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Cannot screen-share between iChat and Messages

3735 Views 12 Replies Latest reply: May 6, 2013 11:36 AM by George Litterst RSS
George Litterst Calculating status...
Currently Being Moderated
Apr 3, 2013 6:51 AM

I have the following computers:

 

--MacMini running 10.6 and iChat

--Mac Pro running 10.7 and Messages

--MacBook Pro running 10.8 and Messages

 

For years (prior to Messages) I have successfully undertaken screen-sharing with other people. Now I find that if I attempt to share the screen of someone outside of my local area network who is running iChat and system 10.6, I can only do this from my iChat computer. The two computers running Messages will fail to establish the screen-sharing session.

 

I have noticed that iChat signs into:

 

login.oscar.aol.com

Port 5190

Require SSL is unchecked

 

The Mac Pro signs into:

 

api.oscar.aol.com

Port 443

Use SSL is checked

 

The MacBook Pro signs into:

 

api.oscar.aol.com

Port 443

Use SSL is unchecked

 

Any ideas as to why screen-sharing should be non-functional between my two Messages computers and another computer running iChat?

  • Ralph Johns (UK) Level 9 Level 9 (66,805 points)

    Hi,

     

    I have the following computers:

     

    --MacMini running 10.6 and iChat

    --Mac Pro running 10.7 and Messages

    --MacBook Pro running 10.8 and Messages

     

    Actually the Mac Pro cannot be doing this.

    Messages Beta in Lion (OS X 10.7.x) was time limited and ran out on 14th December 2012

    It should be running iChat 6.

     

    The server that the Screen Names log in to have no bearing at all on the Video, Audio Only chat or Screen Sharing.

     

    For years (prior to Messages) I have successfully undertaken screen-sharing with other people.

     

    How many Screen Names on how many computers ?

     

    Now I find that if I attempt to share the screen of someone outside of my local area network who is running iChat and system 10.6, I can only do this from my iChat computer.

     

    In this case do you mean outside your Bonjour Area (LAN) or do you mean some ISP node level ?

     

    The next question is how many of your computers are allowed to use the iChat/Messages ports for Video and Audio Chat  through your router ?

     

    If the device is doing UPnP then it should allow Multiple devices to use the same Ports.

     

    Port Forwarding will only allow on IP Address (Computer)

    Port Triggering cannot open the random port Screen Sharing uses.

     

    On some devices using Port Forwarding or Triggering with UPnP will clash.

    UPnP allows the apps to tell the router which ports to open.

    You get an effect like two waiters either side of a swing door.

     

    If the Mac Pro is in fact running OS X 10.8 and therefore Messages both the last two computers will have signed in to iMessages as well

    From what you posted I don't know you are actually working from and AIM valid Buddy List.

     

    Messages can login to AIM, Jabber including GoogleTalk, Yahoo, Bonjour and iMessages

     

    iMessages and Yahoo do not do A/V chats and therefore cannot Screen Share.

    Having said that Messages would invoke FaceTime when trying to Video chat.

     

    Can you Video chat to these Buddies ?

    This will indicate you have enough internet speed at that computer.

    Although Audio chats can be done on Dial up speeds and an Screen Share is an Audio Chat+ it requires the same Internet Speed as a 1-1 Video does at the min speed (128kbps)

     

    In the app  Menu > Preferences > Video Section make sure the Bandwidth Limit is at the 500kbops setting at least.

     

     

     

    3Sigcopy2.png
    10:39 PM      Wednesday; April 3, 2013

     

      iMac 2.5Ghz 5i 2011 (Mountain Lion 10.8.3)
     G4/1GhzDual MDD (Leopard 10.5.8)
     MacBookPro 2Gb (Snow Leopard 10.6.8)
     Mac OS X (10.6.8),
     Couple of iPhones and an iPad

    "Limit the Logs to the Bits above Binary Images."  No, Seriously

  • Ralph Johns (UK) Level 9 Level 9 (66,805 points)

    Hi,

     

    Re 3.

    Is the Airport Base Station doing Port Mapping Protocol ?

    No port have to be set but it does allow multiple computers to use the same ports at the same time (like UPnP on other routers)

     

    Re 4/5

    Being logged in up to 3 times is not the criteria I was after, or rather not to the full extent.

    I was more interested in whether they could all Video Chat.

     

    This would prove:-

    a) the ports in the router were allowing multiple devices. (particularly for Video and Audio but also Screen Sharing)

    b) that the Internet Speed at each computer was actually high enough  (Just being "on-line" does not make it split equally)

    c) as Video chats includes Audio it would cover that angle.

