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wifi greyed out after update to ios7

84153 Views 576 Replies Latest reply: Apr 16, 2014 11:08 AM by zelous RSS Branched to a new discussion.
  • TJBUSMC1973 Level 5 Level 5 (4,655 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 19, 2014 9:05 AM (in response to BKPurdy)

    First off, I didn't delete your post.  A moderator did, and probably for a good reason.

     

    Secondly, it is a hardware issue, which your 'expiriment' helped to support.  How would a change in temperature affect the software?

     

    The issue is heat and how it affects the hardware.  Temperature affects hardware, not software code.

  • BKPurdy Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 19, 2014 9:21 AM (in response to TJBUSMC1973)

    the hardware is fine...its the software that generates the heat (apparently quite a bit more heat than IOS6).  Hardware is either broken or its not...there's no "sometimes".  if i stick my phone in the oven at 300 degrees would it be the phones fault that it doesn't work?  Of course not...the phone was put into an environment that it was not designed to function in...which is exactly whats going on here.  the wifi chip is being expected to operate in an environment that it was not designed for (IOS 7).  Tell me...does the new Iphone 5 have the same wifi chip as the 4S?

  • TJBUSMC1973 Level 5 Level 5 (4,655 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 19, 2014 9:52 AM (in response to BKPurdy)

    Software doesn't generate heat.  The processor running the software generates heat.  Therefore, changing out the software won't have any effect. 

     

    And hardware can have 'intermittent' faults.  That means it is broken, but the symptom only sometimes manifests itself.  As an elecgtronics tech, my biggestheadaches were the 'shy faults', the 'phantoms' that didn't want to appear while I was diagnosing the device, but would be reported by users later.  Chasing down a 'phantom fault' is a painin the neck.  So, yes, there is a 'sometimes', as far as the symptom.

     

    The wi-fi chip IS designed for iOS 7.  The problem in most cases is the wi-fi chip that is having issues is defective, meaning it was not manufactured to the deisgn specifications.  In other, more rare cases, the proessor is generating more heat than is being dissipated, so the processor and/or the heat sinks are faulty.

     

    This is some form of hardwre fault not software fault.  If it was a software fault, then ALL iPhone 4S units in the entire world running the same software would have the same fault.  Software doesn't have the possibility of unique manufacturing defects.  Each copy of the software is identical.  When you install iOS 7.0.4 from the Apple servers to your iPhone 4S, you get the exact same build that I get when I download it to my iPhone 4S from the Apple servers.  They are perfect clones of each other.

     

    This is a hardware issue, not a software issue.  Any competent IT tech will tell you the same thing.

  • BKPurdy Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 19, 2014 10:19 AM (in response to TJBUSMC1973)

    then apple should warranty the wifi chips becuase they were defective from the start; and should continue to warranty them for a year beyond the date the update was performed.  why didn't any of the other software updates cause an issue?  and why arent the folks who have managed to go back to IOS6 having continuing issues?  IOS7 MUST cause more heat to be generated.

  • kexicus Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 20, 2014 12:28 AM (in response to BKPurdy)

    There is no point in replying to TJBUSMC1973 because he is either A) Working for Apple B) An isheep or C) Both.

    He is more active on this thread than any other person and doesn't even have this problem. Don't reply to him. Just ignore him, because his Apple coloured spectacles will never see our point of view.

  • Csound1 Level 7 Level 7 (32,255 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 20, 2014 1:28 AM (in response to kexicus)

    kexicus wrote:

     

    There is no point in replying to TJBUSMC1973 because he is either A) Working for Apple

    This is a user forum, TJBUSMC1973 is just like you, a user of Apple products. If you wish to attempt an insult please stay with reality

  • Bobdc6 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 20, 2014 5:08 AM (in response to BKPurdy)

    "Restore as new phone" solved all my battery, heat, and slowness problems on my iPhone 4, have you tried that? 

  • TJBUSMC1973 Level 5 Level 5 (4,655 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 20, 2014 5:26 AM (in response to kexicus)

    kexicus wrote:

     

    There is no point in replying to TJBUSMC1973 because he is either A) Working for Apple B) An isheep or C) Both.

    He is more active on this thread than any other person and doesn't even have this problem. Don't reply to him. Just ignore him, because his Apple coloured spectacles will never see our point of view.

