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wifi greyed out after update to ios7

84921 Views 584 Replies Latest reply: Apr 19, 2014 7:37 AM by Csound1 RSS Branched to a new discussion.
  • JoeBlow2444 Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 6, 2013 11:07 AM (in response to Prokhozhy)

    Those who wanted to wait with the installation of iOS 7 will probably disagree. If you are held up at gunpoint and have to part with your Rolex, the robbers might also argue that you gave the watch to them voluntarily - after all, they did not have to tear it off your wrist.

    So... Apple held a gun to your head to make you update to iOS 7??

    ...every sale contract is a statement, whether implicit or explicit, that the item being sold is in good working order.

    And it worked perfectly fine for you during the warranty period, correct? So... contract fulfilled!

    If Apple DID NOT know about the faulty part, their quality control is poor, and that makes them look inefficient, essentially destroying their reputation of a quality leader.

    Stuff happens. No device is perfect, no system is perfect.

    "Own it up and put it right" would have been a sign of strength. Unfortunately, they have chosen a different stance...

    Again, if you're covered by warranty, they DO 'put it right'- by replacing the iphone.

    Yes, I am out of warranty.

    Cool. Glad you understand your situation.

    And now I own a paraplegic iBrick.

    On the contrary- the iPHONE still works perfectly well as a phone.  And it will sync data and media with a computer just fine, too. And Cellular data works, too.  It's hardly a 'brick'.

    the manufacturer does, or coerces/lures the user into doing, something that damages the device; the manufacturer is to blame; the user is entitled to full indemnification.

    Did Apple just "lure" you, or put a gun to your head (see earlier)?

    My comments are...against Apple's arrogant inaction.

    You think they owe you something (even though you are out of warranty), and they're the arrogant ones?

  • JoeBlow2444 Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 6, 2013 11:08 AM (in response to Trent Baur)

    And it's a better solution than Apple has offered, which is nothing.

    Apple REPLACES THE IPHONE, assuming you're under warranty.  How, exactly, is that "nothing"??

  • pwrchord Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 6, 2013 12:46 PM (in response to JoeBlow2444)

    Hey Joe - where do you folks in Cupertino go after work, or are you out in the field?

  • JoeBlow2444 Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 6, 2013 1:03 PM (in response to pwrchord)

    Hey Joe - where do you folks in Cupertino go after work, or are you out in the field?

    Ha. Ha.

     

    I understand how warranties work, and that means I must work for Apple?

  • mattgagman Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 6, 2013 1:25 PM (in response to lqtb)

    OK. Here is my 2 cents. I updated to new iOS 7 an lost wifi. I called apple customer service multiple times and their suggestions did not work. Went to the apple store, they said that The Only thing I could do was spend the 199 for a replacement phone. So let me say that the crazy hair dryer trick worked for me and has been good now for over two weeks. So my thanks to whomever discovered that trick.

     

    There is a lot if heated debate on this thread. Whether it was software, hardware or firmware, the fact remains that of the estimated 50 million 4s phones out there, up to 2%(from apple tech on phone) could have this issue. Too many problems at the same time to be a coincidence. 

     

    Apple has chosen to ignore the issue and why not. Many folks are shelling out the 199 for a replacement. Others are upgrading to a 5. And they still have people camping out for the latest new product launches. Admitting fault on their end at this point would cost millions that they see no advantage in paying.

     

    I've had iPhones since the 3, my wife and I both have 4s phones. I've bought more than 5 iPods as gifts and for personal use as well as three iPads, so I've been a loyal user for years and have sold others on the company and products. That being said, I'm not going to get mad at Apple or other members of the forum for expressing an opinion. What I have done is upgrade my wife to a galaxy note 8 for her old iPad and we will switch our phones out when our contract is up. Just that simple.

     

    I wish everyone luck in bringing about their own resolution to this fiasco.

  • Prokhozhy Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 6, 2013 1:47 PM (in response to JoeBlow2444)
    So... Apple held a gun to your head to make you update to iOS 7??

     

    Dear JoeBlow2444, did you ever hear the word "metaphor"? Or do you take everything literally? You can call that "upgrade" "voluntary" only holding a tongue in your cheek. Unless you have a vested interest of some sort, that is... Let me try another metaphor: does a suicide pulls the trigger "voluntarily", or is he "forced" to do it? Or is that not a "yes/no" question? How many colors do you know? Black, white, anything else?