     

    You may need to do a speed test on each machine.

     

    AS of two days ago I went "fibre".

    It is a form called "to the Cabinet" or to the kerbside in some places.

    One computer suggests I am getting around 27Mbps

    Another running Snow Leopard suggests it is only getting 10Mbps

    My G4 running Leopard protests at the Flash version it is running even though it cannot be updated but also comes in at around 10Mbps.

     

    A Non Flash test site is here

    This gave more consistent results across the three computers I have although the Firefox version in Leopard would not run it.

     

     

    3Sigcopy2.png
    9:14 PM      Thursday; April 4, 2013

     

      iMac 2.5Ghz 5i 2011 (Mountain Lion 10.8.3)
     G4/1GhzDual MDD (Leopard 10.5.8)
     MacBookPro 2Gb (Snow Leopard 10.6.8)
     Mac OS X (10.6.8),
     Couple of iPhones and an iPad

    "Limit the Logs to the Bits above Binary Images."  No, Seriously

  • MlchaelLAX Level 4 Level 4 (1,530 points)

    Ralph:

     

    Here is a simpler question:

     

    I used to help other computer user's with their Macs using Screen Sharing in iChat on Snow Leopard and then Lion.

     

    Now that I am still on Lion but others are on Mt. Lion, can I screen share with the Mt. Lion users in some way as convienent as iChat did?

  • Ralph Johns (UK) Level 9 Level 9 (66,805 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 4, 2013 2:32 PM (in response to MlchaelLAX)

    Hi,

     

    Short Answer.

    Yes.

     

    Long Answer.

    However in Messages you get prompted to set up an iMessages account "first"

    This is obviously using an Apple ID.

     

    If this Apple ID was used with AIM before (As in it was issued by Apple and has an @mac.com @me.com or @iCloud .com ending) then it is likely to be an AIM Valid and should be added as an Account.

    Messages has the same + icon at the bottom of the list.

     

    iMessages in a service run by Apple.

    It is Text Chat only.

    Only accounts that can Video/Audio Chat can do Screen Sharing.

     

    Therefore they needs to Add the Accounts they were using before when you could Screen Share with them.

     

    In some cases it may mean the Apple ID is added as the iMessage account AND Again as the AIM account

    (There are other possibles if a Gmail account is also the Apple ID)

     

    If Upgrading rather than new computer then the process should list the previous iChat Accounts in System Preferences > Mail, Contacts and Calendars but need enabling for the Messages app.

     

     

     

    3Sigcopy2.png
    10:32 PM      Thursday; April 4, 2013

     

      iMac 2.5Ghz 5i 2011 (Mountain Lion 10.8.3)
     G4/1GhzDual MDD (Leopard 10.5.8)
     MacBookPro 2Gb (Snow Leopard 10.6.8)
     Mac OS X (10.6.8),
     Couple of iPhones and an iPad

    "Limit the Logs to the Bits above Binary Images."  No, Seriously

  • MlchaelLAX Level 4 Level 4 (1,530 points)

    Ralph Johns (UK) wrote:

     

     

    Therefore they needs to Add the Accounts they were using before when you could Screen Share with them.

    What if they are new to Messages?  How can I screen share with them?  Are you saying I cannot screen share with new users?

  • Ralph Johns (UK) Level 9 Level 9 (66,805 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 4, 2013 2:49 PM (in response to MlchaelLAX)

    Hi,

     

    Opps, my fault.

     

    Once they or you have multiple Accounts in the Preferences > Accounts then an option in the window Menu called "Buddies" appears.

     

    Depending how many Accounts are logged in (Non iMessages ones) then the list that appears when using Buddies is a combined list.

     

    This can be separated out by using the option in Preferences > General section about "gathering all Accounts into one list" and Unticking the box.

    This changes the window Menu to listing each Buddy list with it's own keystrokes

     

    Then it is a case of adding the Buddy to the Correct list  (AIM to AIM or Jabber to Jabber).

     

    Combined Window Menu > Preferences and Buddy list

     

    WindowBuddylistandPref-2.png

     

     

     

    The "Description", partially hidden by the arrow, names the Account in the Preferences List, in the Window Menu and titles the Buddy list.

