Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:12 PM (in response to lordchrono)
You ask- I bought the laptop for $1099 and could still get a MacBook Air with 8gb RAM for the same price if I return it.
I would keep your Pro personally and you can see why below. I have both older Pro and newer Air and owned many Pros
however the new breed of Pro is the best of both worlds now in its 'closeness' to the Air, but with all its benefits, of weight and SSD and Haswell and 802ac.
So if I had both right now and had to return one, id return the Air, even though its my favorite Mac out of many I own.
Id keep the Pro and return my Air, costs being irrelevant. But thats just me.
The NEW macbook Pro and Air are EXTREMELY close in form factor
The newest macbook Pro is essentially a larger macbook Air with Retina display and options for speed in increasing prices up to an independent graphics and quad core processor.
both Air and new Pro now have PCIe SSD and permanent RAM.
The Air is the lightweight portable form factor, fast to boot and shut down, but with longer battery life than any of the macbook pro in 13"
Now the new macbook Pro and macbook Air are extremely close in form factor and nature.
both have 802ac wifi
both have permanent RAM, no superdrive
both are slim profiles and SSD
The only real differences now between Air and Pro....are (in the most expensive Pros) faster processors and quadcore processors and top end model autonomous graphics and the Pro has HDMI output.....and of course the retina display
both are now "very good for travel"
Other than features the form factor of the Air and Pro are VERY close now,....so now its merely a matter of features and price more than anything.
You need an external HD regardless of what you get for backups etc. Drop into an Apple store and handle both and make your choice based on features, such as Retina or non-retina, .... both at a distance now look like the same computer.
The Pro weighs more, ....but nowhere near what it used to just a month ago on the older macbook Pros
The NEW macbook Pro is a different creature entirely than the older macbook Pro, .....the new Pro is thicker than the Air, but id frankly call the NEWEST Pro a "macbook Air with Retina display" , or
Maybe a “macbook Air PRO with Retina display”
Instead of Air VS Pro now,.....its really a smooth transition from Air to pro without comparing say, 2 different creatures, now its like contrasting a horse from a race horse.
Either one in 8gig of RAM (preferably)... the 4gig upgrade costs very little, the I7 you will notice only 15% faster on heavy applications over the I5, and NOTHING on most APPS.....I5 has longer battery life.
As you see below, the non-Retina 13" AIR is 82% of the Macbook with Retina display in resolution
there is no magical number of pixels per inch that automatically equates to Retina quality.
A huge internal SSD isnt a game changer for anything, you need an external HD anyway
what you WONT READ on Apple.com etc. is that the larger SSD are MUCH FASTER due to SSD density
"The 512GB Samsung SSD found in our 13-inch model offers roughly a 400MB/s increase in write speeds over the 128GB SanDisk/Marvell SSD"
Here is an excellent video comparison between the 11” I5 vs. I7 2013 Macbook Air.
I5 vs. I7 performance 13” Macbook Air 2013
- 11.7 I5 ……11.4 I7
- 1.1 I5….1.41 I7
IMovie Import and Opt.
- 6.69 I5….5.35 I7
- 10.33 I5…8.20 I7
Final Cut Pro X
- 21.47 I5…17.71 I7
Adobe Lightroom 3 Export
- 25.8 I5….31.8 I7
Adobe Photoshop CS5 Performance
- 27.3 I5…22.6 I7
Reviews of the newest Retina 2013 Macbook Pro
Digital Trends (13") - http://www.digitaltrends.com/laptop-...h-2013-review/
LaptopMag (13") - http://www.laptopmag.com/reviews/lap...play-2013.aspx
Engadget (13") - http://www.engadget.com/2013/10/29/m...-13-inch-2013/
The Verge (13") - http://www.theverge.com/2013/10/30/5...ay-review-2013
CNet (13") - http://www.cnet.com/laptops/apple-ma...-35831098.html
The Verge (15") - http://www.theverge.com/2013/10/24/5...w-15-inch-2013
LaptopMag (15") - http://www.laptopmag.com/reviews/lap...inch-2013.aspx
TechCrunch (15") - http://techcrunch.com/2013/10/25/lat...ok-pro-review/
CNet (15") - http://www.cnet.com/apple-macbook-pro-with-retina-2013/
PC Mag (15") - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2426359,00.asp
Arstechnica (15") - http://arstechnica.com/apple/2013/10...-pro-reviewed/
Slashgear (15") - http://www.slashgear.com/macbook-pro...2013-26303163/
Macbook Pro processor and configuration options:
Macbook Pro ports:
Macbook Air (13") ports:
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:09 PM (in response to lordchrono)
Forgot to mention that I'm on a budget, which is why I have only the choice to keep the rMBP or switch to the air for the same price, or else I would have already upgraded to the (8/256) model of rMBP.
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:13 PM (in response to lordchrono)
Most everyone does not need a 256gig SSD
just get a tiny 1TB portable HD for $70
nobody needs to turn ANY macbook or laptop into a giant media storage device, ....keep that stuff on an external HD
If you dont use it every 2 weeks or so, it doesnt really need to be ON the computer.
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:21 PM (in response to lordchrono)
Plotinus, thanks for all of the information comparing the two systems. I do agree that the rMBP is the best of both worlds with its processor, battery life and form. The comparison with the closeness to retina display of the other systems is interesting. Does that mean that the air and other macs percentage-wise aren't that far off from being "retina?" Do you personally think the base amount of RAM I have in my pro will be sufficient given that I do not do intense editing? The most I will ever do is have a handful of tabs and apps open. I've also been reading about battery problems with the latest rMBP and it's gotten me a bit worried although ai have experience too much decreased in estimated battery life.