     

    If you'd actually read my posts, you'd see I'm trying to guide people to an actual resolution, instead of supporting pointless griping and complaining.  I neither work for Apple, nor am i an 'iSheep'.  I advise you to keep personal insults out of this discussion.  I'm providing an explanation of the problem, and a possible solution. 

     

    While I don't personally have this problem on my device, I've seen this problem and know more about it that you do.  That's why I'm here; to offer guidance.  Don't like it?  Fine.  That's your choice.  But your best chance of getting this resolved is to follow the advice I've given.

     

     

     

    BKPurdy wrote:

     

    then apple should warranty the wifi chips becuase they were defective from the start; and should continue to warranty them for a year beyond the date the update was performed.  why didn't any of the other software updates cause an issue?  and why arent the folks who have managed to go back to IOS6 having continuing issues?  IOS7 MUST cause more heat to be generated.

     

    That's what I've been saying.  That's why I'm telling you to place the blame on the hardware, not the software.

    Now, I don't agree that the warranty should be extended after each iOS update.  iOS updates come out all the time, and a major iOS update comes out about once a year.  What you're proposing would be an infinite warranty.  And it's ridiculous to expect that.

     

    Also, previous software updates DID reveal this defect.  A simple search of the forums will reveal that.

     

    Here's one: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4909703

     

    This thread talks about wi-fi greyed out, on an iPhone 4S, during iOS 6.  That sort of blows a hole in your theory that other software updates didn't 'cause' the issue.

     

    Below is the script that I've provided previously on how to address this issue if your iPhone is out of warranty.  It focuses on blaming the hardware, which is the only logical course of action.  This is what you say to Apple when you call in and request an exception.

     

    From: https://discussions.apple.com/message/24551640#24551640

    i.e.: "If the wi-fi chip was defective from the very beginning, and only the process of an iOS update would create enough stress to reveal this defect, then there was no way for me to report this defect during the normal warranty period.  No other operations on the iPhone created enough stress to reveal this defect, which was present all along.  Therefore, because the device was defective from day of purchase, but there was no way for me to test for that defect, it was impossible for me to report it prior to it being revealed.  The fact that it only revealed after the warranty expired should not infringe upon the validity of my claim."

     

    That's how you have the best chance to get the device replaced for free if it is outside of warranty.

     

    Blaming the software is not only false and ignorant, it will get you nowhere.

    Blaming the hardware?  Not only is that the actual cause of the problem, you've got a shot at replacement.

    The user bought the hardware, believing it to be free from defects.  That's their defense.  But if you claim it's the software?  Well, sorry, but you signed a legal agreement to accept any and all consequences of the optional software update.

     

    So, you want to go with 'No Chance' or 'Slim Chance'?

  • zelous Level 3 Level 3 (635 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 20, 2014 12:23 PM (in response to TJBUSMC1973)

    TJBUSMC1973

     

    dont listen to anyone that tries to put u down for being awesome. ive been following this thread for a long time now and all ive seen from u is good sound advice. everyone else that cant recognize that and just want to have a personal pitty party publicly should just stay out of these forums all together.

  • kexicus Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 21, 2014 12:33 AM (in response to BKPurdy)
  • jigar7 Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 21, 2014 4:53 AM (in response to TJBUSMC1973)

    TJBUSMC1973 wrote:

     

    Software doesn't generate heat.  The processor running the software generates heat.  Therefore, changing out the software won't have any effect. 

     

    And hardware can have 'intermittent' faults.  That means it is broken, but the symptom only sometimes manifests itself.  As an elecgtronics tech, my biggestheadaches were the 'shy faults', the 'phantoms' that didn't want to appear while I was diagnosing the device, but would be reported by users later.  Chasing down a 'phantom fault' is a painin the neck.  So, yes, there is a 'sometimes', as far as the symptom.

     

    The wi-fi chip IS designed for iOS 7.  The problem in most cases is the wi-fi chip that is having issues is defective, meaning it was not manufactured to the deisgn specifications.  In other, more rare cases, the proessor is generating more heat than is being dissipated, so the processor and/or the heat sinks are faulty.

