1 2 3 4 5 Previous Next 67 Replies Latest reply: Jul 31, 2013 10:55 AM by Cartoonguy Go to original post
  • 30. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Cartoonguy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Wow, I can't believe how confusing this is. Indeed it does say that, but I read the part above that flatly contradicts the additional info at the bottom:

     

    Time Machine works with:

    • AirPort Time Capsule's built-in hard drive (any model)
    • External USB hard drive connected to AirPort Time Capsule (any model)

     

    Wha..? 

     

    Googled to find more info on using a second hard drive attached to the TC and found this:  http://store.apple.com/us_smb_78313/question/answers/readonly/can-you-expand-the -time-capsules-storage-capacity-with-an-external-usb-hard-drive/Q7K7DYP4UPXUT27Y Y

     

    The second comment describes it as I wouild expect.  What I don't get is why there would be any issue with this (but I suppose there is plenty I don't understand!).  If Time Machine backs up to a drive attached to your computer by USB, then why would it not correctly back up to a drive attached to the TC by USB?  I don't get why that would even be an issue.

     

    Indeed the Airport Extreme manual says:

    "If you connect a USB hard disk to your AirPort Extreme, you can use the Time Machine

    application to back up all your Mac computers, including your photos, music, movies,

    and documents."

     

    Here's another article that says you can do this:  http://osxdaily.com/2011/06/21/use-external-usb-hard-drive-with-time-capsule/

     

    I'm not trying to challenge your advice, you clearly know what you are doing, but I am trying to show why this is so utterly confusing when so much about Apple is supposed to be simple and easy.  I just don't get why this ie either supported or not supported.  I guess things are just never that simple.

  • 31. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    Cartoonguy wrote:

     

    Wow, I can't believe how confusing this is. Indeed it does say that, but I read the part above that flatly contradicts the additional info at the bottom:

     

    Time Machine works with:

    • AirPort Time Capsule's built-in hard drive (any model)
    • External USB hard drive connected to AirPort Time Capsule (any model)

    Forgive me, but you're not reading it closely -- you're seeing what you want to see, not what's there.

     

    An Airport Extreme is one thing (no built-in hard drive); a Time Capsule is another (built-in hard drive). They look the same, but the old ones have different innards.

     

    Time Machine will back up to a Time Capsule's internal HD or a USB drive connected to it.

     

    Time Machine backups to a USB drive connected to the old Airport Extremes is unreliable and not supported.

     

     

    The new Airport Extremes have new hardware and firmware, and apparently will work with Time Machine.

     

     

     

    If Time Machine backs up to a drive attached to your computer by USB, then why would it not correctly back up to a drive attached to the TC by USB?

     

    It does.  You're mixing Time Capsules and Airport Extremes.

     

     

    Indeed the Airport Extreme manual says:

    "If you connect a USB hard disk to your AirPort Extreme, you can use the Time Machine

    application to back up all your Mac computers, including your photos, music, movies,

    and documents."

    Again, that's the NEW manual for the NEW Airport Extreme.

     

    See if you can find that here:  Airport Extreme Setup Guide (early 2009 models).

     

     

    Here's another article that says you can do this:  http://osxdaily.com/2011/06/21/use-external-usb-hard-drive-with-time-capsule/

    Yes, TIME CAPSULEs.

     

    Clear now?

  • 32. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Cartoonguy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    You are being very patient and helpful and I really appreciate that. 

     

    Okay, so I thought you were referring to Airport Extreme because it's the same thing, but it's not.  So since my issue is using an attached drive for back up with a Time Capsule, then I am good to go with even the older 500gb model if I am using it strictly as a NAS to the attached drive, which I already own.  That is, the internal drive may be older and theoretically not a great idea to use, but my attached 2 TB drive is pretty new, so that plan works. 

     

    Sounds like that's what you mean when you say, "Yes, TIME CAPSULEs".

     

    Thanks!

  • 33. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Cartoonguy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    UPDATE!  I got a used first gen 500GB Time Capsule and set it up, wired, in my basement with my 2TB external drive plugged into it.  Delighted with how easy it is to set up and use compared to setting up any other router I have used.  It figured out that it needed to bridge with my existing network and just did it.  Nice. 

     

    I had to wipe my exisitng backup in order to use the drive with Time Capsule, so it is presently creating a brand new back up from scratch.  My internal drive on my Imac is 2TB with about 1.3 TB used, so it's a big back up. 

