Currently Being ModeratedJan 31, 2013 1:24 AM (in response to RMartin111)
Hi Just sending my "Retina Mac book pro" back to Apple, as i cant deal with the screen, due to it giving me a sun burn effect on my skin. The discomfort / pain was lasting for around 6-8 hours after using it for even a short period. Apple where kind enough to extend the 14 trial day period. But have to go back to my 20008 Mac book pro. Which was not a problem.
My old Black Macbook with a LCD screen was a problem, but i hoped the LED illuminated screens had solved this problem?
The screen gives me the same problems that the low energy bulbs that we have been forced to use in the UK. Flicker, UV, EMF issues.
I'm now go to order the new Mac book pro without the Retina screen, and see what happens there?
Currently Being ModeratedJan 31, 2013 2:31 PM (in response to RMartin111)
Now I'm sure that the problem is PWM.
After selling my MBP beacause of being unable to use it (as well as the air), I bought the Lenovo thinkpad E330.
Eye strain and disconfort as well but within the first 10 minutes of using it.
I have two computers to compare:
- A desktop computer with a CCFL screen
- A hp laptop LED backlighted
I have no problem with the two others.
I put the three on the same brightness (middle) and I moved my hands fastly in front of the screen.
Only the thinkpad had a stroboscopic effect.
BUT, when on maximum brightness, the thinkpad looses that effect and I can use it without disconfort.
Conclusion of that experience:
The thinkpad uses a poor PWM that goes away at full brightness.
On the macbook pro/air I had, the stroboscopic effect whas less apparent (the frequency was certainly higher), and I couldn't tell if it went away at full brightness because the mac go way brighter than the thinkpad and it's impossible to look at it (in a normal use).
What's funny is that the eye strain appared within the first 30 min for the mac (instead of 10 min), and I think that's due to the slightly higher frequency.
If the mac uses PWM, it's more subtle and maybe more difficult to show it.
To conclude, I would say that had the SAME symptoms. I really felt the same disconfort.
That's why for me the problem is here.
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 1, 2013 12:11 AM (in response to RMartin111)
I have few questions.
1. Can we really wait from Apple some graphic card updates?
2. What are the external monitors, that wont cause eye strain?
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 1, 2013 5:02 AM (in response to RMartin111)
I can't believe that after 2 years of severe migraines I have only just found this post, it all seems so obvious now that it began when I began using my 2007 MBP daily for work purposes.
Unfortunately I can't really afford to buy a new MBP. Can anyone recommend any affordable laptops that won't cause these problems?
In response to maarcs, there is a list of safe monitors here:
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 1, 2013 7:07 AM (in response to Gareth Jones6)
Sell it on ebay and look for another one out there, i can recommend the first LED 2008 MBP with 1440 x 900 screen any higher pixel amount maybe an issue? It has been for me.
Just a note if you go and buy a TV DVD home Projector you maybe asked, are you effected by the rainbow effect 1 in every 10.000 people see a ranbow /strobe effect from a LDP projector, so you have to use a LCD projector instead which is not a problem..
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 1, 2013 7:20 AM (in response to Gareth Jones6)
did you already try some of the proposals made here (like f.lux etc)
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 1, 2013 8:25 AM (in response to RMartin111)
I have f.lux but wasn't sure what to do with it. What settings do you recommend?
I have also ordered the Acer S243HL Abmii monitor so perhaps that will make a difference. I may also get the Moshi Ivisor but I'm not sure if reflection on the screen is my problem, it is already a matt screen with minimal reflection. PWM sounds more likely to be the problem.
And GKPhone, you may be right that I should try a later model of MBP. I don't understand your point about higher pixel rates however?
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 11, 2013 11:54 AM (in response to iStrain)
Update on my macbook pro eyestrain.
About two weeks ago I added a Moshi Ivisor and Flux. Initially the eyestrain went away. But it has come back with avengeance. eye aches, eyes watering -- worse still, my eyesight is rapidly deteriorating to the poiint that I find it hard to read emails.
I only wsh I hadn't got my old 2010 MBP screen repaired under applecare. It had a few stuck pixels but it caused me zero problems. Whatever Apple replaced it with, it's killing my eyesight.
The Moshi Ivisor turns the screen into a matte screen so the problem must be to do with refesh rate or whatever not the glossy screen.
Is there anywhere i can buy a 2010 screen? But fitting it would cost the earth, I'm guessing. Do I really have to sell this machine and then buy another 2010 one on ebay?
