Currently Being ModeratedOct 8, 2013 6:00 PM (in response to ArtechokiQ)
ArtechokiQ, Kvoth posted a generic e-mail address in an earlier post, can you find that and e-mail him so we can add you to our core group? We have some ideas and are gathering efforts to make some progress on specifics like communication and representation of our cause.
Also, I wanted to add that Kvoth is asking about strabismus because glasses with Prism seem to have helped him over the last year. Ironically before he brought this up to me my optometrist was considering adding prism to my glasses as well so I will report on that when it happens.
I can apreciate Strapontin inputs as well, but I agree manufacturers are attempting to correct this issue because the first to do so has one **** of a marketing strategy for eye strain! The core issue is complicated because LED lighting is new and both spectrum and modulation depth are issues. If it were simple it would be done already.
Also, even if the information repeats itself this forum is important. There is a core group of people here who have discussed their way through many topics to develop a much clearer picture of the root causes. If one person finds even one thing they can share to make thing's better they can help a great number of people all at once.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 3:00 AM (in response to Kine)
Just a comment on eink. I recently purchased Kindle (the one WITHOUT the backlight) and i got eye strain after 30 mins of reading. I suspect it is not only backlight that is causing the problems. I read somewhere in the net that Kindle uses some kind of process to create more variations of grey in order to show better black&white pictures. Isn't this process called dithering? It seems to be the common denominator of both eink and backlight displays and causes me dizziness and eye strain.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 3:37 AM (in response to Exandas)
I'm actually a bit surprised to know that the traditional Kindle is causing problem.
As far as I know, Kindle's screen is completely static, it doesn't flash nor flicker when it's not flipping pages. In fact I think the response speed of the screen isn't even fast enough to create that troublesome flicker that we all dislike.
Dithering is kind of using some scartered dots to mimick more shades of a color (in this case, grey). This technique exists in normal printed materials as well, which, I believe shouldn't cause any problem unless the characters are highly dithered which might decrease the sharpness of fonts and make the eyes harder to read the words (I doub't Kindle does that to the fonts, though).
I am wondering if it would be other things that was causing your eye strain while using the Kindle.
e.g. Since the Kindle basically reflects the lights inside your room, is the general lighting in your room comfortable? Also, is the light level bright enough? Cause we generally need more lights when reading on a reflective device.
Sometimes, I think the environmental lightings plays a part in our eye strains too.
Kindle doesn't flicker and doesn't emit blue light, but of course, I can't deny the fact that the Kindles might have other issues causing eye strains... then we will have even more variables to look after.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 3:47 AM (in response to Exandas)
This is a non-flickering kind of dithering as opposed to temporal dithering. It seems you have a problem with light patterns. Looking at this pic might feel uncomfortable to you:
Try moving your eyes very slowly as you look at the pic and notice of you get dizzy.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 4:30 AM (in response to Dovez)
Yes i feel uncomfortable. What is this? Is this a certain eye condition?
I tested the Kindle under many light conditions. I felt dizzy under all lightning conditions. What is strange is that my old Sony reader felt like reading a paper book.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 4:53 AM (in response to Dovez)
That image is horrible to look at. But does that prove anything?
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 5:05 AM (in response to Exandas)
I can hardy believe that the Kindle uses any kind of dithering. It sure would eat a lot of battery thus undermining the whole idea of E Ink power saving. What I think is that your lights at home are the cause for feeling dizzy. To prove this, you should try reading under pure sun light only. No artificial light of any kind nearby, no office lighting, not even a computer monitor or smartphone display in the same or even next room. No multiple socket lights, no clock radio, no nothing. Then you should not feel any difference to reading a paper book.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 5:49 AM (in response to David Turnough)
But did the image cause the same dizziness as eink, Exandas?
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 5:56 AM (in response to Dovez)
I've certainly noticed that my symptoms are worse under high contrast, with white text on black backgrounds being much much worse.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 7:36 AM (in response to David Turnough)
Ok, so the old Kindle's should not be a problem for most people who are sensitive to light and flicker alone, I would recomend reading your Kindle under incandescent light or natural light of course. The new Kindle Fire is LED back lit and if you search there are threads out there where people are puzzling the same exact thing's as we do here about why it bothers them.
Here is a concept I have not seen brought up here http://irlen.com/index.php
There are some people who have issues with text and focusing on text and it sounds like some of you here may have this problem. I don't endorse the Irlen website however there is some compelling information there. Also, one of the most common symptoms of Irlen happens to be light sensitivity, it could be some of you would benefit from researching this medical condition which is recognized by the medical community.
I myself have determined the Irlen ,methods of filtered (colored) lenses will not help me through trial and error, another avenue to try a colored lens is here as well if you would like to do that: http://healthcare.utah.edu/moran/patient_care/fl_41.php
The tint appears to help those who suffer the occasional migraine IMO, it had no effect on my sensitivity to LED lighting.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 8:05 AM (in response to Exandas)
I imagine dithering on eink creates something similar to but a lot smaller than the pattern picture that made you dizzy. I find dithering the only plausible explanation for your problems with it.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 9:10 AM (in response to Dovez)
So if the rumors are true and Apple uses IGZO for the new macbook displays, could this be an improvement for us eye strain sufferers?
Currently Being ModeratedOct 9, 2013 9:16 AM (in response to azure8)
If I understand the IGZO technology correctly, the screen should be stable at the matrix level. However, that doesn't rule out the fact that the backlight will still be powered by bright and blue PWM controlled LED...
Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Currently Being ModeratedOct 10, 2013 12:02 PM (in response to RMartin111)
There is reflective lcds coming in the future. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdXu9jmTI2A I hope it doesn't take too much time, since i am one of the people who can't resist lcd:s anymore. 10 mins is max i can tolerate, and i am on the computer just to post this post. Last year i bought ipad retina and it didn't take long that i started to experience many different symptoms besides regular eye strain and headaches. (Ie. throat issues, nausea, and symptoms occur nowadays fast) Sometimes only lighting can make me feel weird, and talking to the phone makes me nauseous (I do have old nokia from early 2000's, that has no colors. At least i am able to use that. New smartphones are too hard for me to handle symptomwise.