     

     

    EDIT

    As you say you have one AIM (valid) account for all three computers you have you cannot test Chatting to "yourself" in any format (Text, Video or Audio  Only)

     

     

    3Sigcopy2.png
    10:46 PM      Thursday; April 4, 2013

     

      iMac 2.5Ghz 5i 2011 (Mountain Lion 10.8.3)
     G4/1GhzDual MDD (Leopard 10.5.8)
     MacBookPro 2Gb (Snow Leopard 10.6.8)
     Mac OS X (10.6.8),
     Couple of iPhones and an iPad

    "Limit the Logs to the Bits above Binary Images."  No, Seriously

     

    Message was edited by: Ralph Johns (UK)

  • Ralph Johns (UK) Level 9 Level 9 (66,805 points)

    Hi,

     

    Error Messages were present in iChat 2  (the one called iChatAV in 2004) but only in the Connection Doctor.

    In iChat 3 that appeared as Pop up as well on Chat Failures that could be expanded to see a Log.  (referenced in the end of my signature block).

     

    Apple had chosen SIP (Session Initiation Protocol) to make the connects between two Buddies.

    In iChat 2 and 3 this was using the ports given over to SIP in an internationally agreed standard (ports 5060-5063)

    One port at a time is used and they move upwards until a free one is found.

    SIP phones for VoIP calls and Vonage adaptors also used this protocol.

    Despite the international agreement  many ISPs started to block the SIP ports, presumably due to loss of revenue from Long Distance calls.  (Many said people could pay to have these Ports/services back)

    At iChat 4 Apple moved the iChat app to using port 16402 as first choice for the SIP data.

     

    The logs are still there in Mountain Lion and Messages but it does take a particular sort of chat failure to get them to appear.  (it is more to do with the more common failures seem to be reduced now rather than being non-existent).

     

    Messages is very much iChat with iMessages added on. (and then the Chat Window/Interface change).

    What were iChat "Accounts" are accounts in Messages and you can get the Buddy Lists to display the same way as before.

    The connection Processes are exactly the same.

     

    I have had chats that seemed to be connecting but gave the "Connecting" messages with the spinning cogwheel "forever" but as you say it is a long time since I have seen one like that.

    In those cases the Log is not produced as iChat or Messages does not recognised that the chat has failed.

     

    In cases here this repeatedly happens it is best to start up the app using the Log generation mode in Terminal.

     

    Quit Messages first.

    Open Terminal (Applications/Utilities)

     

    Copy and Paste the Bold text below into Terminal

     

    /Applications/Messages.app/Contents/MacOS/Messages -errorLogLevel 7

     

    This will cause Terminal to Launch Messages and produce a Log whilst doing so.

    It will be quite long before it pauses when the Buddy lists are displayed.

    The Log will be at a point that looks like this when that happens.

     

    201835.893727 CommNAT result:

    External IP: 94.xx.xxx.xx           (editted)

    External Ports: 16403, 16403, 16403

    CNAT_BADTEST ....... 0

    CNAT_ISFULLCONE .... 0

    CNAT_ISPAT ......... 0

    CNAT_ISPATHOST ..... 0

    CNAT_TRYPRESERVE ... 1

    CNAT_PATINORDER .... 0

    CNAT_BLOCKIP ....... 1

    CNAT_BLOCKPORT ..... 1

    CNAT_LOOPBACK ...... 0

    201835.893985 75 routing table entries found.

    201835.894006 IPv4 DEFAULT route, if_idx:5

     

    Then you can start a Video chat and the log will repeat much of what it checked on before (Camera, Mic, Bandwidth etc) and then will start the familiar "log" from the Error messages.

    (you can quit Messages at this point so you are not interrupted by the log getting even longer)

     

    Excerpts  with comments Added

     

    202448.040276 [[SIP/2.0 100 Trying

    Via: SIP/2.0/UDP 94.xx.xx.xx:56634;branch=z9hG4bK6c37d0783ee0572b

    To: "1002" <sip:user@17.219.208.131:16402>   (Apple test Account)

    From: "1001" <sip:user@192.168.0.11:16402>;tag=841964855  (My LAN IP)

    Call-ID: 1e2a9eff6e27c18-a9ef-11e2-adb7-9209b4574012@192-168-0-11

    CSeq: 1 INVITE

    User-Agent: Viceroy 1.4

    Content-Length: 0

     

