9 Replies Latest reply: Sep 24, 2013 5:45 AM by Zhiro
Zhiro Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

Brand new Airport with 3TB Time Capsule (and also a brand new quad-core Mini).  Almost every time I copy something over the network to the ATC's internal drive (from either my new Mini or my old one), it begins the copy and then stalls for quite some time at some midpoint of the progress bar. 

 

Is this normal?  Or a normal problem with a known solution?

 

Or am I complicating things by having both a wired gigabit connection AND an Airport N connection live at the same time?  That is, I have Airport turned on for both my Minis, connected to the Airport Time Capsule, AND I have ethernet cables connecting both my Minis to the gigabit ports of the ATC.  Is this not only redundant (which I wouldn't mind) but counter-productive/causing the stall?

 

I.e., isn't an ATC smart enough to use the fastest available connection method without stepping on its own toes?  Isn't Mac OS X smart enough to prevent that too?

 

Thanks in advance for any useful insights!

 

(As a side-point, I have NOT yet configured Time Machine to back up my Minis to the Time Capsule - I'll be doing that later after I've got each Mini's role on my network sorted out.  So Time Machine activities are NOT part of the problem I've describing above.)


Airport Time Capsule 802.11ac, OS X Mountain Lion (10.8.4)
  • 1. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    LaPastenague Level 8 Level 8 (35,375 points)

    Or am I complicating things by having both a wired gigabit connection AND an Airport N connection live at the same time?  That is, I have Airport turned on for both my Minis, connected to the Airport Time Capsule, AND I have ethernet cables connecting both my Minis to the gigabit ports of the ATC.  Is this not only redundant (which I wouldn't mind) but counter-productive/causing the stall?

     

    Dual paths are not redundant.. they mess things up.. simply turn off the wireless.

     

    If you are copying a single large file the whole copy should proceed at full speed.. if the copy includes lots of little files it will slow down considerably.. TC is not efficient way for storing small files.. and over network there is a lot of time spent dealing with the file allocation etc.

     

    Do a test with a single file of say 3GB and see what happens.

     

    I.e., isn't an ATC smart enough to use the fastest available connection method without stepping on its own toes?  Isn't Mac OS X smart enough to prevent that too?

     

    It should.. you put the ethernet to the top of the order in the network area.

     

    Screen shot 2013-09-21 at 11.48.20 PM.png

     

     

    Just use the bottom icon and set the order.

     

    Screen shot 2013-09-21 at 11.48.35 PM.png

     

    But my experience is that having both wireless and ethernet working to the same location even with the order correct still causes issues.

     

    (You see I have wireless and ethernet active and in the right order.. but the wireless is to access my bridged modem and has no effect on speed to the TC, it is a different IP range.)

     

    TM works better than just straight copying a lot of small files.. but it can still be slow in the middle of a backup as a lot of system files are small.

  • 2. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    Zhiro Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Brilliant.  I really appreciate your knowledge, experience, and advice. 

     

    My file copy jobs aren't generally thousands of small files, usually just various things I want stored in a common area (either temporarily or long-term), and often a multiple gig movie file.  These movies were exactly what was stalling before, and transferring smooth as silk now that I've turned off the wireless. 

     

    Thanks so much!

  • 3. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    Zhiro Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Spoke too soon.  The problem has recurred even while all my gear is only connecting by ethernet.  A 5.46 GB file copies for a while, then stalls at the halfway mark for quite a while, then starts making progress again, then stalls again.  If it bears out to previous experience, it'll get the whole file transferred within 25-30 minutes, which is about 3-4 times as long as it should take. 

     

    Once it stalls, I find I can give it a little "boost" by opening a folder on the Time Capsule to view.  It takes about a solid minute for that folder to reveal its contents, and then the copy progress will spurt forward a bit, and then stall again. 

     

    Any ideas?  I've noticed my ATC drive seems to spin down at the drop of a hat - might that be part of the problem / configurable anywhere?

  • 4. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    LaPastenague Level 8 Level 8 (35,375 points)

    Ok.. you have another different bug in effect.. that is the TC and Mountain Lion have no love for each other.

     

    For the disk to spin down during a backup or file copy something is badly severely wrong.

     

    You have no control of the TC disk spin down.. heck you have almost no control of the TC period. Apple cut out what little controls were available in earlier firmware and airport utility.

     

    But I would ensure that there is never path confusion.. even having the wireless connect leaves a setting in the arp table on the computer.

     

    I would setup the TC all over from factory.

     

    Make sure all names are short (2-20 characters), no spaces and pure alphanumeric.

     

    Unfortunately that is also required on the computer.

     

    The TC can have some issues if it is in bridge. Exactly how do you have it setup in the network??

     

    Do the test with a single large file.. if it stalls, ensure other computers are not using the TC at the same time.. and also test from a second computer. See if it stalls..