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:25 PM (in response to lordchrono)
If you don't need the discrete graphics card get the air. They seem to be more stable, more reliable and have way better battery life. Plus they are more portable and lighter. You can connect a big ultra hi resolution monitor (like a thunderbolt) to it no problem.
The retina macbook pros seem to be having a lot of problems. Mine is no exception and now on the 4th logic board now. The only benefit seems to be the retina screen and the discrete graphics. If you didn't get the 15" though you do not have the discrete graphics.
You can upgrade the SSD but not the ram.
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:36 PM (in response to brsm1990)
Did you purchase a 15inch MacBook retina last year? What were some of the main issues with yours that you needed to replace the logic board?
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:45 PM (in response to lordchrono)
Do you personally think the base amount of RAM I have in my pro will be sufficient given that I do not do intense editing? The most I will ever do is have a handful of tabs and apps open.
You could have had 20 tabs open and uploading files and downloading them at the same time with 2gigs of RAM even on an older 2012 Air as I can confirm.
Any base model Air or your Pro outstrips the 2012 Air in base model configs.
so, yes, most certainly.
Your new pro has the Retina display,
considering its price base model to base model (Air to Pro), keep the buttery smooth retina display on your new Pro.
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:53 PM (in response to lordchrono)
Late last year yes.
What issues did I have? More like what didn't I have.
It started with poor perforamnce and overheating, excessive fans and heat any time I actually tried to use the computer for anything more intensive than light browsing and e-mail. When I brought it back to Apple they said it needed a new logic board due to "faulty sensors" on the logic board. They took over a week to do the repair. They said it was thoroughly tested and good as new.
Within 5 minutes of testing with FCP (for example) or anythign else CPU/GPU intensive I immediately determined it was still overheaitng. They denied there was an issue. After I showed them temperature readings and CPU operating temp specs from Intel among other things they conceeded. They said it needed another logic board due to, again, faulty sensors on the logic board.
When they returned it the second time it was crashing a lot. It wasn't stable at all. It was almost impossible to shut it down or boot it up normally. I knew they would now try to blame the issues on my OS installation (as they had tried before. With great difficulty I got a new OS X installation on it but it still was crashing all the time. I also noticed a severe display ghosting issue has come up as well (see google retina LG displays for more on that). I took it back again, this time they said the GPU had failed and it needed... wait for it... a new logic board.
At each step I have requested replacement or refund and at each repair they have refused. All in all it's been under repair for more than a month. It's a real nightmare. I have read that the 2013 have an improved design but I also read other posts from end users saying the 2013 is *worse*.
I don't know what's happening with Apple products these days but they seem to be turning out a *lot* of defective ones.
On top of all of this battery life has always been mediocre when using the computer for all but the lightest of tasks. The heat has always been downright unreasonable. Aside from the fact that it must be bad for the components and must be causing CPU throttling the aluminum case gets so hot it is literally uncomfortablet to touch in some places. It won't burn you but it is getting **** close to that level.
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 3:57 PM (in response to brsm1990)
The macbook Pro the OP has is a completely different creature than the last generation Pro.
Other than carrying the same name "macbook pro", they are quite dissimilar
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 4:02 PM (in response to PlotinusVeritas)
This is a pretty inaccurate statement. Some changes have been but they are definitely not "quite dissimilar". And as I told him, some are saying it's improved and some are saying it's worse.
Here is an article that details the differences: http://9to5mac.com/2013/02/16/new-model-early-2013-retina-macbook-pros-use-some- upgraded-internal-parts/
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 4:04 PM (in response to PlotinusVeritas)
For example here is a guy complaining about the 2013's:
created by BMW M3 in MacBook Pro
i can't speak to the 2012's, but i went through 3 rMBPs (late-2013) in the past 7 days. all returned. all had problems.
I didn't even bother wasting my time on a 4th.
After returning 5 2013 rMBPs to Apple this month, I finally decided to go a different route. Ended up buying last years rMBP with very similar specs for $1,300 less. It has the Samsung screen with yellow tint. But the screen is evenly tinted, no backlight unevenness or bleed. It has AppleCare till August of 2015, so I should be covered. Now I look at the screen, and every time I get ****** about the tint, I remind my self that a) It’s probably the best I can get at the moment, and b) I saved $1,300, so I can deal with it being a bit defective.
BTW, having taken apart both the 2013 and the 2012 model, it looks like the 2012 was better built. Better tolerances and magnets rather then those stupid bottom panel clips. Might be just this one thought. Any way, that’s my story, I am going to try that color profile, JoshD.
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 4:06 PM (in response to brsm1990)
The article you posted does shed a lot of light on the risks of adopting a new system like the MacBook Pro with retina. It's still early to say, but so far The new Mavericks OS hasn't been giving me any problems, but I will monitor my usage and the laptop's function to see if there any changes in terms of heating issues, performance and battery life knowing the problems out there now.
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 4:19 PM (in response to lordchrono)
For what it's worth OS X 10.8.5 vs. 10.9 made no difference at all in the issues I was experiencing.
Slightly off topic it looks like they just released 10.9.1
Currently Being ModeratedDec 16, 2013 4:20 PM (in response to lordchrono)
you have a warranty, just use your Pro and enjoy it.
These boards are an 'emergency room' for people having problems, everyone doing fine isnt coming here to post anything.
Its an error to draw any general conclusions from a handful of experiences with some Macs; or to conclude anything from these boards.
such is the nature of all technology.