     

    o=ralph 0 0 IN %RTP-IP-AF% %RTP-IP%  (Lists User Shortname)

    s=1001

    c=IN %RTP-IP-AF% %RTP-IP%

    b=AS:2147483647

    t=0 0

    a=hwi:1056:4:2500

    a=iChatEncryption:NO

    m=audio %ARTP-PORT% RTP/AVP 110 12 124 3 0

    a=rtcp:%ARTCP-PORT%

    a=rtpmap:110 X-AAC_LD/22050

    a=rtpmap:3 GSM/8000

    a=rtpmap:0 PCMU/8000

    a=rtpmap:124 iLBC/8000

    a=fmtp:124 mode=30

    a=rtpID:784352988

    m=video %VRTP-PORT% RTP/AVP 123 126 34

    a=rtcp:%VRTCP-PORT%

    a=rtpmap:123 H264/90000

    a=rtpmap:126 X-H264/90000

    a=rtpmap:34 H263/90000

    a=fmtp:34 imagesize 1 rules 30:352:288

    a=framerate:30

    a=RTCP:AUDIO %ARTCP-PORT% VIDEO %VRTCP-PORT%

    a=fmtp:126 imagesize 0 rules 30:640:480:640:480:30

    a=fmtp:123 imagesize 0 rules 30:640:480:640:480:30

    a=rtpID:308996905

     

    If thre connection is successful and you end it then the Log adds a Bye message (Similar to the Trying one) and then checks its hardware abilities again.

     

    There is much more to the log than I have said here but also much of it is also repeated.

     

    SIP/2.0 100 Trying should be seen before the SIP/2.0 180 Ringing  and the SIP/2.0 200 OK

    You are probably going to looking for endless repeats of the ringing part.

     

    202448.040529 [[SIP/2.0 180 Ringing

    Via: SIP/2.0/UDP 94.xx.xx.xx:56634;branch=z9hG4bK6c37d0783ee0572b

    To: "1002" <sip:user@17.219.208.131:16402>;tag=219266045

    From: "1001" <sip:user@192.168.0.11:16402>;tag=841964855

    Call-ID: 1e2a9eff6e27c18-a9ef-11e2-adb7-9209b4574012@192-168-0-11

    CSeq: 1 INVITE

    Contact: <sip:user@17.219.208.131:16402>

    User-Agent: Viceroy 1.4

    Content-Length: 0

     

    Some of the othe info in the log may prove useful such as the Bandwidth it finds (BWD)

     

    202444.629246 BWD: GotBandwidth: 9080501/23966942 (up/down) @[11.0.168.192:0.255.255.255]

    202444.629266 BWD bandwidth: 9080 kbits up, 23966 kbits down.

     

    I don't need the whole log at this stage just highlights if you think they might point to things.

    I would be keen to see the Bandwidth the app sees as this might be a clue.

    The CommNAT details will also be useful.

     

    You can Quit Messages normally and then Quit Terminal or just Quit Terminal and Confirm the Quitting of processes it is running.

     

     

    3Sigcopy2.png
    8:53 PM      Saturday; April 20, 2013

     

      iMac 2.5Ghz 5i 2011 (Mountain Lion 10.8.3)
     G4/1GhzDual MDD (Leopard 10.5.8)
     MacBookPro 2Gb (Snow Leopard 10.6.8)
     Mac OS X (10.6.8),
     Couple of iPhones and an iPad

    "Limit the Logs to the Bits above Binary Images."  No, Seriously

  • Ralph Johns (UK) Level 9 Level 9 (66,805 points)

    HI,

     

    I have three computers

    One of them is a G4 1Ghz dual Processor tower that had 4 hard drives with one divided in to 2 partitions giving  5 effective "drives" on the Desktop.

     

    This allowed me to have Panther, Tiger and Leopard boots on the G4 and Snow Leopard on my Macbook Pro and then Messages in Mountain Lion on my iMac.

     

    iChat 3 in Tiger had issues in accepting Video Chat invite from Messages although it could send Invites.

    iChat 4 at version 4.0.9 has no issues in either direction in Video or Screen Sharing.

    iChat 5 at version 5.0.3 in Snow Leopard also has not problems.

     

    I have since lost the drive that had the partitions on it and lost the Panther and Tiger boots to test further.

     

    There is no Messages in Lion.

    There was a Messages Beta that ran out on the 14th December 2012 as it was time limited.

    Lion has iChat 6.x.x

     

     

     

    3Sigcopy2.png
    7:31 PM      Monday; May 6, 2013

     

      iMac 2.5Ghz 5i 2011 (Mountain Lion 10.8.3)
     G4/1GhzDual MDD (Leopard 10.5.8)
     MacBookPro 2Gb (Snow Leopard 10.6.8)
     Mac OS X (10.6.8),
     Couple of iPhones and an iPad

    "Limit the Logs to the Bits above Binary Images."  No, Seriously

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