Apple, why can't you help us?! We like the look of your products, but do we have to go blind to use them?
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 11, 2013 12:02 PM (in response to scartacus)
Extreme solution -- has anyone tried turning off the colour entirely in the access pref tab?
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 11, 2013 2:21 PM (in response to scartacus)
Two words: External Monitor. Preferably non-Apple, very preferably CCFL-backlit. I realize that laptops are convenient but external monitors are cheap and it's way nicer to work on a 20" to 24" screen anyway. Don't hold your breath hoping for Apple to change their ways; they've done just fine by ignoring everyone with eyestrain and concentrating on making monitors whose colors are so brilliant they leap out at you in the Apple store (regardless of the long-term effects on your vision). They just don't care, and they have no reason to care. Look elsewhere. Vote with your pocketbook. I'm writing this on a Macbook Pro connected to an old cheap Princeton CCFL-backlit monitor, and it never bothers my eyes.
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 12, 2013 1:46 AM (in response to mvanier)
I've got a dell at home which which works great. But I'm a writer away from home a lot and need to be able to sit in a hotel room with my computer, for hours on end. Previously this was not a problem with the mid 2010 MBP -- until they swapped out the screen for the LG one, model LP133WX3-TLA4.
Does anybody know what the standard 13 inch MBP screen would have been back in mid 2010? I'm now thinking I need to source one of those and replace apple's replacement.
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 12, 2013 1:33 PM (in response to scartacus)
Want to hear something crazy?
I have had mid 2012 MBA for a 3 month now. First two month I didnt feel any eye strain, then on the January it started to feel uncofortable. In the begining I just thought why I havent noticed it earlier. And now I found something interesting. When I take multi vitamins for a few days, eye strain is just goving away. When I stop using them, my eyes start to feel like ****. So why didnt I notice it earlier? My guess is that it might be related to our lifestyle.
I eate healthy and did some exercise until the end of the year. I had job where I had to move a lot. After losing my job I started to eat unhealthy, more macdonalds and less exercise, in fact I havend done any exercise for a month, and not only my body feels week, my eyes feel too.
So I took bought some multi vitamins for men. Changed my nutrition to much more healthier and pain went away.. Belive it or not, I found the cure for myself.
This is the third hour I am using my mac, and only now my eyes are feeling a little tired, but thats just normal I guess.
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 13, 2013 2:46 AM (in response to maarcs)
I think that general health plays a role since i guess the eye strain is somehow related to the nervous system (as i found out during my research).
Yet in my case this does not hold true. I believe i have the ideal weight for my body, i exercise 1 hour daily, my eating habits are very good, and my medical exams are very good (according to my doctor). Yet i cant look at the new MBP / Ipad2 / iphone 4S for more than 30 mins without getting eye strain, headaches, dizziness, and a burning sense in the face.
Most of my friends are in the opposite physical condition, i.e. eat unhealthy, don't exercise, etc, yet have no symptoms at all either with Apple products or any other products (e.g. Samsungs) that have a led screen.
It would be of interest, if you continue your good eating habits, to tell the forum if in the near future you don't experience any problems with your MBA.
I am extremely disappointed because i am an Apple products user for at least 12 years and now i am forced to look for my computing needs in other brands that don't hurt me. So any contributions are welcomed if it helps to go back to our preferred brand.
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 13, 2013 10:53 AM (in response to maarcs)
It's not crazy at all. I did some research and found out that two carotenoids (lutein and zeaxanthin) are extremely important for good vision. Zeaxanthin, in particular, may be relevant to those of us on this list. It appears to protect the retina from excessive amounts of blue light. I've been taking supplements for a while and also eating foods rich in lutein and zeaxanthin (kale has huge amounts of lutein, and orange bell peppers (but not the other colors) have large amounts of zeaxanthin), and it may be my imagination but my iPhone 4s, which used to hurt my eyes when I looked at it, doesn't anymore. Also, both vegetables are great for juicing if you are into that. It's certainl worth a try if you have eyestrain issues and think that blue light is involved.
Currently Being ModeratedFeb 14, 2013 7:33 AM (in response to mvanier)
I know that there are foods that protect the eyes and i actually eat a lot of spinach and cabbage that contain both lutein and zeaxanthin. But there is a chance that some organisms need larger quantities due to natural deficiency, so in my case i may need more of them, if of course the problem is the blue led light. Do you actually use the iPhone as your main phone i.e. do you use it a siginificant amount of time each day?