7 Replies Latest reply: Jan 12, 2014 4:11 AM by LaPastenague
iBozz Level 1 Level 1 (90 points)

There seem to be a number of problems cited with Time Machine since Mavericks came out - and I have one too.

 

I hope it hasn't been asked before, but mine seems a slightly different problem than others posted, but i apolgise of I have overlooked a similar post.

 

Time Machine, according to System Preferences, backs up as expected, except that it takes an inordinate amount of time (more than 18 hours each time) and then spends several more hours "verifying" the back up.

 

And yet, when I enter Time Machine though my menubar icon - there is no back up there, only "Now" shown.  All other "pages" are dark grey and contain no data.

 

And this despite System Preferences showing that there is only 27.6GB of 2TB available with the amount available decreasing after each alleged back-up.

 

I assume from this that all my previous back-ups are still there, accounting for the majority of the 2TB being "unavailable" and that, as the amount available appears to decrease slightly each time that System Preferences at least "thinks" that an incremental back-up is indeed being created. 

 

Right now, for the current back-up process, System Preferences states that 551.0MB of 5.34GB is being backed up and I would expect this to take several hours to complete and then even more time to complete the verification process!

 

I have checked Pondini's most excellent website but it appears to not yet address Mavericks problems so, before doing anything stupid and/or fatal, I though I'd seek advice on these august and highly esteemed forums!

 

My sparesebundle appears to be as it should, or at least I can see it where I expect it to be but clearly entering Time Machine either does not find it or does find it but cannot read it.

 

I don't want to lose my earlier backups by doing anything hasty and stupid as they contain some archived files which I would hate to lose.

 

I back up to the Time Capsule via a wireless link from the 2009 quad-core i7 iMac with 1TB HD (capacity 985.32GB with 235.27GB available according to System Information) to my NetGear DG834G router and then by Ethernet cable to the Time capsule.

 

I doubt that t is relevant, but I jumped straight from Snow Leopard 6.8 to Mavericks without going via the two Lion versions in between.

 

 

 

And what chance, do you think, that this is merely a bug which will be addressed by Mavericks.1?  My "Mac only" ISP opines that that update is imminent as the beta has been floating around "the trade'.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Message was edited by: iBozz to correct an embarrasing number of typos - I blush with shame and have no doubt missed even more.


iMac, OS X Mavericks (10.9), 16GB RAM; 1TB HD
  • 1. Re: Time Machine/Capsule failure under Mavericks
    LaPastenague Level 8 Level 8 (35,375 points)

     

    I have checked Pondini's most excellent website but it appears to not yet address Mavericks problems so, before doing anything stupid and/or fatal, I though I'd seek advice on these august and highly esteemed forums!

     

    James.. the guru of the TM KB died recently.. and very sadly.. his contribution to the community is greatly missed.. we are on our own with Mavericks and its appalling TM update.

     

     

     

    And what chance, do you think, that this is merely a bug which will be addressed by Mavericks.1?  My "Mac only" ISP opines that that update is imminent as the beta has been floating around "the trade'.

     

    We should expect a fix for TM.. as it has a list of bugs as long as your arm.

     

    You need to learn to restrain yourself and wait for all the other poor sods and mugs  beta testers to finish.

     

    In the meantime.. as I think a remarkable number of these problems have to do with backups over the network.. plug a USB drive into you iMac and use that as the target.. Local disks have always been more reliable and cheaper and faster than the TC.

     

    Or use another backup software for the time being.. you will still need a different backup target if you don't want to lose your existing TC backups. CCC is good but there are several others available.. they tend to use a far more simple and direct approach.. ie they work.. where Apple's hugely complex TM is great when it works.. which it did very well in Snow Leopard.. !! Since Lion it has suffered along with the network issues of the TC.. to make it less of the reliable backup it should be.