     

    One question I have about this.  It is doing the back up, over ethernet, and it is very, very slow.  It 's been going about three hours now and is only about 10% done.  Is it normal for the back up to take this long?  I am using gigabit ethernet connections.  I know it's going to be slower than direct connection by USB, but is this kind of time normal? 

  • 34. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    The router does support gigabit Ethernet, but not to the internal HD or attached USB drive. 

     

    That usually runs, very roughly, somewhere in the area of 20-35 GB per hour, overall (slower at first).

     

    There is a finagle to do the first backup while directly attached.  See the blue box in #Q2 of Using Time Machine with a Time Capsule.

  • 35. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Cartoonguy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Just found this discussion with answers by the ever helpful Pondini:  https://discussions.apple.com/thread/3969333?start=0&tstart=0

     

    So according to this, the transfer rate Pondini says is expected, is about what I am getting.  Just surprised it's that slow, but I guess ethernet is much slower than direct connection.

  • 36. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Csound1 Level 8 Level 8 (35,420 points)

    That's about average, especially for the first time, just let it run.

  • 37. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Cartoonguy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Pondini wrote:

     

    The router does support gigabit Ethernet, but not to the internal HD or attached USB drive. 

    Gosh, I can't get my head around why that would be.  Data gets to the TC at gigabit speed, so then what happens between the TC ethernet port and the internal drive to slow it down?  I would have thought that was the last place to slow the connection down.  Am I right in assuming that ethernet is going to be faster than wifi, or is there some surprising reason why that isn't the case?

     

    Good tip about doing the backup from a direct connection, but as it's going, I guess no harm in just leaving it do it's thing all day and night.  Useful to know if I ever need to do a system restore though.

  • 38. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Csound1 Level 8 Level 8 (35,420 points)

    Cartoonguy wrote:


    Am I right in assuming that ethernet is going to be faster than wifi,

    WiFi is glacial, don't go there.

  • 39. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    Cartoonguy wrote:

    . . .'

    Gosh, I can't get my head around why that would be.  Data gets to the TC at gigabit speed, so then what happens between the TC ethernet port and the internal drive to slow it down? 

    I don't know enough about it, but I suspect it just isn't a priority -- Apple expects most backups to be done via WIFI, which tends to run at 10-15 GB/hour overall over a good connection for an initial backup, so there's not much point to making it fast.  And you've got a 1st gen; later versions are supposed to be faster, but I don't know how much.

  • 40. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Cartoonguy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    So it finally finished.  Hurray.  Now I notice something different.  When the Time Machine backup was directly connected to my computer, I had a backup with folders that I could, if need be, manually open and see the files.  Not that I wanted to, but just in case there was some software mess up, I could alwasy get at these files in the mormal way.  Now, however, using Time Capsule, there is just this one massive file called a Sparse Disk Image Bundle.  So now I totally have to rely on Time Machine, which mostly want, but why is it different using Time Capsule?

  • 41. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    The reason seems to be, since Disk Utility (and other such apps) can't see a network drive directly, Time Machine creates a sparse bundle disk image on it.  That it can mount, and open, then read and write to.  

     

    So can you.  Double-click the sparse bundle.  The "Time Machine Backups" disk image should appear on your Desktop and/or Finder sidebar after a moment or two.  Double-click that to open it, and you'll find the usual Backups.backupdb folder and contents inside.

  • 42. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Cartoonguy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Very interesting. Thanks.  I actually restarted my computer and now I have the Time Capsule in the Shared section on my Finder as well as a mounted drive under Devices called Time Machine Backup.  So that must be what you mean.  In there, it looks as I expect. 

  • 43. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    Cartoonguy wrote:

    . . .

    as well as a mounted drive under Devices called Time Machine Backup.

    That's the disk image.  But since it's on a network, unlike a directly-connected drive, it won't be there at all times.  TIme Machine will connect to the network drive and mount the sparsebundle it when it needs to do a backup, but when it's done, dismount it and disconnect from the drive.  That's just how network drives work.

     

    It will also connect and mount it when you Enter Time Machine, if it's the current destination named on the TM Preferences panel.

     

    But if you want to look via the Finder when it's not already mounted, you'll have to do that manually.

  • 44. Re: How to create a network available drive
    Cartoonguy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Wow, now I really feel like a Time Capsule/Time Machine expert thanks to Pondini!  Cheers!  Again, appreciate your time filling me in with all these details about how this works.