     

    This is some form of hardwre fault not software fault.  If it was a software fault, then ALL iPhone 4S units in the entire world running the same software would have the same fault.  Software doesn't have the possibility of unique manufacturing defects.  Each copy of the software is identical.  When you install iOS 7.0.4 from the Apple servers to your iPhone 4S, you get the exact same build that I get when I download it to my iPhone 4S from the Apple servers.  They are perfect clones of each other.

     

    This is a hardware issue, not a software issue.  Any competent IT tech will tell you the same thing.

    I'd like to correct you. It is not a hardware problem... but infact a hardware limitation. There is a huge difference in both those terms. The wifi on my 4S worked perfectly since launch... iOS5 & 6 (all iterations of both those firmwares). In 2 years, more than 6-8 firmware upgrades have been applied on my 4S... nothing happened then and suddenly an "upgrade" to iOS7... messed it up! I totally blame the software. It wasn't coded well to work with the 4S wifi chip. If 5S or 5 or 4 starts having this issue when 7.1 launches, will you blame the hardware again? Hardware is supposed to work as instructed by the software. You make a wifi chip and don't tell the software at what temperature it should operate or cut-off... the chip will obviously burn out! That is a hardware limitation... not a hardware malfunction. Software drives the hardware... not the other way around. If the wifi chip was defected, this issue should have arised a long long time ago... why only now? And why only post iOS7 upgrades?

     

    How is it that you totally ignore the fact and keep mentioning that 'iOS7 is not at fault'?!

     

    I guess this issue will be answered when 7.1 releases next month (wishful thinking).

  • TJBUSMC1973 Level 5 Level 5 (4,655 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 21, 2014 5:17 AM (in response to jigar7)

    jigar7 wrote:

     

    TJBUSMC1973 wrote:

     

    Software doesn't generate heat.  The processor running the software generates heat.  Therefore, changing out the software won't have any effect. 

     

    And hardware can have 'intermittent' faults.  That means it is broken, but the symptom only sometimes manifests itself.  As an elecgtronics tech, my biggestheadaches were the 'shy faults', the 'phantoms' that didn't want to appear while I was diagnosing the device, but would be reported by users later.  Chasing down a 'phantom fault' is a painin the neck.  So, yes, there is a 'sometimes', as far as the symptom.

     

    The wi-fi chip IS designed for iOS 7.  The problem in most cases is the wi-fi chip that is having issues is defective, meaning it was not manufactured to the deisgn specifications.  In other, more rare cases, the proessor is generating more heat than is being dissipated, so the processor and/or the heat sinks are faulty.

     

    This is some form of hardwre fault not software fault.  If it was a software fault, then ALL iPhone 4S units in the entire world running the same software would have the same fault.  Software doesn't have the possibility of unique manufacturing defects.  Each copy of the software is identical.  When you install iOS 7.0.4 from the Apple servers to your iPhone 4S, you get the exact same build that I get when I download it to my iPhone 4S from the Apple servers.  They are perfect clones of each other.

     

    This is a hardware issue, not a software issue.  Any competent IT tech will tell you the same thing.

    I'd like to correct you. It is not a hardware problem... but infact a hardware limitation. There is a huge difference in both those terms. The wifi on my 4S worked perfectly since launch... iOS5 & 6 (all iterations of both those firmwares). In 2 years, more than 6-8 firmware upgrades have been applied on my 4S... nothing happened then and suddenly an "upgrade" to iOS7... messed it up! I totally blame the software. It wasn't coded well to work with the 4S wifi chip. If 5S or 5 or 4 starts having this issue when 7.1 launches, will you blame the hardware again? Hardware is supposed to work as instructed by the software. You make a wifi chip and don't tell the software at what temperature it should operate or cut-off... the chip will obviously burn out! That is a hardware limitation... not a hardware malfunction. Software drives the hardware... not the other way around. If the wifi chip was defected, this issue should have arised a long long time ago... why only now? And why only post iOS7 upgrades?

     

    How is it that you totally ignore the fact and keep mentioning that 'iOS7 is not at fault'?!

     

    I guess this issue will be answered when 7.1 releases next month (wishful thinking).

     

     

     

    I'd like to correct you.  This issue did arise prior to iOS 7.  There are threads on this very forum related to iPhone 4S units having wi-fi greyed out after an iOS 5 or iOS 6 update.