  • 2. Re: Time Machine/Capsule failure under Mavericks
    bg3po Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)

    i had this same issue, i had to go remove the disk in my time machine preferences, turned off time machine then restarted and re-add the disk to time machine preferences and there was my dates and time machine images

    good luck

  • 3. Re: Time Machine/Capsule failure under Mavericks
    iBozz Level 1 Level 1 (90 points)

    Thanks, LaPastenague and bg3po, much obliged.

     

    I don't normally adopt version n.0 of anything as I too want others to do the live debugging for me, but I went [too?] early to Mavericks because the syncing on iCal and Calendar via iTunes and Snow Leopard often produced bizarre items, discussed here.  The only solution appeared to be Mavericks and iCloud which, in so far as syncing my calendars is concerned, now works just fine.  I am of an age whereby if it isn't written down then I don't do it and having two differing calendars was not conducive to a nice relaxing, yet busy, retirement!

     

    But I digress.

     

    I am comforted by the fact that I am not alone in experiencing this debacle as it at least eliminates the "idiot factor" and I am also heartened to think, I hope not rashly, that all my back-ups are still there, albeit invisible just now.

     

    I tried bg's preferences/on/off suggestion but, alas, the situation is as before and I can still not see my back-ups.

     

    I have the seriously important files on DropBox and external devices so I shall just have to possess my soul in patience until Apple sort this out.

     

    Thanks for the advice.

  • 4. Re: Time Machine/Capsule failure under Mavericks
    iBozz Level 1 Level 1 (90 points)

    I'm still experiencing back-up failures even though everything seems to be working as normal.

     

    By that I mean that it goes through the motions of backing up and yet when I enter my TC all I can see is the current position.  Although panels are present disappearing into the distance and there is a timeline up the right side of the screen all the panels are black and empty.

     

    System Preferences show that there is 23.4GB of 2TB available and that the last back-up took place earlier today so System preferences can clearly "see" my sparseimage file and also thinks it has backed up as needed.

     

    And yet I can't see any of the backup panels in TC.

     

    I've tried several things, including sacrificing a piebald goat and wearing the entrails whilst travelling three times round the city walking backwards whilst wearing flippers and uttering anciant incantations such as "What is Bill Gtes?" (I'm not quite sure how the Magistrate will accept my plea of insanity) but all attempts to resolve this problem have failed.

     

    I know all about the "wi-fi" cautions when using TM/TC but it really is the best option for me - if, of course, I can get it to work!  To move the TC within cable reach would be a serious "geographical" inconvenience.

     

    I back-up from a 27" quad-core i7 iMac running under MacOSX9.1 Build 13B42 wirlessly to a NetGear DG834G router and then to the TC via an ethernet cable.  Until Mavericks (the worst ever iteration of OSX?) it all worked just fine but since I upgraded all back-ups have - well, I don't know if they've worked, failed, are non-existent or are merely hiding from me.

     

    Can anyone help me get rid of the need for these goat entrails?  They are beginning to stink a bit now! 

  • 5. Re: Time Machine/Capsule failure under Mavericks
    LaPastenague Level 8 Level 8 (35,375 points)

    In all honesty you need a reliable backup.. buy CCC and pay the fee.. a most reasonable $40 or so.

     

    It is very good.. maybe not going to be as easy as TM to migrate etc.. but for the moment what you need is reliable backup.

     

    A USB drive to make an image to.. a bootable image also eliminates a lot of the potential problems of a corrupted disk.. USB drives are cheap enough it is worth buying one for every computer.. and create the disk image with CCC.

     

    I suspect your TC simply doesn't have enough space left.

     

    23GB is IMHO not sufficient to allow TM to make reliable backups.. it should have spit out an error. The drive cannot be full.. TM works by copying files to the TC before loading them in some way and needs a fair bit of free space to do so.

     

    IMHO to get TM working with any sense this is going to incrementally backup you should archive off the old backup on the TC, erase the TC and start afresh.

     

    Don't forget to load the widget as that should still work and show you what is happening from the Log created by TM.

