1 2 3 Previous Next 30 Replies Latest reply: May 6, 2013 2:30 PM by NJpsychout Go to original post
  • 15. Re: Using without a SIM
    KiltedTim Level 8 Level 8 (37,810 points)

    You do not need to troubleshoot your network to determine the root cause of a networking problem.

     

    Great... hope your day job isn't in IT.

     

    We're not getting past this. Unless you consider being ignored from here on out getting past it.

  • 16. Re: Using without a SIM
    UKenGB Level 2 Level 2 (270 points)

    KiltedTim wrote:

     

    Yet you still refuse to troubleshoot your network...

     

    Good luck with that.

     

    Thanks for the good wishes, but I've just checked again and at this time, all 3 iPhones are connected to the same AirPort, to the same network SSID and hence exactly the same for all 3 iPhones, yet, only the 5 with a working SIM can make use of the network.

     

    I've already explained that even the 3Gs and 4 can connect and indeed receive the correct DHCP info from my server. IOW, the network is actually functioning as it should, but iOS appears to be refusing to then use it.

     

    In the interests of forum harmony and also because I'm kinda intrigued, exactly what network troubleshooting are you suggesting I perform and that I am apparently refusing to do?

  • 17. Re: Using without a SIM
    ChrisJ4203 Level 7 Level 7 (28,180 points)

    The reason I mentioned activation had to do with updating. You mention updating the iOS on the devices and in the end, that would require an activation. This support document http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3406 talks about using the iPhone without a wireless service plan, and I know the SIM does not have to be in the device to use it. Not sure about why the phones would connect to your network, however still not be able to access the Internet. That is as much as I have to contribute.

  • 18. Re: Using without a SIM
    brentfromalresford Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I can clearly see what you are getting at and why you are so irritated with the comments from kilted_Tim which have been far from helpful, technically flawed and he cannot even use correct grammar or the correct words to describe devices on your network (router instead of wireless access point).  I suspect that it is an IOS issue probably caused by the last update, but you need to find out if anyone else is having the same problem, but that might be a long shot, as most people will have SIM cards in their iPhones.

  • 19. Re: Using without a SIM
    UKenGB Level 2 Level 2 (270 points)

    ChrisJ4203 wrote:

     

    The reason I mentioned activation had to do with updating. You mention updating the iOS on the devices and in the end, that would require an activation. This support document http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3406 talks about using the iPhone without a wireless service plan, and I know the SIM does not have to be in the device to use it. Not sure about why the phones would connect to your network, however still not be able to access the Internet. That is as much as I have to contribute.

    Thanks for the input, but the thing is that when an iPhone needs activation, it's quite obvious as you cannot do anything else and these iPhones have worked for a year without change. They are still apparently fully functional, yet no data is passing to or from the network, even though they have clearly communicated with the server for DHCP info.

     

    I'll try to find a working SIM to put in temporarily and see if that makes any difference.

     

    I still really need to know if anyone else is experiencing this or if their iOS 6.1.3 iPhones without SIM are still working normally on the network.

  • 20. Re: Using without a SIM
    NJpsychout Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I'm trying to do the same thing though not advanced with it as UKENGB is.

     

    But I agree with him--it doesn't sound like a router problem if MANY other devices ARE STILL  working on the same network, wired, wireless or whatever.

     

    And as far as garnering points goes, I can't speak for UKenGB but I have, in my limited use of this board, never read a post suggesting point rack up as a reason to post here. Isn't it to get help from other users who MAY have encountered similar situations?

     

    Just asking.

  • 21. Re: Using without a SIM
    ChrisJ4203 Level 7 Level 7 (28,180 points)

    I only suggest it because you mentioned you updated the devices to iOS 6.1.3. That would require the device to be reactivated. Did any of the material in the support document that I provided the link to give you any help?

  • 22. Re: Using without a SIM
    UKenGB Level 2 Level 2 (270 points)

    ChrisJ4203 wrote:

     

    I only suggest it because you mentioned you updated the devices to iOS 6.1.3. That would require the device to be reactivated. Did any of the material in the support document that I provided the link to give you any help?

    In actual fact, an update does not require re-activation. Maybe it does if there is NO SIM, but there is a SIM in each of my iPhones, albeit, non-functioning SIMs. IOW, they cannot provide any sort of Carrier connection.

     

    In any case, my iPhones were not in need of activation, that was not the problem, but thanks for the suggestion.

  • 23. Re: Using without a SIM
    UKenGB Level 2 Level 2 (270 points)

    OK, here's how it is.

     

    I use the SIMless (i.e. no functioning SIM) iPhones as house phones. I run a SIP (VOIP) PBX on my server and a SIP client app on the iPhones so they work as phones around the house. Both myself and my wife have working iPhones as well, also with the same SIP client (Bria, but that's another story). Anyway, that's the function of these 'spare' iPhones and hence they do not need a functioning SIM, but they do need to work on the network here which utilises several dual band AirPort BaseStations.

     

    My reason for starting this discussion was to find out if others were experiencing the same problem as the answer to that question would decide my next step. In the end, I realised the simplest test was to take the SIM out of my iPhone 5 and see how that worked, or not.

     

    What I found was:-

    - Any iPhone with a SIM would work.

