Currently Being ModeratedJun 18, 2013 1:19 AM (in response to abombaci)
The only way to get CoverFlow back to iTunes is that we all share your feelings there: http://www.apple.com/feedback/itunesapp.html
Apple engineers don't read what's on discussions.apple.com, but feedbacks are shared with them.
Maybe, I say maybe, if we're thousands of users asking for CoverFlow back, that may change their minds.
But, considering that Apple is also getting rid of CoverFlow in iOS 7, I think it's a lost cause.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 18, 2013 2:46 AM (in response to iBeb)
I've sent some feedbacks to Apple regarding the removal of Cover Flow in the past months.
If everyone would do so too, then there might be a chance to get it back.
If we do nothing, then it's truly a lost cause. We should not give up, but yell loud for what we want!
Currently Being ModeratedJun 18, 2013 5:34 AM (in response to iBeb)
Thanks for the reminder about sending feedback. Let's keep at it. I really hope a replacement for Cover Flow is in the works. Cover Flow made the old iTunes so much easier and more pleasurable to use.
I re-watched the opening video from the WWDC this morning. I wish the iTunes team would ask themselves this: How did the removal of Cover Flow create delight, love and connection? How did it enhance the joy of playing music?
Removing Cover Flow simplified the code for Apple, but it did not simplify the user experience; iTunes without Cover Flow is a more frustrating experience.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 18, 2013 8:31 AM (in response to Mark Block)
Already did the feedback. I had an issue with my SSD, had to do a complete re-install. So.... Hello 10.7! I'll run with that until Apple forces me to change, or they improve iTunes ( OR... I find a alternate).
Apple needs to reassess what they are doing, I can go elsewhere.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 24, 2013 1:12 AM (in response to abombaci)
Just upgraded and immediate frustration experienced when I realised Cover Flow gone. Really wished that I had searched the Internet first as would never have "downgraded". Have ignored updates for a long time but wanted to hook iPad mini into iTunes on my iMac for backup purposes and could not do so without upgrading. Imagine my horror after the upgrade - especially when I remembered that my iPad is set up to backup to iCloud (only remembered when I saw that the iPad had been backed up yesterday). So...did not need to change anything in terms of my iMac's iTunes. I loved Cover Flow - not only was it totally cool but so easy to use. The sizing of the covers was awesome - gorgeous detail and I did not need to use my glasses because of the size of the covers - bonus! Flipping was easy and quick. Now I have to use my glasses and scan a bunch of icons. What happened to the "visionary" Apple team? Sure, Steve Jobs was a genius but did he not at least employ similarly minded people? I have been an Apple supporter since before the iPod/iPhone/ iPad revolution so am extremely disappointed in Apple at this point. To lose such a funky and useful feature - cannot believe it. So, Apple people, please provide a fix for this problem if only to prove that you actually listen to your customers as you once did.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 27, 2013 4:27 PM (in response to MiniFifi)
Since my original response I've bought new lap top and, you guessed it, installed 10.7 - happy days.
What I really wanted to say today is, Apple don't have to be afraid of reintroducing a feature beloved by the user community. They should take a leaf from Microsoft's book, , and recognise that they can regain the support of an alienated portion of their user community simply by reintroducing coverflow. We'll all gladly move to that version of 11.x and shut up.
If Microsoft can bring back the 'Start' button for their OS, surely Apple can do this for us.
Currently Being ModeratedJun 27, 2013 6:47 PM (in response to Randomman)
It's obvious apple isn't going to reinstall coverflow. Still it would be nice if they could get off their backsides and create something as visually interesting to use wt itunes. Perhaps even something that we have never seen before. One idea might be when you hover your mouse over a tiny album, the artwork would suddenly appear in a three dimensional oversize view. Perhaps even make this view appear retro, and look round like an album or CD. It would use a lot less computation then cover flow, but would remain interesting. I came up wt that, in about ten seconds. I'm sure the so called program developers at apple could come up wt something better, then the terrible itunes 11 downgrade, if they just put their minds to it.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 6, 2013 4:19 AM (in response to greenmind)
"It's obvious apple isn't going to reinstall coverflow." Lets see how far we can drop the stock!
As a long time Apple Stock holder it really DISTURBS me that they don't listen to their customers anymore.
Most likely stock analysts that look at the 58 pages of ******-off customer complaints have downgraded the stock repeatedly, helping fuel the never ending downward fall in Apple stock. Can anybody at Apple connect the dots?
Apple is now taking a very boring path and they have lost the avant-garde artist touch that Jobs brought. The best thing about coverflow was the large and colorful moving artwork that you could actually READ and enlarge! Apple now needs to supply a 10X magnify glass with each copy of iTunes. The cover artwork is so freakin small that is a insult to the Apple customers!
