1 2 Previous Next 15 Replies Latest reply: May 9, 2012 11:26 PM by AceNeerav
AceNeerav Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

today i decided to use my sony bravia 26 inch klv series LCD TV as my primary display instead of my LG 22 inch LED and at first i was surprised that it reported the input as "unsupported". after a few tries now i have the display running as a primary diplay at 1080p and the macbook in closed lid clamshell. but the picture clarity is horrible! the font is barely readable and the color isn't that good either. also, the edges of both the font and the pictures aren't sharp or crisp.

 

its like watching a blur image like on a vga. i'm using a mini display port to dvi adapter and a dvi to hdmi cable. before u think its the cable let me tell u this same cable works fine with my 22inch led, 22inch sony lcd and 40 inch sony lcd in the living room. but they had their own set of problems. the color is unnatural with too much saturation for a computer screen and the zoom fit is a well known probelm which required a lot of effort untill apple equppied os x with "underscan"

 

Any help?

 

Neerav


MacBook Pro, Mac OS X (10.7.3), Mid 2010
  • 1. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    eww Level 9 Level 9 (52,975 points)

    A TV is not a computer monitor, and is unlikely to offer the same image quality or the same adjustment options as a good monitor. Furthermore, 1920 x 1080 is a pretty low resolution for a 26" screen that you will view from the 2'-3' distance at which one typically uses a computer monitor. A good monitor of that size or slightly larger, like Apple's 27" monitors, will typically have a higher resolution — usually 2560 x 1440 or 2560 x 1600. Viewing the great big pixels on your TV set close up and without the fine-tuneable anti-aliasing adjustments that are possible on a good monitor, the image is apt to look blurry at best. At a more normal TV viewing distance, you don't see that.

  • 2. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    AceNeerav Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    wow! i always thought a tv was also a great monitor. now everything makes sense. so now what do i do if i want a tv and a monitor in one device? should i consider getting a tv tuner?

     

    Neerav

     

    PS: nice Display pic.

  • 3. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    ds store Level 7 Level 7 (30,305 points)

    AceNeerav wrote:

     

    so now what do i do if i want a tv and a monitor in one device?

     

    There is no such thing, since 1080 HD content is 1920 x 1080 pixels and that's the max pixels a HDTV will display. Smaller HDTV's display even less.

     

    My 17" MBP displays 1920 x 1200 pixels, at a 3 foot range so the pixel density per square inch is higher, because the human eye can see detail at close range and not at far range.

     

    To display 1920 x 1080 content on a larger than 17" display would mean the pixels get bigger and viewing up close you see that so one has to step back so the pixels merge together and you think your seeing a clear image.

     

    TV's are designed to be watched by a group of people from across the room, not up close like a computer monitor.

     

     

    An option, then to only see it from across the room, to get both would be a projector that can accept the higher quantity pixel output of a Mac and full 1080 HDTV content. If you have control over your lighting in your environment like a theater, then have a long enough room and a large free wall, you probably could get both to work on that, I've seen it done.

     

    You would need to have a table next to the chair to sit the MacBook Pro on with the connections there ready to go and either a wireless or long wired keyboard/mouse to sit in your lap while you watched the big screen. Remote control to switch between Mac and other content sources.

     

     

    Of course when you do this you can't use the Mac and the HDTV at the same time. So perhaps having both separate is better, also others can watch the TV.

     

    Computers and TV's are two different purposed use devices.

     

    If HDTV's and HD content were both of such a high pixel density rate per square inch, then it wouldn't matter, HDTV's could be viewed up close or far away.

     

    Since the content generation industry just switched to 1920 x 1080 content, and incurred a huge expense in new equipment to do so, I doubt they are up to doing that anytime soon.

  • 4. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    AceNeerav Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    so can we establish that there is no television out there that would work as good as a computer monitor or equal size?

  • 5. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    eww Level 9 Level 9 (52,975 points)

    so now what do i do if i want a tv and a monitor in one device?

     

    A little different perspective on the same question:

     

    If what you want is to watch TV on a screen that you're going to sit close to, just get a good computer monitor and a TV tuner for your computer. TVs are made to be seen from a distance; monitors are made to be seen close up.