     

    Tell us how you do.

     

    BTW do you have ipv6 turned on and set to local link for the ethernet port on the computer.

     

    This is now a requirement at least for the setup and may well help the computer keep track of the TC.

     

    http://support.apple.com/kb/TS4597

  • 5. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    Zhiro Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Hey, this all sounds pretty dire, but thanks for your attention to it.

     

    My network's very simple now.  I actually bought my new Time Capsule primarily to serve as a gigabit router, so I've got two Minis connected to it by 3' ethernet cables.

     

    The stall has been occurring (sometimes) from either Mini, my 009 running (a sparkly fresh install of) Lion, or my new 012 running Mountain Lion.

     

    When you say "Make sure all names are short... that is also required on the computer," which are the salient "all names?"  Surely you don't mean every file on the volumes, so which do you mean, exactly?

     

    I'm running DHCP with Manual addresses, but just now changed the IPV6 setting as you mentioned.  I'm hoping that might be the key variable, so I'll post lately to let you know either way. 

     

    If I can't iron out the problem, should I consider this a potential warranty issue?  I.e., if the behavior has been "badly severely wrong" since I set it up to begin with, might I be aiming toward trying to exchange the product?

     

    But either way, I'll post later once I have more results.

  • 6. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    LaPastenague Level 8 Level 8 (35,375 points)

    The name issue is not files.. it is the network names.

     

    Check out this one for more info.

     

    http://pondini.org/TM/C9.html

     

    Although Pondini is more concerned about Time Machine .. the network bugs also affect that.

     

    Apple have used those strange names since forever but they are not doing it any favours.

     

    I have to admit I come out of the "Rest of the World" network and to me all names should be short as possible.. certainly no spaces.. and absolutely no apostrophe or special characters. Since you are having these issues.. conforming to the fundamentals of networking is a good idea.

     

    I'm running DHCP with Manual addresses

     

    I would not do that.. If you want fixed IP use the dhcp reservation in the TC.

     

    If I can't iron out the problem, should I consider this a potential warranty issue?  I.e., if the behavior has been "badly severely wrong" since I set it up to begin with, might I be aiming toward trying to exchange the product?

     

    Sure.. I would indeed have rung apple support since yesterday. It is their problem.. you have brand new equipment which doesn't work to spec.. and you have bought from single source supplier to ensure you would not have to do this kind of windows world junk. You have every right to be upset. Premium products should "just work" .. but this new TC is a big change for apple.. it is the first new .. in the sense of whole product change since TC was introduced.. it is like going from powerpc to intel. which is infact what they have done.. they are rewriting the firmware to match the old TC for a completely different processor. The issues will be fixed up in a couple of hardware revisions and about 5 firmware updates.. I am sure. Whether your one will be.. I don't know.

  • 7. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    Zhiro Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I've always used short simple network names - I'm also kinda old-school - so that was no issue.  Your response was very broadly informative though - I didn't realize these new Airports and Time Capsules were drastically new hardware.  (I thought they were a second generation of newer hardware, and thus I expected the bugs to have been worked out.)

     

    Anyway, the really good news is that it seems the ipv6 setting was the culprit.  It was on Automatic, now it's on Link Local Only (on both my Minis) and I haven't had any hiccup at all (with either of my Minis) since I changed the setting two days ago.  Just copied over a dozen iTunes TV episodes totalling over 15GB and there was no problem at all (besides numerous other copies since I changed the setting).  So I really do think we've found the culprit. 

     

    And I couldn't thank you enough!

  • 8. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    LaPastenague Level 8 Level 8 (35,375 points)

    Hi.. thanks for reporting back.. it helps me to know which of the config changes are important.. I would not have thought ipv6 vital to anything other than the initial setup. Even I am surprised it needs to be turned on to get good file transfer speed.. Tell us please if it suddenly changes again but excellent result.

  • 9. Re: Why does copying to my Time Capsule internal drive stall?
    Zhiro Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Yeah, I thought you'd want to know.  I hadn't even gotten around to disabling the DHCP Manual Addressing yet.  I might, at some point, turn the Wireless connections back on just to see what happens when they're run alongside the wired connections (though I'll keep the wire higher in the network priority list, of course. It'll only be on my MacBook - sometimes wired, sometimes not - where it'll actually be useful in practice to keep them both on in the Network settings ). 

     

    Most importantly, I wanted to add to our solution that it didn't even require rebooting of any of the hardware involved.  The 2012 Mini got rebooted this morning for other reasons, but it had already demonstrated improved performance before that.  And I'd been meaning to reboot the ATC, but hadn't gotten around to it yet.  So it really seems you hit the nail perfectly on the head, and the systems involved new what to do once we'd done so.  Thanks again, and hope this will all help someone else someday as well.