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Mar 1, 2012 10:31 AM in response to Leon Buijsby Snow Hound,Hello Leon, getting a new PS has been a real issue for me, first they sent the wrong PSU and then the replacement for that was damaged (the flange was bent so severely it wouldn't fit)- now they are sending another.
Regardless I did manage to get it plugged in to see if it would solve the problem, just couldn't get the side of the MacPro back on- it wouldn't close.
Bummer was it didn't make a difference.
I will try the new one being shipped now before giving up, but am not very hopeful. I may have one for sale myself if it doesn't improve things....they charge a $75 restocking fee!
After exhausting just about everything except the motherboard, which I am not going to replace- too much $ to spend on an older machine- then I'll hope for a new updated MacPro to become available_rumors are rampant it will be soon.
Yesterday my wife got an iMAC (7i, 3.4GHz, 16 GB ram, 2GB graphics card, etc) and I'm going to replace the SSD card slot port with an eSATA port and may replace the rumored 3GB/sec SSD drive Apple provided-couldn't get them to provide any specs, with a 6GB/sec drive twice the size.
Then if my MacPro dies before they come out with a new one, I'll have something to fall back on.
If I like it maybe I'll get one too.
Good luck with your new PSU, hope that does the trick for you!
PS: there is a video on the internet that explains how to remove the PSU but it is missing a step for some model(s)_ it sounds like you have already got yours out so you know this or didn't run into this issue, BUT for anyone who hasn't done this before... the video doesn't show that once you have the optical drive removed- depending on your exact model- may have to remove two screws holding a cover plate at the back of the bay- to get access to the cable PLUGS_which have to be unplugged before you can get the PSU out of its bay. After doing this a number of times I also found that removing any PCI cards in the top slots- if installed- makes removing the screws that seat the PSU- and getting them back in- much easier....
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Mar 1, 2012 10:58 AM in response to Snow Houndby Leon Buijs,Snow Hound,
- Yes I already found out about the 'extra' aluminium panel, ran into it but it was not hard to remove / put back.
- Over here, in the Netherlands, the PSU costs a lot more, and there are extra costs for consults and placement. Also, It would cost me a day to get to a service desk, have it done an get back.
- I am very interested in what you think of the current i7 iMac, because it's hard to find reviews of actual long-time Mac Pro users about the iMac. The 27' I assume? Could you mail me about it at leon at beeldbuijs dot nl? Maybe it's interesting enough to write a small article about it?
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Mar 1, 2012 11:58 AM in response to Leon Buijsby Snow Hound,Hello Leon,
Yes I can relate. I am in Alaska so sending out for repair isn't an option and there are no approved Apple repair centers in town, so we have to do our own.
Once you know the panel is there it is easy to remove but the video I watched showed the tech person pulling the PSU out and then unplugging the cables, where that wouldn't work for me. So I had to figure that out myself.
Taking a "time out" and enjoying a glass of wine seemed to do the trick for me...
I'll get back to you on the iMAC 7i 27" once I can get my wife out of the chair and can put it to some tests!
She really likes it but does mostly graphics and 2D work, I do high res photos, video and some 3D so will make it work a little harder.
I don't enjoy taking them apart though. All the parts are crammed into such a small space- they are much more difficult to access than a tower setup is...one needs to have the time and to clear off a big space- for everything once you get it all out. So I'm not going to start that until I'm ready. But I'll run hers through the paces, with the hardware installed direct from Apple- it has an SSD drive but I don't know anything about it except that it is 240GB....no make, model or speed information was provided by Apple. And I think she has a 2 0r 3 TB SATA drive in there too.
Will keep you posted!
By the way, if I am impressed with the iMAC I will definitely replace the SSD card slot with an eSATA port so that it can be used directly with an external eSATA RAID and am hopping that I can install two 440 GB SSD drives of my choice- and maybe set them up as RAID 1 or even RAID 0...if possible_ need to look into that.
The only issues I seem to have come across are that a lot of people are having trouble with the Pegasus external thunderbolt drive arrays and also some trouble with the thunderbolt cable itself- interference with other bluetooth products and cell phones....but I don't know if that is with the cable that Apple provides or with the one that comes with the Pegasus drives....But I also heard they have a fix for this, a new cable or something.
Others are coming out with Thunderbolt drive arrays by this summer as well, so it won't be long.
Then there are folks who are having no issues at all with the thunderbolt and love it.
