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Ambiguous RAID failure

6115 Views 42 Replies Latest reply: Nov 6, 2012 11:28 AM by Samiam872 RSS
  • The hatter Level 9 Level 9 (58,535 points)
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    May 22, 2012 1:10 PM (in response to rrgomes)

    To scan is one thing but Seatools is linux or Windows program. Same for Lifeguard.


    SoftRAID 4 is $139 and will run in the background and safe to use.


    Apple RAID is a strange product. The way to get "from here to there" is to backup and clone your volumes (two sets minimum, maybe two different methods). And then rebuild and recreate.


    I'd shoot off an email to SoftRAID and ask that you have RAID card, have some issues, and looking for more reliable and to insure your drives and array is 200% safe and functional. SoftRAID mirrors are threaded and stripe reads, meaning a 3 or 4-drive RAID has redundancy and performance too. And to migrate. Their RAID setup if very flexible. Read the features, dl the manual, there is a demo they've added support for SSD,



    Seagate knew that their warranty would 'work' and they made their name with SCSI and firmware, before they took over Maxtor and started messing with what had worked. WD you just enter the SER NO into a web form and you're done and RMA process is very easy. I even had Hitachi do advance replacements.

  • The hatter Level 9 Level 9 (58,535 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    May 22, 2012 3:47 PM (in response to rrgomes)

    Nothing can see the individual drives when part of a hardware RAID like yours.


    And even SR will only work with software arrays, not hardware.


    For all the protection of a drive failure of RAID5, I don't see it. And for hardware RAID find one that provides RAID6.


    This may be something you don't need but it is helpful



    • Disk failure has a medium impact on throughput
    • Most complex controller design
    • Difficult to rebuild in the event of a disk failure (as compared to RAID level 1)
    • Individual block data transfer rate same as single disk

    Recommended Applications

    • File and Application servers
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  • The hatter Level 9 Level 9 (58,535 points)
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    May 23, 2012 11:14 AM (in response to rrgomes)

    I would get the data on two drives, maybe 2TB WD Black or invest in one of the Hitachi 4TB models that are hot for performance (180MB/s on outer 1/2) make a great backup and investment.


    I'd nuke the whole Apple RAID card and live w/o as I have said.


    I wonder if you can boot from what I like to keey handy and use, a plain vanilla OS for emergency maintenance (leave your existing system alone) and see what it shows. Do you then see a queued process?


    I have yet to find a use for TB other than laptops for displays and storage, nothing on workstation. Intel will have Tb on first PC later this fall.


    What might be in the wings or not who knows but Intel and others, single socket Xeon E5 8-core but the high end today and tomorrow won't change all that much and it will take time to iron out (OS support always takes a point or two, chip revisions, and every model has had its EFI + SMC firmware update in the first months since 2008).


    I think though back to the array, it is was due for a total delete and recreate from scratch rather than just rebuild after rebuild.


    Others have wished they could use the Apple RAID5 with 3rd party but that is impossible to do, the data has to be migrated to new hardware. And software RAID would be safer and migrate nicely.

  • The hatter Level 9 Level 9 (58,535 points)
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    May 24, 2012 6:43 AM (in response to rrgomes)

    Carbon Copy Cloner - check or used it? Yes SuperDuper can restore the data - CCC can clone Lion Recovery - though the best place for that I think is on a standalone boot drive.


    Why put the system on the RAID array? or is "Drive 1" the 5th in optical drive bay - can't see the need to do a fresh Lion install unless you need to.


    The time to experiment with Lion Recovery is before you need it.


    Sounds lke 3 workable methods though. All of them though depend on the RAID card not being the culprit.

  • The hatter Level 9 Level 9 (58,535 points)
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    May 24, 2012 7:16 AM (in response to rrgomes)

    I always learn something along the way and SoftRAID has done some digging on 10.7.4.


    MPG: More and more caution seems to be needed with Apple system software updates these days, when cavalier changes like this are thrown in (disabling system calls in a minor release is reckless at best).


    Personally, upgrades should always be done with a safety net, and not until the bug reports and dust has settled.


    From today's MPG blog:


    While working with Apple engineers, we discovered was that Apple had disabled one of the two sets of read / write calls in 10.7.4. Before 10.7.4, volume drivers could use one of two types of read / write calls for transferring data to and from a volume, the older one which was introduced in 10.0 and a newer one introduced in 10.6. Since SoftRAID still supports any Macs running 10.4, we used the older one when running in the 32 bit kernel and the newer one when running the 64 bit kernel (the 64 bit kernel was introduced with 10.6). When Apple disabled the older one in 10.7.4, all read / write calls to SoftRAID volumes would fail when they were made with the older set calls, i.e. on Macs running the 32 bit kernel.


    We have just released a beta version of SoftRAID, 4.3.2 b9, which works around this problem by using the newer set of read write calls whenever a user is running 10.7. It is available by sending email to We will be releasing a final version of SoftRAID 4.3.2 in the next two weeks.


    This same problem also affected other drivers on the Mac. For instance, some of the cards from Sonnet Technologies, Inc. experienced the same problem. They have released new drivers for their products which allows volumes to mount correctly when running 10.7.4 with a 32 bit kernel. Please see their web site ( for driver updates.



    We have a couple threads about Lion and Apple Pro RAID card, issues with panics when more than 48GB RAM is present, no support for drives larger than 2.2TB.  And the way Apple Disk Utility arrays were implemented when Lion came out. These types of things are why it seems someone is not keeping their eye on the Mac Pro line and traditional user base of pro users.


    Question: are you bootiing using 64-bit kernel?

    Mac Pro, Windows 8 Preview x64 3.2GHz
  • The hatter Level 9 Level 9 (58,535 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    May 24, 2012 8:04 AM (in response to rrgomes)

    Actually having the system not be on the hardware RAID, and on a separate system boot drive, would be safer and preferable. And easy to manage.


    Some use an SSD in the 2nd optical drive bay, or there are 10K WD VR in 250-500GB model in $154-200 (similar to a good 128GB SSD).


    Have you ever visited and looked at their hardware cards and burly arrays? TB only makes sense - being new proprietary - on laptops and those w/o discreet PCIe slots. Seen on Promise vs others?


    I was disappointed when the $1000 Apple Pro RAID card came out in 2007, after thinking at first it would offer SAS/SCSI and more than the 700MB/sec performance, and w/o the issues and behavior it has shown.


    I used CCC first, it came out yrs before Superduper afterall and Mike is a certified terminal genius to boot. That it handles Lion Recovery partition clones is a bonus. And shareware. Started using it in 2003 myself.

  • The hatter Level 9 Level 9 (58,535 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    May 24, 2012 8:25 AM (in response to rrgomes)


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