Currently Being ModeratedNov 15, 2012 1:02 PM (in response to mswag)
I would like to see a 17" MBP return in the future. It may happen 3-5 years down the line, then I'll be ready to upgrade! I have heard that the 17" sales are dramatically lower than 13" and 15" so why bother paying for R&D of a product that won't net you nearly the same return? Tim Cook is truly good at maximizing profit, but there's also something to be said for a company that values their customers as well.
Currently Being ModeratedNov 15, 2012 1:18 PM (in response to zeroskie)
In order to maximize profit for the long run (as opposed to short term profit maximizaton),
R and D has to made for the long term.
By the way, it's not all to difficult to create a 17" MBP now as all the PC manufacturers can do it and with more hardware features.
And no, the 17" MBP does not need to be all that thin like the 15".
Productivity is more important than portability for the 17". If that were not so, the 17" wouldn't have sales below the 2% mark of all MacBooks sold.
Currently Being ModeratedNov 15, 2012 1:19 PM (in response to mswag)
So, now I'm about to buy a used 17" MBP (probably Early 2011 model). I don't see Apple introducing the 17" retina MBP in the near future.
Besides, the 2011 model has extensible RAM (up to 16GB), a swappable HD, ExpressCard slot, a swappable battery, plus I can move my OptiBay+SSD from my old '08 MBP … and it's quite cheap (1700€, that is). The only feature I'd like to have but cannot is USB 3.0 (unless I find a usable ExpressCard).
Maybe in some years there's a viable 17" model again, probably with a retina display. Let's see — for the time being I'm well equipped.
Currently Being ModeratedNov 15, 2012 5:04 PM (in response to mswag)
Well put everyone, I am proud - so proud to be part of this proactive discussion group here because let me tell you - some of or most of the members at macrumors are ................................ well i don't need to use words
but - ya..
Thanks for being such a supportive and intelligent group.
Currently Being ModeratedNov 17, 2012 9:53 AM (in response to veepro)
I really hope apple produce an updated retina version of the 17in macbook pro, surely the technical barriers must be coming down? Its clear from the new iMac that they should be able to laminate the glass to the display of a 17" panel, retina or otherwise. The new iMac's are at least 21". Im happy for them to get rid of the optical drive so its just as thin as the 15.4" and 13" versions. With the 17" even though if its made to be as thin as the 15.4" model, it should have significantly more space on the inside, space for a bigger battery, more cooling infrastructure or a better GPU board to drive a resolution of 3840 x 2400 that should offer the same screen real estate as the previous 17inch macbook pro for non optimised applications. They could even put in a dual ssd to give an option of nearly 1.5Tb capacity. I hope apple have an event sooner but I'll be watching to see if a new 17inch laptop will be launched at WWDC 2013, this is the date around I'd be hoping to upgrade my current 2011 17" macbook pro. I can't see me dropping back to a 15.4" laptop, I need the screen real estate. Given that apple have taken this option away from us, could we restore it by lobbying them for a more portable iMac? Seems to have worked for the iPad ;-)
I can see the opening video now,
"It has taken all of our learning. All of our understanding, but we have finally found a way of taking the power and real estate of the iMac and making it portable. Introducing the new 17 inch retina macbook pro... [Cut Scene 1] The 17" retina macbook pro isn't simply a smaller iMac its a concentration that has been made portable, this has been made possible from the learning we gained from the iPhone, MacBook Air and retina Products. [Cut Scene 2] We listened to our customers and found that some of them wanted a larger notebook so they can be just as productive as the would be with the estate offered by the desktop iMac, but the portability of a notebook... [Cut Scene 3]" Hardware breakdown
Currently Being ModeratedNov 17, 2012 12:05 PM (in response to Gavin Olukoju)
*CANNOT EASILY SEE THE DIFFERENCE...EVEN UP CLOSE*
I think one of the things that made the 17" MBP sell so poorly was that even up close, new and existing Apple customers could not easily tell the difference from the outside between the 15" MBP and the 17" MBP without having a side-by-sde comparison like at the Apple Store. And that was, regardless, with the MBP cover closed or open.
AT THE COFFEE SHOP
Heck, even someone familiar with both the 15" MBP and the 17" MBP couldn't be all to sure if a 17" MBP was really a 17" MBP as opposed to a 15" MBP if it stood alone, say at a coffee shop, or at someone's home or business. I remember asking a lady at a coffeeshop if her laptop was the 17" MBP as I said it was difficult to tell to tell the difference. She said enthusiastically, "Yes it's a 17" and I can tell the difference!", as if she practiced a lot and has a trained eye to know the difference between the two.
EVEN INSIDE THE APPLE STORE
Now, there were times, even at the Apple Store, if the 17" MBP was on one table to the side and the 15" was at the other table, you still would not be able to readily pickout the 17" MBP without really looking hard at it and most likely looking back at the 15" MBP for comparison to make sure. I think there were times even the Apple employees, every now and then, didn't know themselves and had to ask a fellow employee where the 17" MBP were.
And there lies a key point in the "less than 2% of all laptop sales" problem.
If a customer can't go into an Apple Store and see immediately that those laptops over there, on the left hand side of the store of that 3rd corner table must be 17" MBP because they look bigger, how would new or existing customers know or be reminded that the 17" MBP is available to purchase in the first place?
If new customers didn't know a 17" MBP was available, then they would have to, by chance, read the small print or notice that the price is a lot more on the product label for the laptops on "right side of 2nd table in the middle of the store" to know the difference.