I'm going reinstall the older copy of iTunes for the second time!
<Edited By Host>
Currently Being ModeratedJul 5, 2013 10:54 PM (in response to carto)
I don't think that Apple ever listened to their customers, and this was fine when Steve Jobs ran things. He had a creative mind, and also only hired employees who were creative and ambitious. Capn' Cook .... well not so much. By removing aspects of apple that made it stand out, and not replacing them, with equally unique features, is a huge mistake. A person will not pay $1500 for an imac, when they can get a PC, for less then one third that price, unless it has features that truly stand out. Coverflow was one of those stand out features. I don't expect Tim to listen to his customers, and replace Coverflow, but to realize that itunes is not Windows Media Player, and should not look as boring as WMP.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 8, 2013 7:12 AM (in response to Mark Block)
YOU ABSOOOLUTE (trying hard not to swear) IDIOTS!! YOU REMOVED THE (trying sooo hard not to swear) COVER FLOW FROM IOS!!!
And you made the (again really trying not to swear) music app WHITE! This DRAINS MOORE BATTERY POWER! OMG!
Apple You have gone downhill my friend. And iTunes 11 was the start.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 8, 2013 1:05 PM (in response to Paulhaiz)
I am going back to Snow Leopard, iTunes 10 and will stay on iOS 6. All the new whizz kids at Apple can have fun with the new "cool" features that make the experience so inferior as far as I am concerned.
Perhaps we should start another thread outside of the Apple support website, where we can swear freely at their recent idiotic moves.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 8, 2013 1:26 PM (in response to Paulhaiz)
Paulhaiz, I also miss coverflow, but hasn't itunes been white for awhile, kind of of like the imac, keyboard, and mouse. Still if bringing cover flow back, required a whole new layout, even a black one, then please do it! I absolutely hate the new look of itunes, and I am far being the only one.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 8, 2013 3:51 PM (in response to greenmind)
They don't care. They hold their customers in contempt, and Apple is Jobs criticised what IBM was.
I think it quite poetic that I listed a pile of ideas on here, and they censored them, yet people almost swear and almost curse by the hundreds, and nothing. Seems very strange, that. For all they know, I might control a massive estate and portfolio of Apple shares. I might also be someone who has been treated very badly who is a wreck with much to say and nobody to hear it ready to slice her hand off; they don't know, do they? So if the nannies on here have a problem, at least find a way to be nice about it this time, please, and admit to the occasional good idea perhaps when you see one. I am a customer afterall, and not the one resisting swearing in that other post, or the hundred others like it.
Apple was rotten to the core until it got Jobs back, and they knew it, and they knew that he had the chops they needed and he didn't so they gave him a lot of space.
They withold ideas for no reason other than the only ideas they respect are from their annointed few. It's all theirs. Had Jobs not had them by the receptacle they wouldn't even exist today.
Jobs wanted Apple to be the industry standard, it was his creation and his dream from the outset. These other characters, who knows, but someone in decision making is either too arrogant to care or just doesn't get it.
Apples success is not good for large shareholders, not when they want a diverse portfolio, so the tall poppy must be cut for the sake of the success of the rest. Perhaps all considering that's not such a bad thing afterall. Just a pity we miss out on the promise of exciting innovation to come. Poor Tim, I could almost hear him gulp as he checked back for the audience reaching saying that Apple can still innovate.
The new iOS, it has promise without its skeuomorphism, in cars and inside other devices. But in a tablet, honestly, my lovely antique radio with its lovely wood grain just tries too hard to be a tree instead of the thermionic valves and dusty circuit boards that it is. Jobs gave a ****, he was interested in taste, he actually had some. He held up that print and said "Do you want this!?" and people said "Yes!"
Success itself is their failure, they have the privilege of imposing their idealist software philosophy on the user base. Easy to program? **** yes, without skeuomorphism, what is the need for the core graphics libraries? Why did I even ditch my Windows Mobile 6 phone.... let it just be a phone! Someone doesn't get it. It's the customer, people, do you want this?! Which customer is the correct one? Every customer who shells out a dollar, that's who, so meet all their needs..... "Roses are red, violets are blue, if Apple is to be the new Industry Standard I need all of you!"
This dumb new philosophy on their part (unless they really are shifting market into vehicles and other appliances) kills all of the things which made apple distinctive. Skeuomorphism is why people fell in love with the iPad, it's just that as technology goes, it ramps up everything, so if it's good it's great and if it's not, then it's truly lousy.
They don't want to know. I want to be able to run old code on my ipad, pascal, lisp, prolog and the like, as well as spice and matlab, not so much as to avoid the new world, but to enable the device to demonstrate data structures and paradigm of thought itself, not to mention be able to include the documentation of the history of computing on the ipad alongside the history of, well, everything else.
