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Mainstage CPU spikes

15878 Views 111 Replies Latest reply: Oct 13, 2012 4:07 AM by tonwurm RSS
  • dhjdhj Level 2 Level 2 (160 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 30, 2012 10:59 AM (in response to Bobby Simons)

    One of the suggestions I made a long time ago was for MS to not preload ALL AUs for a concert. Instead, just load the AUs needed for the current patch and optionally (as an optimization in the background) for the next patch.

     

    That way, the whole notion of "Concert" can go away (at least within the confines of a single performance) and there would also be a significant improvement in memory management as only a few AUs would need to be loaded.

     

     

    However, not unsurprisingly, the silence has been deafening.

  • chiccorosso Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 30, 2012 11:49 AM (in response to dhjdhj)

    I wouldn't like such a change, since i don't sort my patches as the concert list, I jump back and forth as needed and so there's no "next patch".

     

    Seems also to me that while MS preloads everything, it's then swaps patches back and forth into memory resulting not only in a very quick patch change but also in the possibility to retain a patch sound while moving to the next one.

     

    You made a suggestion that had sense for you, but in crafting a software many variables comes into play.

     

    Respectfully, I don't think engineers and software designers should pass their time answering in forums, just reading them is enough.

  • dhjdhj Level 2 Level 2 (160 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 30, 2012 11:56 AM (in response to chiccorosso)

    Sigh --- it would be an option in preferences, not a complete design change. It's clearly not useful for people who need random access but it would be very useful for people who are following a setlist and would allow many more AUs to be accessed without running out of RAM

     

     

     

    To whom is this directed?

    -----------

    Respectfully, I don't think engineers and software designers should pass their time answering in forums, just reading them is enough.

  • Synthonia Level 1 Level 1 (35 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 31, 2012 6:39 AM (in response to lrizzo2001)

    I'm running mainstage 2.1.3  64 bit, together with Komplete 7

    more than 30 patches in 3 keyboards.... many layers and splits in each patch....

    I'm using mostly exs 24 - Es2 - massive - kontakt - sculpture - Fm8 for the arpeggiator...

    I'm changin patches very quick during my live performance because for each song I need at least 2 or 3 patches (intro - verse - chorus).

     

    No problem at all....

     

    I'm using a motu ultralite mk3 as audio interface

    midiman 4x4 for midi

    3 keyboards

    Korg O1 - M-audio axiom 61 - microkorg....  all of them connected to mainstage....

     

    No problem !!!!

  • chiccorosso Level 1 Level 1 (145 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 31, 2012 4:19 PM (in response to Synthonia)

    er... that's great cool and wonderful but... I would wait before upgrading to 2.2... ;-)

     

    2.1.3 used to be smoother for me, my set is slightly simpler then yours.

  • chiccorosso Level 1 Level 1 (145 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 31, 2012 4:28 PM (in response to dhjdhj)

    Sigh

    You said your opinion, i said mine. I strongly believe the two can live together without sighing...

    it would be an option in preferences, not a complete design change. It's clearly not useful for people who need random access but it would be very useful for people who are following a setlist and would allow many more AUs to be accessed without running out of RAM

    Being a software designer before being a musician, I'm not so sure about what you wrote.

    To whom is this directed? [...]

    my respectfull (towards you) consideration about engineers was an answer to your slightly sarcastic comment:

    "However, not unsurprisingly, the silence has been deafening."

     

    Now back to the real facts, not going to push this kind of discussion any further... really doesn't makes any sense.

     

    regards

     

    Enrico.

  • lrizzo2001 Level 1 Level 1 (25 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 1, 2012 5:10 AM (in response to Blueberry)

    I must still be subscribed to this forum,  and I came across your comment that

     

    "So far I have yet to hear from anybody who has these issues with MainStage 2.2, and this thread was started well before MainStage 2.2 was shipped"

     

    Are you serious?  you haven't heard from anybody having issues with MS2????

  • lrizzo2001 Level 1 Level 1 (25 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 1, 2012 5:20 AM (in response to dhjdhj)

    Bottom line is this,

     

    #1 This problem hasn't been fixed, and probably won't.

     

    #2 Apple doesn't seem to care about it because not enough users are having the problem, even though It seems

         that 50% or more of MS2 users are having issues, and the other % aren't having any issues, and it has

         nothing to do with hardware or 3rd party plugins, AU etc.

    #3 Apple says that their engineers monitor these forums all the time, and yet  I HAVEN'T HEARD FROM ONE OF

         THEM, nor have I heard any resonable explenation from anybody other than tweeking your buffer size, which is

         still just putting a tiny bandaid on a huge cut.

     

    This discussion has been going on for years and years and years, and i'm done spending my money to upgrade to lion, or ms2 or whatever else apple forces me to upgrade to just to find out that it still hasn't fixed the problem!

  • Bobby Simons Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 1, 2012 5:43 AM (in response to lrizzo2001)

    I am a fully commited Mainstage user, and should say I have rare issues that are far outwieghed by the awesome benefits. Nevertheless, my general concern regardng the future of MS is this: what will be the effect on this brilliant (but thawed) application now that it can be had for a measly 30 bucks in the app store? I bought the entire Logic shebang the day it was available with Mainstage - it was everything I wished someone would dream up, and then some. What the heck - I was already dragging my laptop around to use Garageband instruments onstage. THIS was what I needed. Anyway, my point is simple: will it get more attention now that they might generate many more users because of the price point, or less attention (if possible) now that it's a cheap app that doesn't make them much money?