     

    And it worked perfectly fine for you during the warranty period, correct? So... contract fulfilled!

     

    Imagine a car with a bomb inside. The bomb is scheduled to go off three days after the expiration of the warranty period. It does go off. You get blown to pieces. But the car had worked perfectly well before that unfortunate incident. Contract fulfilled?

     

    Stuff happens. No device is perfect, no system is perfect.

     

    Yeah, tell that to the thousands who have been affected. Ah, I forget, you do not see those thousands - because you are not looking. And I do understand that no system is perfect - it's the response to system failures that really matters. And what is it with this warranty line? Like I said before, warranty provisions are perfectly good for normal-wear-and-tear situations. I insist they do not apply to a product that was a priori bad (even if it is discovered at a later moment in time). You, on the contrary, seem to be saying that if a potentially bad product (a phone with a defective chip, a car with a time bomb) does not go bad within a certain period of time, this somehow makes it a good product (or that the manufacturer who put the bad chip/time bomb inside the product is not to blame for what happened after the warranty expires). In other words, you seem to be saying that black is white if it doesn't go black. Or is this a gray area? If you tell a lie and don't get caught (for one month ), does that lie stop being a lie?

    On the contrary- the iPHONE still works perfectly well as a phone.  And it will sync data and media with a computer just fine, too. And Cellular data works, too.  It's hardly a 'brick'.

    Try going abroad - and off the air!!!, see how that feels. Plenty of wifi hotspots around, but because of prohibitively high data traffic charges you get no e-mails, no exchange rate information, no traffic information, no news, no weather forecasts... Ah, you can still make and take calls, play Solitaire and text messages - GREAT PHONE for my top dollar! Wanna swap? No? Thought so...

     

    Did Apple just "lure" you, or put a gun to your head (see earlier)?

     

    You sound like there are only two options and I have to choose only one OR the other (it's called "exclusive logic"). Try both (it's called "inclusive logic"): they lured me into upgrading by promising untold benefits offered by the new operating system, AND when I discovered it had screwed up my beautiful iPhone (I've read dozens of times phrases like "everything had been perfect before the update" - my feelings exactly) they forced me to make a Hobson's choice: live without wifi or get a new phone for a fee (again: I'd been happy with the old one before they'd murdered it). That Hobson's choice is another prime example of "exclusive logic". To make it "inclusive" they ought to have allowed me, as a minimum, to roll back to iOS 6. They didn't - I don't know why, but probably it's to do with their money (I understand, why would they care about mine). Time will tell. It always does.

    And hey, I got an idea. You don't wanna swap, so how would you like - out of solidarity with out-of-warranty no-wifi iBrick owners - to forego the use of your wifi function for a fleetingly short period of two months? To grow some empathy, like? After all, you phone will still work "perfectly well as a phone"... Pray tell me what you think!

  • JoeBlow2444 Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 6, 2013 4:13 PM (in response to Prokhozhy)

    You can call that "upgrade" "voluntary" only holding a tongue in your cheek.

    Voluntary:  done, given, or acting of one's own free will

     

    Unless Apple somehow forced you to accept the update, then it was indeed voluntary.

    Imagine a car with a bomb inside. The bomb is scheduled to go off three days after the expiration of the warranty period. It does go off. You get blown to pieces. But the car had worked perfectly well before that unfortunate incident. Contract fulfilled?

    Your analogy... *****.  No one in Apple 'planted a bomb' in your iPhone. (Why are everyones examples so violent? Pulling guns, planting bombs....) A better example would be a car that has its radio stop working a week after the warranty is up. No explosion, no blood, no death, just one small feature that no longer works.

     

    And in that case, YES, Contract fulfilled.

    You, on the contrary, seem to be saying that if a potentially bad product (a phone with a defective chip, a car with a time bomb) does not go bad within a certain period of time, this somehow makes it a good product

    Not at all.

    It is, however, a product that is outside its warranty period.

    Try going abroad - and off the air!!!, see how that feels.