Instead, I was disparaged and censored; and why? Well that's the real question, isn't it. Why did they single me out, when all of these people are so openly fed up for their competitors to see; for expressing ideas they're not even interested in?
I imagined Apple to be the kind of company who, if you've ever seen the movie The Family Man, scouts new ideas, and rewards it; but they are not. I imagined them to be liberal, and open, and new, but they're not, that's all marketing hype. Jobs had taste. What remains, I wonder how much of it is the old apple that Apple rescued from the ship pointing in the right direction. They don't like to admit they're wrong, they are prejudicial, and confronted with an ordinary person with an idea that everyone says hey, that makes a lot of sense, they censor them. That's not just wrong, it makes no business sense. Managers who can't admit they are wrong and head in a direction which will be successful are the kind who lose companies a lot of money. If you start with a prejudicial world view you will only ever look in the places where you will find what you're looking for. I don't think the 1984 ad was meant to be a user manual.
They're right about skeuomorphism in an OS though, at the very least it should be able to be compartmentalised. So allow users to turn it on and off, duh! The most popular apps are the simulators. I actually want to simulate a piano.... guess what, that's skeuomorphism too; and some metaphor actually is meaningful, and so much so that it dramatically reduces clicks. If you're browsing digital records which were first digitised on a microfiche, then it makes tasteful sense *holding it up in the air.... do you want this?* to have an ipad with skeuomorphic microfiche looking software on it for someone researching local or family history, not just because it's easier to use, but because it is the real historic context of the material itself. Just as it makes sense to read heiroglyphs on a representation of a stone wall, or papyrus, and dare I say it, to have page turns on book software to pay tribute to the original media format, when reading Oliver Twist. Someone clearly doesn't get that. It makes sense to use filters, to represent, filters, slides to represent layers and so on, not just because of the historical context, but because it is visually direct, and makes more sense than stacked rectangles. Who says that a computer tablet is a "stacked rectangle" thing anyway? In a way they're cheapening themselves, limiting what the device can do (just as they claim otherwise) to adhere to an ideal. A modern cityscape is beautiful because it has a blend of modern and old sandstone and granite architecture, and is a tribute to the great skill it takes of an architect to make them work together in the built environment, with the natural environment, to be aesthetically pleasing. Same in a house. Who would say, "Let the house be a house, get rid of the curtains and decorations, just let it be what it is!" Their engineering is great, but the artistic side of their architecture, they've lost that, and not only don't value it, now ridicule it as "blue sky." Well, that kind of artistic blue sky stuff is Apple's market, and talented as their programmers may be at the dark abyss stuff, if they stop embracing the kind of programmer who values both, such as Jobs, then they will fill their studios with engineers who will indeed be able to make their product work 1.1 times as well for 11 times the price. I think they would do better to think of themselves as digital architects, rather than engineers, because they do encompass both art and engineering, because, to do otherwise, to quote Jobs, "lacks taste, in a very big way." Apple is Pixar, not Microsoft.
The motto has changed to "let it be what it is." I think that [and my detractors on here can disparage me all they like for it] the future of expansion of the handheld market is doing for hardware what they did for software. The racing car demonstration suggests that someone in Apple is thinking along those lines.
Reinvent the photocopier, control the radio conrolled plane, get together with partners like Vernier and make data collection and archiving of it as an exciting exercise as data presentation; not "let a computer be what it is." Reinvent interfacing itself, so that people can DO, just like the iPad enabled people to DO with software instead of just watching. I think the future is in Jobs own words, seeing computing as an ecosystem. I have a laptop, I have a phone, I have an ipad.... now how can these be made to work beautifully, easily and seamlessly as though they were a single tool all working on the same task. Ergonomics is another untapped area, and I don't mean in the OH&S sense, I mean fitting machines to human tasks instead of the other way around; so put the giant ipad on a library tabletop and do all of those things. Keep your core market and licence out the application of that market to other hardware. Actually encourage people to design their own hardware, piecing modules together if that's what they enjoy... and they do. So, licence ios to run on modules for the inclusion in other devices and rely on volume to make money. Price it too high and try to rule the world doing everything, and that's pure Soviet Union, the free market way is to find your main niche, do it better than anyone else, keep your core market and licence the rest out so you don't have all your eggs in one basket, and aren't confronted with too many objectives as distractions when you could just buy shares in another company which does that anyway. What did they kill Xserve for? They could have moved it and OSX server into the FileMaker division, and could spin it off if need be as another public company and licenced other companies to make that. At the end I think even Steve forgot some of his own words when he started turning to litigation, "The Problem with Apple isn't Microsoft. The problem with Apple is that it has forgotten who Apple is!"