    The future of Mainstage may not be clear, but there's no doubt in my mind that Mainstage (or something just like it) IS the future for us. For me, anyway.

  • dhjdhj Level 2 Level 2 (160 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 1, 2012 2:28 PM (in response to chiccorosso)

    It was not sarcastic --- it was quite factual --- a lot of people have expressed concerns for how Apple interacts (or actually doesn't) with users. See for example this new article:

     

    http://losingfight.com/blog/2012/01/30/our-engineers-are-aware-of-the-issue/

     

     

    ------

    my respectfull (towards you) consideration about engineers was an answer to your slightly sarcastic comment:

  • dingdangdawg Level 2 Level 2 (455 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 6, 2012 9:27 PM (in response to dhjdhj)

    I have spent untold hours trying to whip MainStage into a reliable performance solution, starting with version 1.0, all the way through 2.1.3. I learned its ins and outs, was active on this forum, and tried many channel strip configurations. In the end, I still had enough problems with CPU spikes and audio dropouts (using a MOTU Ultralite mk3 with a 2.4GHz MacBook) that I finally gave up. Its disconcerting to have this happen during a live solo performance, resulting in apologies to the audience, and a system reboot. I didn't want to give up; I had to.

     

    Interestingly, I have now found Logic Pro to be the ideal live performance software for my needs (I also experimented a lot with Live, Studio One V2, and Reaper. I would have preferred to use MainStage due to its ability to change patches that are customized for different songs/sets, but since using Logic Pro I have had no audio dropouts and no CPU spikes. Coincidence? I think not.

  • dhjdhj Level 2 Level 2 (160 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 10, 2012 4:11 AM (in response to Bobby Simons)

    Bought it a few days ago and just integrated it into my setup....you're right, it's very nice and I'm glad to see a standalone alternative to B4 whose demise I still don't understand.

  • Maddcow Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 11, 2012 4:38 PM (in response to PastorJon)

    I'd be interested to know why there's such a performance/resource usage difference between MainStage and Logic Pro (and other DAWs for that matter).  I used Ableton Live for a while and whilst it wasn't as well suited to live use as MainStage is for me, it never had resource issues.  Likewise with other DAWs I've tried....they mightn't have suited my needs for a live performance workstation like MainStage is supposed to, but MS certainly has a lot more resource issues.

     

    Can anyone shed some light as to why MS seems to have so many performance/resource problems compared to other DAWs?

  • dhjdhj Level 2 Level 2 (160 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 12, 2012 4:40 AM (in response to Maddcow)

    If that was known, the problem could be fixed. And by the way, it's not just MainStage. I've seen Logic Pro come to a sudden halt while playing a single audio track (with no AUs loaded) and just displaying the system overload dialog. Talk about killing the moment.

     

    Look, I love my Macs, I love that Apple just came out with an update for Final Cut that addresses pretty much all the concerns about Apple not caring about the pro market. I love the innovation that was MainStage.

     

    But for some reason, the issues with MainStage are still not being addressed. I've moved on (digital performer for DAW and my own custom build stuff for live use) and while I have no complaints with the growth of apple, I just hope to **** they don't decide they don't need the Mac anymore!

  • lohogan Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 16, 2012 10:33 AM (in response to Blueberry)

    I just got MS2.2.

    The overload is worse than MS2.1.3, and yes I checked the "looks like it's worse but it's not" bulletin from Apple.

    I used to "save as", and it appeared to improve the quality of the CPU spiking problem.

    This is what I've done to fix it recently:

    Install and test with OSX 10.6.6, 10.6.7, and 10.6.8. I haven't tried Lion.

    Install and test with MS 2.1.1, 2.1.2, 2.1.3, and 2.2. The problem hasn't gone away.

     

    Yes Blueberry, it is still an issue.

     

    My preference (which I have done in the past) is to run with 6 live processed microphones, and bass, rhodes, b3, acoustic guitar, strings, 8 channels of output (1,2 for me, 3,4 for house, 5,6 for subwoofer, 7,8 for live recording). I use an Infinite Response VAX77 (awesome keyboard), an Arturia 49, 3 rocker pedals, 2 damper style pedals, and a breath controller. (I sometimes think it would be amusing to put a seatbelt on my throne...) In earlier versions of this setup, I had some problems, but by the time I got up to MS2.1 it was running perfectly for a couple of years.

    Now, when I start the system up, for the first ten minutes while the processor is cold, everything is fine. Then it begins to slow down, and I go from 50% usage to over 100% and audio spikes.

     

    I observed that over time, my concerts tended to degrade because I was constantly changing and saving them. I reasoned that the saved file, which is a script programmed by the visual interface, was gradually becoming corrupt or loaded down with too much "undo" information. I had one concert that was 12mb, but when I cleaned it up by removing all the extra patches with performance information (like charts built in), the size dropped to about 2.5mb. Like I say, this used to help.

     

    Now things have gotten quite bad, and I can't rely on my system at all. FWIW, I've had three logic boards in my MBP 3.1. The first two failed from bad video, and the most recent one has the racing fan/overheat/crashing problem. At this point I took my MBP apart and cleaned up the old thermal paste and put on brand new thermal paste. Although it did make a positive difference, it hasn't fixed the slowing down and failing problem altogether in MS. When I close MS, the fans slow down, and the CPU cools off.

     

    Aside to dhjdhj, I've downloaded your files for MaxMSP, but the program is upwards of $500. Is there anything I can do? I'm using my system exclusively for ministry and teaching.

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