    If you have the money to travel abroad, then you certainly have the money to replace the iphone. And this time, get the Protection Plan.

    they forced me to make a Hobson's choice: live without wifi or get a new phone for a fee

    Sorry, that's the way things are. The iphone is no longer covered by the warranty.  It's not reasonable to expect them to cover it forever.

    To make it "inclusive" they ought to have allowed me, as a minimum, to roll back to iOS 6. They didn't - I don't know why

    First step in any troubleshooting is to make sure the user is using the latest version of the software. This is because there are features, settings, and bug-fixes that don't exist in previous versions.  Thus, the lack of a way to ''roll back' to previous versions. It needlessly complicates things. Stay at a previous version if you want (I, for instance still have a computer at home that runs Windows XP), but don't expect any software maker to allow you to downgrade.

    how would you like - out of solidarity with out-of-warranty no-wifi iBrick owners - to forego the use of your wifi function for a fleetingly short period of two months?

    I absolutely wouldn't like that.

     

    Which is why I got the Protection Plan. :-)  Now, if I do have an issue with upgrading to ios7, I can get a replacement iphone!

  • abysse Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 6, 2013 4:54 PM (in response to Mrm1ke)

    Mrm1ke:

    Hello, could you be more specific about your process to have another Iphone. I live in Quebec too and i've heard about the consumer law but i don't know where to start and a few tips/guidelines would be very helpful. Thank you.

  • Prokhozhy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 7, 2013 12:02 AM (in response to JoeBlow2444)

    Your analogy... *****.  No one in Apple 'planted a bomb' in your iPhone. (Why are everyones examples so violent? Pulling guns, planting bombs....)

    Losing patience, huh? ("Why won't they just shut up and die?") Welcome to the club! This is called reductio ad absurdum, and I have to resort to it to make it more difficult for you and other staunch Apple supporters to sidestep or ignore the salient points:

    1. Apple did put a defective wifi chip into my iPhone. The chip had a latent defect that could be (and was) triggered by a certain confluence of events (if you can grasp the concept of a "simile", that IS a "time bomb"). It is Apple's fault.

    2. Apple did advise me to perform a series of actions which eventually resulted in my iPhone losing an essential function. Even if they hide behind the standard "do-it-at-your-risk" liability waiver, it is THEIR software, and in the process of installation it killed THEIR chip. It is Apple's fault.

    3. Apple did fail to publicly acknowledge the existence and, more importantly, the extent of the problem, which forced (repeat: FORCED - in the absence of viable alternatives) numerous users to engage in household physics trying to revive their devices (I heartily agree with other commentators - THIS IS RIDICULOUS). It is Apple's fault.

     

    Bottomline: thousands of people who did not do anything wrong or unusual are left with substandard iPhones because of Apple's acts (selling devices with defective parts) and omissions (failure to recognize the problem and deal with it).

     

    Now, the 64,000 dollar question is this: does the warranty protection apply to devices that are defective ab origine? In other words, are manufacturers allowed to sell defective products in the hope that they will somehow survive the warranty period whereupon the manufacturers will be off the hook? (Do you know the answer to that question? Though I bet you will just ignore it.) If selling defective devices is legal, and if manufacturers selling such devices are indeed covered by warranty protection, I'LL CEASE AND DESIST. Simply put, I'll shut up and buy another phone elsewhere. On the other hand, if it is not legal, I have every right to protest, while your insistent warranty references look somewhat silly in this particular situation which is admittedly not a normal, regular situation.

     

    And last but not least, my favorite:

     

    If you have the money to travel abroad, then you certainly have the money to replace the iphone. And this time, get the Protection Plan.

     

    Apparently you (and at least one other Apple supporter) bring up this ultima ratio when you are out of real arguments. With your kind permission, I would like to stay in charge of my personal finances.

  • TJBUSMC1973 Level 5 Level 5 (4,675 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 7, 2013 6:02 AM (in response to Prokhozhy)

    Prokhozhy wrote:

     

     

    Now, the 64,000 dollar question is this: does the warranty protection apply to devices that are defective ab origine? In other words, are manufacturers allowed to sell defective products in the hope that they will somehow survive the warranty period whereupon the manufacturers will be off the hook? (Do you know the answer to that question? Though I bet you will just ignore it.) If selling defective devices is legal, and if manufacturers selling such devices are indeed covered by warranty protection, I'LL CEASE AND DESIST. Simply put, I'll shut up and buy another phone elsewhere. On the other hand, if it is not legal, I have every right to protest, while your insistent warranty references look somewhat silly in this particular situation which is admittedly not a normal, regular situation.