I'm just waiting for it to mature and need access to my eSATA towers...you can get an eSATA to USB3 cable but no eSATA to firewire 800 or thunderbolt....so the speed will drop from eSATA to USB2 on the iMAC with that. It won't be long though....there are a lot of folks who have these same needs so options should arrive soon. In the meanwhile we will have to make do! Maybe Apple will consider exchanging one of the USB2 ports on the iMAC with one or two USB3 ports...offering such versatility could only result in more sales and customer loyalty.
From the test reports I've seen the iMAC 7i, 3.4GHz, is suppose to perform similarly- if not better than a 2010 Mac Pro with dual processors (2.66GHz) each machine with 16 GB ram, running photoshop and similar software.
We'll see soon.....
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Mar 19, 2012 3:09 AM in response to Snow Houndby Leon Buijs,I think I owe you all this one, now I think I have finally found the problem of my Mac Pro:
Last Wednesday I replaced the Mac Pro's power supply unit. Thursday my Mac Pro woke up spontaneously. Quite a disappointment. I have had this kind of problems for 1,5 years now and really hoped a new power supply would fix it. In my case it was almost certainly not the power supply.
According to the log files, it was woken by a USB device. I tried to eliminate what device by unplugging or replacing them all, except the keyboard.
Sunday afternoon I came back after a break and found it frozen, with a black screen, had to restart it with the power button.. (looking backwards this was a clue about the keyboard…)
Sunday evening my printer got the Fritz. It was the 'original' Apple USB keyboard that came with the Mac Pro that caused the printer to malfunction. Or rather: that caused the USB devices to malfunction.
Since I have had all kinds of problems with this machine, but all of them only very occasionally, it was extremely hard to find. I replaced SDRAMM and PSU. Even now I am not sure the USB keyboard was really the source of all evil: I will only know for sure in about a few months. I wrote a longer version on how to find solutions for Mac Pro sleep problems on my site. -
Mar 19, 2012 8:58 AM in response to Leon Buijsby Snow Hound,Leon, I hope that does the trick for you until you upgrade, not for just a few months!
I tired two different keyboards on mine, one through the usb and the other bluetooth, neither made any difference.
So, anybody need a power supply for a MacPro email me direct, I have one for sale_ the new one just purchased, not the old one ($250 US plus shipping).
FYI: last week I had a job that required stitching 6 images together into a final file that was 12 feet long.
Things were going very slow on the MacPro (working at something like 25-50% of its potential) so once I finished all the color and density corrections I loaded the file into the new iMac i7 (16GBRam, SSD boot drive, 2TB scratch disk) to see how that would compare....I was blown away!!!..it took less than 5 seconds to save the same file (1.57GB) that was taking about 45-60 seconds on the MacPro (CS5.5).
I think I might get one myself....
I wish I could find out what the issue is with my MacPro because its still dear to my heart but buying a new motherboard, hoping that will cure the problem, isn't in the cards for me.
The spontaneous restart issue with my machine isn't sporadic (unfortunately), its very dependable_ all I have to do is put the second riser card back in and then power up...sometimes it will go into the restart loop as soon as I power up and not even let the drive fully boot up ( I've booted from different drives, using different OS, doesn't make a difference. tried different combinations of ram modules on the risers and tried different riser cards- nothing makes a difference except pulling one of the cards, doesn't even matter which one it is).
All I can think of is it must be the mother board.
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Mar 19, 2012 4:12 PM in response to jrbuuckby Museum DC,I thought I posted this before, but perhaps not. I had this problem, read all the answers and took it to the local Apple store. They said there was nothing wrong with my computer (I didn't believe)... my own white powercord accidentally got left at the Genius Bar, so when I got home I had to go find a plain black (unused) powercord and plug it in. Since that time I have not had one single instance of restarting.
Many people mentioned it going on and on and eventually needed a new power supply. If you had a faulty cord for 2 years, perhaps it destroys your power supply.
This box of mine (MacPro Dual 3.0 Ghz Quadcore Early 2008 with 16GB RAM) is the first Apple Computer I bought that didn't have the old-style power cable (heavy duty) but this sleeker white cord. There might be something there.
Good luck to all- my advice based on experience is: Before anything else, change to a new power cord.
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Mar 21, 2012 1:58 AM in response to jrbuuckby Kurok9,Over the last six months, I too have had problems with my early 2008 MacPro restarting randomly. Sometimes it would go for weeks without happening and then do it for days at a time. I tried all of the usual things - SMC, PRAM etc. I also spoke to AppleCare on a number of occasions and they tried to help. My biggest concern was that my AppleCare was due to expire in Feb of this year and it would die not long after. However, Apple reassured me that they would support the issue for at least 2 months after the expiry of the Apple Care. In Jan and Feb, the restarts were happening more often. AppleCare tried to help over the phone but my hard drive and TM backup were both corrupted in the process.