    - Without a SIM, it would still work on the 5 GHz 802.11n WiFi network, anywhere in the house.

    - But if I tried to connect instead to the 2.4 GHz b,g,n compatible network on one particular AirPort in my study, it would fail in the manner previously described.

    - Any iPhone would work (SIM or not) on the 2.4 GHz b,g,n compatible network on any other AirPort

     

    So in the end it was a problem with that one AirPort and any iPhone connecting to it on the 2.4 GHz network and without a SIM would not work. I cannot conceive of exactly how or why it would do this, but AirPorts are not unknown to get their knickers in a twist occasionally and a restart usually sorts it out - as indeed it did in this case.

     

    So, the problem is resolved, but can I just end by saying that despite the assertions by KiltedTim, I was not refusing to even look at my LAN. My irritation was simply because that was NOT my question. I purely wanted to know whether anyone else was experiencing this same problem and if not, THEN I would need to investigate my own LAN further to find the problem. This I have now done after establishing that iOS was not to blame (as shown by the fact that the iPhones did work with a different AirPort).

     

    With any forum such as this, it is important that anyone replying takes notice of what has been asked and not just offer simplistic 'solutions' to questions that had not been asked. It is a form of arrogance that implies the OP is in some way stupid and not as clever as the responder, whereas that may not in fact be the case.

     

    Anyway, problem solved and thank you to those who actually offered help.

  • 24. Re: Using without a SIM
    KiltedTim Level 8 Level 8 (37,810 points)

    It was a network problem. What a shock...

  • 25. Re: Using without a SIM
    UKenGB Level 2 Level 2 (270 points)

    KiltedTim wrote:

     

    It was a network problem. What a shock...

    I never said it wasn't. What you don't seem to get is that I was not asking for help to troubleshoot my network. What I wanted to know was whether anyone else was experiencing this problem. You totally failed to answer that question and instead tried to sidetrack the thread into somewhat simplistic network troubleshooting (and personal attacks on my competence - ha). What I tried to do and failed was to get you to understand that simple point.

     

    Have a nice day.

  • 26. Re: Using without a SIM
    KiltedTim Level 8 Level 8 (37,810 points)

    And as you've been told, that constitutes a poll or survey which is prohibited by the TOS.

     

    Apparently your reading comprehension skills need work as well.

  • 27. Re: Using without a SIM
    ChrisJ4203 Level 7 Level 7 (28,180 points)

    UKenGB wrote:

     

    In actual fact, an update does not require re-activation. Maybe it does if there is NO SIM, but there is a SIM in each of my iPhones, albeit, non-functioning SIMs. IOW, they cannot provide any sort of Carrier connection.

     

    In any case, my iPhones were not in need of activation, that was not the problem, but thanks for the suggestion.

    I beg to differ, many of the iOS updates require a reactivation of the device. The devices without the SIM would need one installed, even if it is a non-functioning SIM as you described in your other devices. With those installed they will complete, even though they cannot provide the carrier connection as you describe. It is mentioned in the support document that I provided you.

     

    I also reiterated that using an iPhone without a functioning SIM and even without a SIM installed is possible, and is explained by the support document for users to do it. I believe that actually addressed your original question.

     

    I'm pleased that you discovered the issue and it should provide archive information for any other person searching the forum if there are problems with connecting to the different frequencies in routers.

     

    Good Day.

  • 28. Re: Using without a SIM
    UKenGB Level 2 Level 2 (270 points)

    ChrisJ4203 wrote:

     

    UKenGB wrote:

     

    In actual fact, an update does not require re-activation. Maybe it does if there is NO SIM, but there is a SIM in each of my iPhones, albeit, non-functioning SIMs. IOW, they cannot provide any sort of Carrier connection.

     

    In any case, my iPhones were not in need of activation, that was not the problem, but thanks for the suggestion.

    I beg to differ, many of the iOS updates require a reactivation of the device. The devices without the SIM would need one installed, even if it is a non-functioning SIM as you described in your other devices. With those installed they will complete, even though they cannot provide the carrier connection as you describe. It is mentioned in the support document that I provided you.

     

    I also reiterated that using an iPhone without a functioning SIM and even without a SIM installed is possible, and is explained by the support document for users to do it. I believe that actually addressed your original question.

     

    I'm pleased that you discovered the issue and it should provide archive information for any other person searching the forum if there are problems with connecting to the different frequencies in routers.

     

    Good Day.

     

    I really don't wish to continue this any further, I don't disagree with you, but I did say that re-activation might be required without any SIM at all, however with a non functioning one they do not. Please understand, I've been doing exactly that for years and with the SIM they don't need activation. This is not speculation.


    I did read the doc you linked to, but it told me nothing I didn't already know. The simple fact is though that my problem did not relate to activation. It certainly was odd, but it wasn't any need to re-activate.


    Thanks anyway for your input.

     


  • 29. Re: Using without a SIM
    UKenGB Level 2 Level 2 (270 points)

    KiltedTim wrote:

     

    And as you've been told, that constitutes a poll or survey which is prohibited by the TOS.

     

    Apparently your reading comprehension skills need work as well.

     

    Now you're just trying to be difficult. Give it a rest eh.