IN FRONT OF THE APPLE STORE
Could anyone standing at the front of a typical Apple Store point out where the 17" MBP laptops were if mixed in with the 15" MBP? I know I couldn't, at least not easily. However, I could make an educated guess as well as stare, squint my eyes, but I couldn't tell right off the bat like the Mac Air or any of the other Apple computers.
But again, it shouldn't take a "trained" eye to pick out the 17" MBP (1) at the Apple Store, (2) at a coffee shop, (3) from across the room, or (4) up close, if one wants sales to be more than 2% of all laptop sales.
Then again, maybe the folks at Apple wanted buying a 17" MBP to be like a scavenger hunt ;-)
Currently Being ModeratedNov 17, 2012 2:37 PM (in response to Pico2006)
Kudos, you are right about "Think Different!"
So, let me condense what I wrote and add in your insight above.
Basically, when Apple created the 17" MBP, it got rid of the
"think different" philosophy
and instead used a
"can't tell the difference" philosphy
for the 17" MBP when compared to the 15" MBP as both employees and customers can't tell (or see) the difference between the two MacBook Pros whether inside the Apple store or a coffee shop, from afar, up close, or even inside the laptop, hardware wise.
Currently Being ModeratedNov 17, 2012 2:37 PM (in response to Pico2006)
I have been watching PC manufacturers such as Sony and Dell create some new and stealthy laptops. Kudos to them and I hope that their design and engineering prowess continues to push the envelope. Apple needs to have a fire under its feet before it considers a major upgrade to its product line. The 17" MacBook Pro included. If these other manufacturers continue to make and improve their 17" laptops, Apple will be forced to respond. (It is difficult for me to hear myself saying this, in the post-Steve Jobs era, but Apple might soon start following the leader instead of being the leader.) The other practical part of this problem is that retina displays may simply still be too expensive for a 17" laptop. Once sales of the 13" and 15" retina displays scale up the cost to manufacture retina displays will decrease and make a 17" retina MacBook Pro more feasable. I wonder if this too is the reason behind the delay of an Apple T.V.
Currently Being ModeratedNov 17, 2012 5:31 PM (in response to pc2k5)
I think a 2nd Hard Drive would offer the most bang for the buck in terms of productivity versus, say a 2nd battery.
With a 2nd Hard Drive, say 1 TeraByte, there is decent list of things, professionals could use it for, from more photos, videos, to even DVD's.
For business users, it could serve as part of a backup hard drive.
With a 2nd battery, that would only be needed for very long trips, or for a user that is an area that had no power for an extended period of time on a regular basis. After 6 or more hours, it would be time take a break anyway and get something to eat. And the place you eat at, i.e. airport, probably will have power outlet for a partial recharge if the need really arises.
The occurance of users on very long trips or being in area with no power is far less likely than a professional who needs a 2nd hard drive for a constant backup, creating videos, working with photoshop files, photos, or animations.
The more stuff you have on the hard drive, the more reason it should be backed up on a regular basis versus having a 2nd battery.
Losing power to a laptop is not that big of a deal after 6 or more hours of use as one gets a low battery warning to begin with.
Losing your data is a big deal, regardless of the situation.
Currently Being ModeratedNov 22, 2012 12:19 PM (in response to pc2k5)
I've heard it all.
And there is only one way to go at this point.
Produce an even larger MacBook Pro and justify it by having features on it that you CANNOT GET ON THE SMALLER MODELS... Come on Apple, think about this for a moment. What features do you wish the 15 & 13 had but that there is obviously no room for?
I agree that at a glance, especially closed, it's easy to mistake a 17 for a 15... SO? Make it a CAGE RATTLING DIFFERENCE! Bring the Flagship back and put it on HGH.. I'm deadly serious now:
MacBook Pro 19
A spectacular masterpiece of mobile computing! (no confusing with the 15 now, right?)
(with or without retina display, I could'nt care less) (This machine will fit in my Brenthaven bag NO Problem)
- Matte Screen and original contoured keyboard... (this is a No Chicklet Zone)
- Full Keyboard with modded Number Pad on the side of course.
- Accessory bay for additional battery or SSD or Optical, whatever you like, ejects with a bottom button.
- Extra Video card for a total of 3 displays possible
- 4 Memory slots for a potential of 32GB Ram
- 6 USB ports
- Quad Core processors and extra fan that makes this ******** FAST!
- Cellular Radio built in with 4G (may or may not require a sim card)
- GPS unit built in for a complete Microcell Tower setup for poor iPhone reception areas.
Folks, this is a REAL MOBILE OFFICE for real professionals.
THIS IS THE AIRCRAFT CARRIER.
MSRP Base Price $3,495. Topping out at around $5,000 for the fastest everything.
Would you like my credit card now or later?
The only R&D here is the accessory bay...
You'd sell millions of these, just because...
Just put the competition in their place, once and for all.
Grow a pair.
JUST DO IT.
Currently Being ModeratedNov 22, 2012 12:30 PM (in response to BarefootHank)
And just for the record.
I did what I said I wouldn't do originally, because I was so bummed out about the disappearance of the 17...
I manned up.
I went out and bought an iPhone 4S and now an iPhone 5 (very very impressive)
As soon as they're available, I'll pick up a mini iPad.
I'm currently composing this note on my older MBP 17 displaying on a 27" Cinema display.
I'm on your side Mr. Cook...
Who's side of the fence are YOU ON?
It's time to step up and reward your Day Traders, your filmmakers, your musicians, your architects, your cartographers, your mechanical design engineers.
Have you ever seen what a Bloomberg Terminal looks like on your 15" MBP? It's insulting.
I'm talking productivity on a level that NO ONE else on the planet provides.
A MBP19 IS THE iPHONE5 of notebook computers.
JUST DO IT sir.
Watkins Glen, NY