To cut a very long story short, the machine did start to die (would only stay up for a few minutes at a time) a couple of weeks ago and Apple agreed that they would fix it under AppleCare which had expired 3 weeks previously. A new motherboard arrived, found to be faulty and a new one ordered and installed - still restarting. A new video card ordered and installed and then a second one when the problem didn't resolve - still restarting.
Today a new power supply unit was installed and at this time of writing, the computer has been up for most of the day, whereas previously it was only lasting for 10-15 minutes. So I'm hoping that the problem has been fixed but I would have to say that Apple has been very accommodating in my case. My original motherboard was put back in but I have a new PSU and graphics card and the onsite tech was great.
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Mar 21, 2012 2:21 AM in response to jrbuuckby mdavidsydney,Thanks for your post, Kurok9. I too was worried about my AppleCare running out. I tried to get my Mac (also an early 2008 MacPro) fixed while under warranty but the repair centre did not see the fault happening. They ran an extensive test and did see that the hard drive was faulty and so they replaced that and told me that would have definitely fixed it. After bringing the Mac back home it was fine for a few weeks and then started its random reboots again.
When I phoned the Apple store and told them the problem was still happening, and also told them about this thread, I asked them if they had checked out my power supply and they were quite emphatic that there was nothing wrong with my Mac any more. Or at least, nothing wrong with the hardware. In fact the guy I spoke to seemed a bit annoyed at me for even suggesting that he had not checked my power supply properly. He said that as far as he was concerned the hardware was now all perfect and that they would charge me money to 'fix the software' since it must, according to him, be software-related now. Anyway, my AppleCare has run out now too. And the problem is still going on.
Maybe in my case it is software related but I doubt it. Especially after following this thread for so long. I've installed Lion since the problems started and have applied all the latest OS X Lion patches but the problem is still going on. Unfortunately, my past procedure (SMC, PRAM, Energy Saver prefs) no longer stops the reboots but at least it seems to make them happen much less often.
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Mar 21, 2012 6:05 AM in response to mdavidsydneyby The hatter,they were quite emphatic that there was nothing wrong with my Mac any more. Or at least, nothing wrong with the hardware. In fact the guy I spoke to seemed a bit annoyed at me for even suggesting that he had not checked my power supply properly. He said that as far as he was concerned the hardware was now all perfect and that they would charge me money to 'fix the software'
Wrong. Attitude. Adjustment. Get to talk to someone. else.
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Mar 21, 2012 9:40 AM in response to mdavidsydneyby Snow Hound,Kurok9 & mdavidsydney:
The Hatter is right: talk to someone else. In many cases a new power supply fixed their problem, for some it was the video card and for others a new riser card or bad ram, and unfortunately for a few a new motherboard. Some lucky folks got away with just a good thorough cleaning or resetting the pram. Unfortunately for me (mine is a early 2007 model) none of those solutions have worked....and I'm not willing to go as far as a new motherboard.
During the process of trying to determine what my problem was I tested the ram modules by switching them
out- using different combinations of four (of the eight installed) on the two riser cards _ since Apple recommends that you install the ram in opposing blocks on the two cards. But then I read that a few folks had fixed their problem by getting a new riser card, so once I had gone through all the ram and determined it was all functioning- through software tests as well as physical, then I tried switching out the riser cards. First I switched them around with no positive effect, and then I pulled one- restarting with just one installed.
That did the trick, no more restarts.
However now I was running a lot less efficiently.
After more testing it didn't seem to matter if I had 2 or 4 ram modules installed on the riser card or which card it was, having just one installed eliminated the problem. But as soon as I put the second card back in it all started over again.
The first thing I did was test the boot drive and it was fine, so then I booted from the disk- no difference, then booted from a second drive with a different OS and the problem still persisted.
Then I cleaned it thoroughly, reset the pram, tried a different power cord, switched the video card...no difference.
Then tried two new power supplies, no difference.
The only thing that helps is pulling one of the riser cards, then everything is stable, but running slow.
I recommend you try that too and post the results, it would be interesting to find out if that helps in your case.
I have no current Apple Care for that MacPro and no Apple Store within 1000 miles, so am kinda on my own.