Beautiful textures on computer cases, hey, that's skeuomorphism, can't do that, we've done a cube, so let's release a tupperware model in a cylinder. A computer pretending to be a food processor? Skeuomorphism? Or a desperate attempt at the finer artistic side of architecture using nothing other than a simple geometric form. It's a computer! Put it in a beige box then.
Just make it beautiful, and separate the skeuomorphic elements from those which aren't. Coverflow isn't flawed, its application was. Albums are back.... skeuomorphism. Collections are back.... skeuomorphism. Isn't itunes meant to be just one big list of songs, not albums? That's not the reality of how anything is consumed.
Some skeuomorphism is also just plain good sense ergonomically. There is no way my mother and technology will ever fit together without it, but someone in their wisdom only wants people who have moved on as their customers. Those people are ANDROID customers and they were never going to hang around a company called Apple. It looks like there were some heroes in Apple waitng for Jobs to move on (not literally, I'm not suggesting anyone is that sinister, but to retire from managerial power at least), so that they could finally do things their way. Well, that's nice for them. It's not why Apple is successful! It's not successful because Jobs adopted some idealistic philosophy, it's successful because *holding it up* "Do you want this?"
There is a simple beautiful way to restore coverflow, and to give it better meaning, and that's to use it to browse and scroll through, yes, beautiful skeuomorphic shelves of horozontally scrolling items. They were so close, they they threw out the baby with the bathwater. Just give skuomorphism, like widgets, a compartmentalised sensible place to be so that it works well; and make that place like newsstand. There's a place to put your little record player, behind the screen splitting in two, and your fake papyrus, your musical instruments, your horizontally scrolling real world looking supermarket shelves, and anything else skuomorphic - an entire class of apps even, widgets grown up! They say that skuomorphism limits. I think it only does that when you limit yourself to that being the only window through which to view things. If you have a rendering engine, why present icons that look like something off of a mac color classic? Make them beautiful, it's what people want. Widgets the same. Why do widgets not work well on Android? Because there are too many of them scattered everywhere. Well, give them a beautiful designed single place to be.... a .... single dashboard layout for the prominant ones, a front page even, and program Siri to look up any other on request. If it's about being what it is, then a tablet is a computer. If as Jobs says what it is is defined by the software, .... rather than by what it is, then make it beautiful and unique and the best device there can be at emulating anything you want, or doing the "what it is" thing.
All why I won't be buying any Apple shares any time soon unless something changes, and here I am saying here Apple, consider this on its merits, here's an audience, see what they think, and for that, this will be called a rant, but it's not, because a rant by its nature is irrational, and everything I am saying here is a qualified remark seeking a positive outlook from a company I have long enjoyed supporting.
And if Apple don't restore coverflow, and don't use technologies such as the clickwheel, there's an interesting little caveat in patent protection, which requires you to use it or lose it, that patents exist to protect innovation, not stifle it. That caveat doesn't even have to exist in the text of the law itself, because it lies at the heart of justice itself, why patents exist in the first place. Third party apps will do it instead. Perhaps that's their idea, to outsource the innovation, draw commission on it and limit their own development.
And besides, I've themed up my new Galaxy Note 2, it's awesome, I can draw on it with my finger, or use the (Newton's) force sensitive pen, which is great for artwork and character recognition.
I guess we're agreed on one thing. Steve Jobs was a brilliant man..... well, perhaps not on that, having rubbished his innovation. Sorry, but it is funny, I'd swear there was someone at Apple waiting for three decades to do something about that damned skuomorphic calculator app who finally got the chance, and took coverflow with it. Jobs wasn't an engineer. He was a true digital architect in every sense of the word. RIP, we all miss ya mate.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 9, 2013 12:22 AM (in response to amphiprion_ocellaris)
Wow!! What a ramble. While some of your comments make some kind of sense, the rest seems to be strangly self serving, and you seem to be in love with the word - skeuomorphism - to say the least.
Still, everyone's entitled to their say I guess.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 9, 2013 2:12 AM (in response to amphiprion_ocellaris)
Well done, and I hope that the person or persons who control this discussion site read this and pass it on?
I get it that this immense tome is constructed to draw attention to the fact that CoverFlow is a brilliant facility that has been consigned to iTunes history. (I hope not)! Even if it is venting your personal feelings regarding Apple, I know that many music, media and computer commentators are predicting an Apple slump, and especially in the music world mainly due to the loss of CoverFlow.
To me this is very sad. My Mac and all its applications have been my bread and butter, but iTunes is a cherished recreational aside.
I do hope that CoverFlow will be re-introduced in a future upgrade.
Again, Apple,… iTunes,… please bring back the CoverFlow?