  • 6. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    eww Level 9 Level 9 (52,975 points)

    Yes. I believe that's true.

  • 7. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    AceNeerav Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    when i'll be watching tv or video content on my montior i would be sitting away from it. like i do now on my 22 inch led.

     

    its just that i thought why not use the 26 inch lcd to watch videos as i do rest of my internet activities from my ipad and iphone.

  • 8. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    ds store Level 7 Level 7 (30,305 points)

    AceNeerav wrote:

     

    its just that i thought why not use the 26 inch lcd to watch videos

     

    You can do that, but use a more dedicated device, like a Apple TV, a Roku, a Playstation 3, DVD or BlueRay DVD player, they are a lot less expensive than a MacBook Pro.

     

    If you place all your content viewing demand and computer using deamnd on one machine, it's just going to wear it out all that much faster and have to be replaced sooner.

     

    Also with a MBP, it's a portable model, connecting and reconnecting not only is going to be a chore, but wear out the ports sooner too.

     

    AppleCare lasts only 3 years, you can make that MBP last 5 or more years with care.

     

    There are people I've come across that are still on 10.4 and 10.5 era machines because they don't use them all that much.

     

     

    Every minute a Mac is on, it's inhaling dust so adding to the wear of watching content is just adding more dust inside the machine.

     

    The MacBook Pro can be opened by the user (without violating AppleCare/warranty) and a long tube and a can of air can be used to blast dust out of the vents exiting the fans exhaust ports, but a lot of users are just that, users, and thus can't perform this necessary function or even know about it.

     

    I've been meaning to make a User Tip about it, but waiting to do so when I upgrade the RAM etc so I can take pictures of the proceedure.

  • 9. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    AceNeerav Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    because they don't use them all that much.

    doesn't that defeat the purpose of having such an expensive machine, compared to a windows laptop?

     

    also, i use my mbp in closed lid clamshell mode with my lg led 22 inch and have been doing so since 6 months now. last month i upgraded it with 8gb ram and 128gb ssd and did it myself and also cleaned the machine's air vents and fan. i'm pretty aware of this care required.

     

    all this is besides the point. the machine works fine with my 22inch and 40 inch bravia and another windows machine works fine with this 26 inch bravia in consideration. its only the mbp not showing the display crisp on this 26 inch one.

     

    i used the mbp with my 40 inch at about  2 meters distance quite fine with the wireless keyboard and magic trackpad and magicwand. its just this one 26inch that doesn't work well.

  • 10. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    eww Level 9 Level 9 (52,975 points)

    Also with a MBP, it's a portable model, connecting and reconnecting not only is going to be a chore, but wear out the ports sooner too.

     

    In 28 years of using Macs every day, 17 of those years using portable Macs as my primary or only computers, I have never, ever known or heard of a port of any kind wearing out.

  • 11. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    ds store Level 7 Level 7 (30,305 points)

    AceNeerav wrote:

     

    There are people I've come across that are still on 10.4 and 10.5 era machines because they don't use them all that much.

     

    doesn't that defeat the purpose of having such an expensive machine, compared to a windows laptop?

     

    It's the usage pattern of those people, they don't use their Mac's all that much, thus because it's used less it lasts longer.

     

    If they used it more often, like using it for the large compsumption that watching TV tends to do, it places more wear and tear on the expensive Mac, thus it doesn't last as long.

     

    The point I was trying to make is there are less expensive and more easier to use tailored devices than using a Mac for large scale media consumption.

     

     

    i use my mbp in closed lid clamshell mode with my lg led 22 inch

     

     

    That's a external computer monitor, not a TV.

     

     

    i used the mbp with my 40 inch at about  2 meters distance quite fine with the wireless keyboard and magic trackpad and magicwand.

     

     

    That's 6.5 feet and thus the pixels are merging, plus it's likely a 720p screen at that size. So your really not using it up close or far away.  You have to move within 6.5 feet in order to see the type clearly right.

     

    I notice this too if there is a password or something I need to enter for Netflix that I have to get within 2 meters of the screen to type it in. I can't do it from across the room as the type is too small and not readable.