Try booting from your system CD and disabling software and see what happens if you haven't already.
Or do a fresh install of your OS on a different disk and boot from that.
Then you can try opening whatever software you use on the boot drive one at a time and see if it suddenly reacts to anything specifically.
But a word of warning_ in my case if I reinstall the second riser card- the problem has become more severe as time progresses to where sometimes it begins as soon as the machine tries to start up and cycles in a loop so that it never can- requiring either a power button shutdown or in one case pulling the power cord. then removing the second riser card and powering back up.
It seems that in my case the problem could be with the motherboard- perhaps related to the way it manages the application of ram or distributes power- but for some reason doesn't occur when only one card is installed.
But since Kurok9 had a new motherboard installed and it wasn't the issue, I am even more resistant to spending that kind of cash on an older machine....
What seems so bizarre is that the issue has become quite common and at the same time is caused by so many different things.
In my case its definitely hardware related in some way because no new software had been installed for over a year and everything was working perfectly. And that MacPro isn't connected to the internet either so very unlikely any type of virus infected it either (ran checks on that and it was deemed clean). It also only has two software programs and the OS installed so checking for software conflicts was relatively easy in my case.
But since pulling a riser card fixes the problem (with substantial processing falloff) that would also point to a hardware issue.
Try pulling a riser card and see what happens...if that helps it may not tell you what is causing your problem- but it will be an easy way to determine if your issue is software related or not. It won't cost you a penny
and only takes a few minutes.
Hope that helps.
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Mar 21, 2012 10:21 AM in response to Snow Houndby Grant Bennet-Alder,There is one other wacky solution you have not listed. Since your situation seems near desperate, I will list this one as well.
One user reported that his machine had too much heat sink compound on the processors, and that the compound had oozed off to make contact with things outside the center of the die where it should not be present.
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Mar 21, 2012 5:54 PM in response to The hatterby mdavidsydney,Thank you, The hatter,
After reading your post I've just had a very long phone call, not to the Apple reseller who did the original work but to Apple directly. Apple were very good. They could see a mention of my rebooting issue in their records due to the work being initiated under warranty and agreed to look into this again.
Oh yeah, and thank you to Snow Hound too.
I really appreciate the posts from both of you.
Still too early to know what will come of this but it looks promising.
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Mar 22, 2012 2:36 AM in response to jrbuuckby Leon Buijs,In my case it was the Apple USB 'full' keyboard. I didn't have serial restarts though, but only a few single spontaneous restarts.
Snow Hound, pulling a riser makes your machine go into a slower way of working. That may prevent it from malfunctioning, but that doesn't mean the problem is in the riser card.
Also, you write the problem gets worse. In my opinion, this can be a good thing. It's easier to determine which part is faulty, when it 100% dead then when it only acts up once a week.
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Mar 22, 2012 9:30 AM in response to Leon Buijsby Snow Hound,Hello Leon, Thanks for the tip....I was thinking pretty much the same thing but even though my machine isn't dead_yet_the issue isn't spontaneous either. Put the second card in and bang_ restarts will begin anytime between boot up and putting it in second gear. I've only got two keyboards, one bluetooth and one usb and have tried both, no difference.
And I'm pretty sure the problem isn't in the riser card itself because I've tried both cards, with exactly the same ram modules mounted in the same slots as well as different combinations of ram modules.
No difference, as long as only one is mounted.
Its got to be something to do with power... but I have no idea what since I've tried three different power supplies without any effect.
When it started it happened only when it was working hard processing a large file. Then it got worse from there.
Yesterday I had a spontaneous restart with just one riser mounted_ when it was asked to work on a 1.6 GB file.
So it does seem to be related to the application of the processors... in some way or form.
Grant, thanks for the tip, I'll check the compound issue to see if that might be it, but I haven't noticed anything like that. Though I don't think I've taken a good look at the processors themselves...not even sure where they are located!
Hardware isn't really my thing, as you can tell, I'm just forced to deal with it when circumstance demands action.
Hope you get back up and running smoothly and that your's stay's that way Grant!
Thanks to all.
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Apr 6, 2012 12:46 AM in response to jrbuuckby Robert in Hawaii,I recently started having frequent spontaneous restarts of my Mac Pro, as described here. I was able to correct it by making sure the power cord was firmly and completely plugged into the 110-volt outlet. Over time the plug tends to work its way out a bit, probably from repeated heating up and cooling down, and the resulting degradation in the power connection appears to likely have been the cause of the problem.