     

    I also noted you are backing up files to dropbox..

    These are stored locally until sent and should NOT be included in the local TM backup.

     

    TM sees the dropbox as a single file.. change one 1KB file in it.. and TM will need to backup however many GB you have in the dropbox.

    Every single time.

  • 6. Re: Time Machine/Capsule failure under Mavericks
    iBozz Level 1 Level 1 (90 points)

    Thanks, LaPastenague.  If I may trespass on your good will?

     

    I shall take on board the CCC and USB drive, etc. option suggested and intend going down that route in the near future but I would like to try and get the TC working as well if I can.  I once irrecoverably lost the entire contents of my HD without having a back-up and, believe me, doing that makes you feel both exceptionally paranoid and exceptionaly stupid - especially as my trade was freelancing in [mainframe] computer security and my constantly telling clients of the essential need of creting usable back-ups! 

     

    I do have TechTool Pro's eDrive installed so recovery of data from a failed HD is theoretically possible barring a Doomsday event - fingers crossed!

     

    1) My understanding, being an iBozz of very little brain, is that TC deleted the oldest iterations when space was exhausted and thus constantly deleted old back-ups to make room for current back-ups - a sort of Grandfater, Father, Son system but going back well back trhrough the family history!  So why is mine seemingly not doing that?

     

    2) Even if my system is failing to operate as in 1 above (assuming that my understanding is correct) then why can I not "see" the various iterations when I enter TC?

     

    3) The cessation of the smooth operation of TC coincided with my upgrade from Snow Leopard to Mavericks - is that cause and effect or merely an amazing coincidence that that upgrade occurred at the same time as the TC became "full"?

     

    4) Archiving off the old backup would require, presumably, an external drive of 2TB - or am I missing the point?  I'm not aware of anything in the sparseimage file that I would ever need to restore but you never know, there may be something there I really want at some time in the future.  Currently I cannot access that file, so is keeping it worth while if it means buying storage of 2TB?

     

    5) If I attach the TC via cable for a short while (that would be a right royal pain in the fundament but I could live with it for a short time), is it likely that I could then see the iterations properly?  And, if so, could I then prune them by deleting some of the older ones to create more space so that it reurns to usual operation?

     

    6) I know that second guessing Apple is a non-starter, but do you think that my problem is a Mavericks problem which Apple will address in a future update - or is it a "failure" of TC generally due to the TC being "full" and the problem will remain?  No-one else, apart from bg3po who has happily resolved their similar issue,  seems to have joined this thread saying they have the same problem so I do wonder if it's "unique" to me for some reason.

     

    You said earlier that TC and Mavericks was a dog's breakfast of problems, in which case I'm suprised that Apple haven't, seemingly, addressed the matter.  My "Mac only" ISP (www.macace.net) think that there is a beta (or earlier) version of 9.2 around, so maybe that will improve matters.

     

    Thanks for your responses and patience!

     

    Message was edited by: iBozz - correcting typos.

  • 7. Re: Time Machine/Capsule failure under Mavericks
    LaPastenague Level 8 Level 8 (35,375 points)

     

    1) My understanding, being an iBozz of very little brain, is that TC deleted the oldest iterations when space was exhausted and thus constantly deleted old back-ups to make room for current back-ups - a sort of Grandfater, Father, Son system but going back well back trhrough the family history!  So why is mine seemingly not doing that?

     

    I am not up to Pondini's standard on this stuff..

     

    But as I have been closely reading these columns now a couple of years.. when you upgrade install an OS.. it seems to seize up what was earlier.. It simply stops being able to delete earlier material.. I am an experimenter and learn mostly by trying.. but it is not something I have tried so I cannot swear to it.. my method is to clean install every OS.. and start a new backup. So I simply never have the problem.

     

     

     

    2) Even if my system is failing to operate as in 1 above (assuming that my understanding is correct) then why can I not "see" the various iterations when I enter TC?