     

    its just this one 26inch that doesn't work well.

     

     

    It's because TV's are restrained by HD content sizes to match the pixels of the HD content to the screen, they are not designed as computer monitors.

     

     

    For close up and a larger screen you need a computer monitor that can display the maximum output your video card can support.

     

    For far away, you need to use a projector and a large wall/room with controlled lighting so you can display the static sized OS X display at the same proportions to scale as it would be sitting a few feet from your eyes, just blow up basically.

     

    This is done by moving the projector backwards until you get a comfortable viewing image.

     

    Because projectors are not limited by pixel density, one can scale the image to just about any size they desire, provided the projector can accept higher quality computer and HDCP/HDTV content without downgrading the content (non-HDCP compliant) and also display the Mac's maximum video card output resolution.

  • 12. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    ds store Level 7 Level 7 (30,305 points)

    Here's a basic image I drew up

     

    Screen shot 2012-05-09 at 3.55.40 PM.jpg

     

    To get the OS X screen image to be readable, you need to be able to scale the image in porportion to the distance you sit further back.

     

    If HDTV's came with the same high pixel densisty per square inch as most Mac computer monitors, then this wouldn't be a problem. You could sit close or far away depending upon the size of the screen and it would always be sharp.

     

     

    But HDTV's are not designed for displaying computer content, but general 1920 x 1080 HD media industry generated content they can scale down to 720p and that's about it.

     

     

    You might have found with your 40" that something is acceptable it's likely a 1080i, it could be the Bravia since it's a higher end HDTV is assisting to generate a better picture from the computer source. But your 26" is not as it's a less expensive model, likely 720p so the Mac's output is more mismatched with it.

     

    If you really want to marry the two technologies and purposes and watch from across the room, a HDCP and computer compliant projector. Create a home theater while your at it.

     

    http://theater.stevejenkins.com/gallery/complete/

  • 13. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    AceNeerav Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    the 40 inch runs on 1080p.

     

    your are giving me a resoultion pixel to screen pixel explaination and telling me that bigger monitors will distort 1080p but ill give u two straight facts...

     

    my 40 inch displays 1080p fine even when viewed from a distance from less than a meter.

    i have 2- 22 inch displays, one a monitor and one a bravia lcd. the bravia lcd doesnt display the pixels as fine as the 22 inch monitor does. but its still very sharp.

     

    its the one in between, the 26 inch that is not working fine. to rule out that the tv has a problem, my toshiba windows vista laptop works fine on it even on vga!

     

    now what u got to say friend?

  • 14. Re: bad picture clarity at 1080p on sony bravia 26 inch...
    ds store Level 7 Level 7 (30,305 points)

    AceNeerav wrote:


    my 40 inch displays 1080p fine even when viewed from a distance from less than a meter.

     

    Good enough for the 1080 content with 1920 x 1080 pixels,  matches the pixels on the 40" Bravia's screen exactly, but not the content from a computer.

     

    Your Mid 2010 MBP can output a max of 2560 x 1600 pixels, so your using a 40" 1080p HDTV with only 1920 x 1080 max pixels, with your MBP at one meter, that's junk really.

     

    You really need a computer monitor with 2560 x 1600 pixels at 26" diagonal.

     

    i have 2- 22 inch displays, one a monitor and one a bravia lcd. the bravia lcd doesnt display the pixels as fine as the 22 inch monitor does. but its still very sharp.

     

    The computer monitor has higher pixel resolution than the 22" Bravia that's likely only 720p which is 1280 x 720 pixels, more junk.

     

    My 17" MBP has a 1920 x 1200 pixel resolution at 17" diagonal.

     

     

    its the one in between, the 26 inch that is not working fine.

     

     

    The 26" is likely 720p with 1280 x 720 pixels that are larger and more spaced out than the 22" Bravia so your distortion is even worse.

     

    You need 2560 x 1600 pixels on the 26" display, which is slightly more that 200% more pixels than the 22" Bravia has.

     

     

    to rule out that the tv has a problem, my toshiba windows vista laptop works fine on it even on vga!

     

     

    VGA is 800 x 600 pixel junk.

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