     

     

    Yes, selling a defective device is legal, unless it can be proven that the manufacturer knew prior to sale that the device was defective.  There has to be clear and tangible proof of intent to sell a defective device, and the burden of such proof is on the claimant.

     

    The purpose of a warranty is to provide coverage in the event that a defective device is unintentionally sold to a customer.  The responsibility then falls onto the consumer to report such a defect to the manufacturer, prior to the mutually agreed upon deadline.  In this case, that deadline is one year from date of purchase.

     

    You can't prove intent on the part of Apple to sell anyone a defective device.  Therefore, you must report such a defect within the warranty period.  Fail to do so, and the responsibility for any and all repairs to the device falls solely upon the customer.  Now, in this case, Apple also provides a reduced cost replacement program.  This shows they are going above and beyond the legal requirements, as well as the industry standards.

  • JoeBlow2444 Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 7, 2013 11:35 AM (in response to Prokhozhy)

    The chip had a latent defect that could be (and was) triggered by a certain confluence of events (if you can grasp the concept of a "simile", that IS a "time bomb").

    No, a time bomb is a device that is set to explode at a certain time.  Calling this hardware flaw a 'time bomb' implies that Apple set this in place purposefully.

    it is THEIR software, and in the process of installation it killed THEIR chip. It is Apple's fault.

    It is a hardware issue cause by heat. The heat is caused by any sustained wifi usage, not just using the wifi to DL the Apple software. So it's not 'their software'.  And, technically speaking, they didn't make the chip, they bought it from another company, so it's not actually 'their chip'. But they are responsible for it, which is why they replace iphones with the 'defective chip'*, for free, if they are covered by the warranty.

     

    *by 'chip', I mean what ever part is actually defective. It may not be a "chip", per se.

    3. Apple did fail to publicly acknowledge the existence and, more importantly, the extent of the problem

    You do not have any evidence, short of a few forum complaints, as to the actual extent of the issue.

    As for publically acknowledging the issue, Apple does this every time they replace a iphone for it. "Your iPhones broke. Here's a replacement'.   There is no need for a huge, worldwide public announcement. It would cause confusion and invite trouble.

    In other words, are manufacturers allowed to sell defective products in the hope that they will somehow survive the warranty period whereupon the manufacturers will be off the hook?

    If the device works fine during the warranty period, it is not, by definition, 'defective'.  No device is guaranteed (or warrantied) to work forever.

    If selling defective devices is legal, and if manufacturers selling such devices are indeed covered by warranty protection, I'LL CEASE AND DESIST.

    No device is perfect. All devices will fail, eventually.  If you use 'if it fails under any circumstance, at any time' as your definition of 'defective', as you seem to want to do, then ALL things are, by that definition, defective.  And, yes, warranties still apply.

    With your kind permission, I would like to stay in charge of my personal finances.

    So, you want to cheap out and not get the extra year's protection, then come here and complain if/when your device fails within that extra year. I see. You don't want an actual answer to the issue (buy a new phone, buy a protection plan), you just like complaining.

  • TJBUSMC1973 Level 5 Level 5 (4,675 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 7, 2013 11:46 AM (in response to JoeBlow2444)

    JoeBlow2444 wrote:

    You don't want an actual answer to the issue (buy a new phone, buy a protection plan), you just like complaining.

     

     

    DING DING DING!!!

  • Prokhozhy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 8, 2013 12:41 AM (in response to TJBUSMC1973)

    You know, TJBUSMC1973, everything you say is absolutely correct. But only in a normal, regular situation, i.e. only if we are talking about one device, maybe several dozen devices. But the problem is much more widespread, is it not? Someone wrote here that an Apple representative said 2% of about 50 million iPhone S4s throughout the world might be affected. So why don't you say this, roll it around in your mouth and feel its ugly taste: "a million defective devices are unintentionally sold to customers". And while you are at it, look up the word "oxymoron". "Million" + "unintentionally" = duh! If they did not know what they were selling, this is "gross negligence", and in most contracts I read gross negligence voids indemnity. If they did know, this is "wilful misconduct" - another indemnity killer. Either way, it would be interesting to know what liability lawyers have to say about the legal consequences of a manufacturer unintentionally selling thousands of expensive devices with a latent defect. I seriously doubt the warranty protection will be valid.