     

    3) The cessation of the smooth operation of TC coincided with my upgrade from Snow Leopard to Mavericks - is that cause and effect or merely an amazing coincidence that that upgrade occurred at the same time as the TC became "full"?

     

    Mavericks I believe is the cause. It does something much more serious when it takes over and does the first TM backup after you install. It should have done one very large backup after the install.. but from what your system sounds like it could have taken a week. 

     

    Try to open the sparsebundle and see if you can actually access and recover earlier material.. sometimes the TM is just slow.. but several things happened when Apple changed to mavericks and this does seem to be the end result.

     

     

     

    4) Archiving off the old backup would require, presumably, an external drive of 2TB - or am I missing the point?  I'm not aware of anything in the sparseimage file that I would ever need to restore but you never know, there may be something there I really want at some time in the future.  Currently I cannot access that file, so is keeping it worth while if it means buying storage of 2TB?

     

    I get the heebie jeebies.. when I make suggestions for people.. to delete even corrupted backups. 

     

    I would do a verify of the TM backup.

     

    There are a couple of approaches.. but Pondini descibes it well.

    A5 here. http://pondini.org/TM/Troubleshooting.html

     

    Do not do it over wireless. It takes a lot of time with a full 2TB disk. As you are into computers you realise you are working with one hand behind your back here.. since you cannot locally mount the disk, you are not working directly on files but on the sparsebundle which is like a virtual disk and can be mounted.

     

    If you are really sure there is nothing in there you want.. well you can delete it. Remember when it is gone it is gone.

     

     

     

    5) If I attach the TC via cable for a short while (that would be a right royal pain in the fundament but I could live with it for a short time), is it likely that I could then see the iterations properly?  And, if so, could I then prune them by deleting some of the older ones to create more space so that it reurns to usual operation?

     

    You should try..

     

    I must sit down when it is not 11pm here... and read the posts through again.. I tend to spot something and miss other glaring thing.

     

    In your first post you explained how you were backing up..

     

    I back up to the Time Capsule via a wireless link from the 2009 quad-core i7 iMac with 1TB HD (capacity 985.32GB with 235.27GB available according to System Information) to my NetGear DG834G router and then by Ethernet cable to the Time capsule.

     

    I am not surprised it is taking 18 hours.. if you mean this as it is written..

     

    You have a G wireless link imac to the Netgear.. and then 100mbit to the TC by ethernet.. You are losing all the value of the TC gigabit and N wireless.

    Even if your Mac is old it must do better than G wireless.. And gigabit has been in Macs since G4 if not earlier.

     

    When you do big backups over wireless they can corrupt .. and so the long verify is having to check everything. Verify of course is copying everything back again. 

     

    You need a much much faster link.

     

    You can delete the older backups manually.

     

    See Pondini.. Q12 There is a lot of warning messages.

     

     

     

    6) I know that second guessing Apple is a non-starter, but do you think that my problem is a Mavericks problem which Apple will address in a future update - or is it a "failure" of TC generally due to the TC being "full" and the problem will remain?  No-one else, apart from bg3po who has happily resolved their similar issue,  seems to have joined this thread saying they have the same problem so I do wonder if it's "unique" to me for some reason.

     

    You said earlier that TC and Mavericks was a dog's breakfast of problems, in which case I'm suprised that Apple haven't, seemingly, addressed the matter.  My "Mac only" ISP (www.macace.net) think that there is a beta (or earlier) version of 9.2 around, so maybe that will improve matters.

     

    I think if your network info is correct then you are very prone to issues.. I doubt anyone has the patience to wait 18 hours for backups.

     

    One other thing I learned.. other than for laptops.. which you use for minor work.. keep everything connected by ethernet. Wireless is great for working on the move.. but it is not reliable to the extent that ethernet is.

     

    I doubt anything apple does will fix your problems.. it sounds to me like you have got yourself into a poor network situation which desperately needs cleaning up.. and as part of that.. you will likely need to start over the TM backups.