaukee_bronze Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
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    Jan 19, 2012 1:27 PM (in response to Michael Empric)

    So it looks like some of you guys are still at each others throats about this issue...

     

    Great news that some of you have success with Drivers. - Can anyone explain where to look and how to remove them?  Did you see what the techs did?

     

    I only jumped on here to let you know that one of the key apps which bumped me into Discrete mode (as with all my posts, your mileage may vary) was Firefox.  It looks like with the 9.0.1 update, Firefox no longer makes enough demands to trigger the discrete card.  Integrated seems to be enough now!  Well done Firefox for resolving one facet to this conundrum.

     

    Still wondering if the long awaited 10.7.3 will bring resolution???  But guidance on the drivers would be greatly appreciated from anyone.

  • milwaukee_bronze Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
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    Jan 19, 2012 1:30 PM (in response to Redarm)

    Redarm wrote:

     

    The .dmg file (disk image) is a container and when mounted should have the "program" (Unix tool or command?) you've mentioned in it.  This program should have a name - that's what I'm after.

    And about the output - do you have an idea what ACCD stands for?  Can't find something meaningful (to me).

    Hi Redarm, He is correct!  The program is just called Capture Data.  It is contained within a DMG and outputs another DMG called ACCD.dmg containing all the log / other data the program captures from the machine.  It's exactly what they had me do all those months ago in November - 12th to be exact.

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