    Incidentally, even if 99% of those affected were covered by the warranty and received free replacements (though I believe this percentage is rather improbable, and is a gross overstatement), that still leaves 10 thousand wifi-less sufferers (the remaining one percent, including yours truly). Do you think it would be right for any company to wrong 10 thousand people and go scot-free? If you invoke the "reality check" defense (like, "this is the real world"), why don't you (as a shareholder) encourage Apple to warn prospective customers that if something goes wrong during the post-warranty period because of Apple's fault (like when they unintentionally sell a defective device), their (Apple's) position will be "Tough ***** sake the kitty". Apple might even make buyers sign waivers to that effect.

    Finally, I believe that your statement:

    Yes, selling a defective device is legal, unless...

    would raise judicial eyebrows any place in the world, not "buts", not "unless'es". Do not repeat that in a court.

  • Prokhozhy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 8, 2013 1:23 AM (in response to JoeBlow2444)

    From what I understand, based on your latest post, your message to me and those like me is this: "iOS 7 is not Apple software , bad wifi chips are not Apple hardware , it may not even be the chips (per se ), Apple doesn't recognize the problem because it will cause confusion and invite trouble , so if you own an out-of-warranty iBrick, don't complain, just shut up and shell out more cash - that't the REAL SOLUTION". + Background noise: "DING DING DING!" (probably meaning "hear, hear!", or maybe a sign that the TV dinner is ready).

    You know what, gentlemen, I wash my hands. May Fructus Malus Rot in Peace. You both have done a magnificent jot persuading me that I was wrong when I decided to get an expensive top-quality Apple product. My bad, I'll never buy an Apple again. Instead I'll take your advice - cheap out of here and make my future purchases elsewhere. May you and your Apple products survive iOS 8! Amen!

  • JoeBlow2444 Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 8, 2013 10:22 AM (in response to Prokhozhy)
    From what I understand, based on your latest post, your message to me and those like me is this: "iOS 7 is not Apple software

     

    ::sigh::

     

    No. It was not 'apple software' that caused the problem.  It was* the heat produced by a sustained download over wifi. In some cases of failure, the sustained download just happened to be the Apple iOS software, but could have been ANY download- ****, video, pictures, the entire Library of Congress, etc.

     

    *as I understand the issue- I might be wrong.

     

    bad wifi chips are not Apple hardware

     

    I don't beleive they are produced in-house by Apple, no.  So that means Apple buys them from someone else.  Now, as I already said, they are still responsible for them, which is why they have a warranty and replace the devices.

    it may not even be the chips (per se )

    I'm not an engineer and don't work for Apple. But as I understand the issue, there is a fault in the wifi circuitry that is exposed when the circuit heats up through sustained wifi usage. Whether it is in the "wifi chip" itself, or elsewhere, I do not know.

    Apple doesn't recognize the problem because it will cause confusion and invite trouble ,

    That's the way I see it.  I've seen it with other companies, other issues. Users who are confused, and think that EVERY issue is related to the one acknowledged issue. Scammers, hoping for a free replacement, who lie and say that their issue is the one in question when it is not.  And so on.

    so if you own an out-of-warranty iBrick, don't complain, just shut up and shell out more cash - that't the REAL SOLUTION".

    I'd extend that to "if you own an out-of-warranty ANYTHING..."

     

    Again, that's the whole point of a warranty- to fix/replace the device if it fails within an unreasonably short time (aka 'the warranty period').  If it fails OUTSIDE that time, you are on your own.

     

    I was wrong when I decided to get an expensive top-quality Apple product.

     

    Not at all. You are just wrong to not get the Protection Plan if you wanted the extra coverage, and you are wrong to expect Apple to continue to cover the iphone past its warranty.

     

    I'll never buy an Apple again.

     

    Then you'll find out that ALL company's warranties work the same.

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