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5112134?start=0&tstart=0

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4909703

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/message/20264313#20264313

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/message/22004470#22004470

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/message/18386341#18386341

     

    I could go on, but perhaps now you see the point.

     

    This problem has been reported prior to the iOS 7 release.

     

    How is it that you totally ignore the fact that this issue has been around for much longer than iOS 7, but keep insisting that iOS 7 is to blame?

     

    Also, explain to me how a 'burned-out' wi-fi chip will be fixed with iOS 7.1?  How does software enable a physical repair on a burned-out wi-fi chip?

     

    Why did it not appear for you, specifically, until now?  Ever hear the phrase 'the straw that broke the camel's back'?  Repeated stress, over time, can finally reveal a defect.  A defect, depending on the severity, can take varying amounts of time to be revealed.  This is a well known fact to anyone with mechanical, electrical or technical service or repair experience.

  • jigar7 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 21, 2014 5:52 AM (in response to TJBUSMC1973)

    TJBUSMC1973 wrote:

     

     

    I'd like to correct you.  This issue did arise prior to iOS 7.  There are threads on this very forum related to iPhone 4S units having wi-fi greyed out after an iOS 5 or iOS 6 update.

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5112134?start=0&tstart=0

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4909703

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/message/20264313#20264313

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/message/22004470#22004470

     

    https://discussions.apple.com/message/18386341#18386341

     

    I could go on, but perhaps now you see the point.

     

    This problem has been reported prior to the iOS 7 release.

    Well, yes the problem started with 6.1.3 (which I didn't update to... went to iOS7 directly)

    Out of the 5, the last 3 links are a joke! They are isolated events with little or no response.

    Majority 4S devices started malfunctioning after 6.1.3. Yes I had read about the wifi issue since 6.1.3 was on air. But, the argument here is what is faulty... and I say software. I still strongly believe that hardware is driven by software... have you consulted any sane software/hardware specialist? And your 'software isn't broken' statement is quite ridiculous... I would claim this to be a software bug rather than a hardware malfunction. I have a 3GS on 6.1.2 and the wifi still works perfectly... you can't say that the 4S devices are experiencing wear & tear if my 3GS is working absolutely fine!

     

    TJBUSMC1973 wrote:

     

     

    Also, explain to me how a 'burned-out' wi-fi chip will be fixed with iOS 7.1?  How does software enable a physical repair on a burned-out wi-fi chip?

     

    The same way as the hair dryer method which is working for MANY as a temporary fix. If the temperature thresholds are mentioned correctly in the firmware, the chip WILL work again.

     

    However, repeated use of the hair dryer might damage it permanently. So am holding off till 7.1 releases.

  • TJBUSMC1973 Level 5 Level 5 (4,655 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 21, 2014 6:10 AM (in response to jigar7)

    Ah, so now you're backpedaling?  First you said: "The wifi on my 4S worked perfectly since launch... iOS5 & 6 (all iterations of both those firmwares)".  But now you say: "Well, yes the problem started with 6.1.3 (which I didn't update to... went to iOS7 directly)".

     

    So, you didn't use all iterations of iOS 5 & 6.

     

    Also, you said:  "why only post iOS7 upgrades", but then you change your tune to "the problem started with 6.1.3".

     

    If this was a problem with the software, then all iPhone 4S units running the software would have the same problem... unless there was something different about the 4S units that did and did not experience the issue.

     

    I found FIVE threads where a pre-iOS 7 iPhone 4S was reported to have wi-fi greyed out.  Almost a combined total of 70 pages of discussions.  What, you want me to find you EVERY thread that talks about a pre-iOS 7 iPhone 4S wi-fi greyed out problem?  Nah, that's okay.  All I needed to do was show you that it had occurred prior to iOS 7.  And I did so.

     

    Your argument is falling apart, because you have no idea what you are talking about.  And when proof that contradicts your statements is presented, you backpedal.  First it was only iOS 7, but now you say it was iOS 6.  First you'd used all versions of iOS 5 & 6, but now you 'skipped' over 6.1.3. 

     

    You can't keep your story straight.

     

    Let me ask you this.  Do you want your iPhone 4S to be replaced?  If I offered to purchase, out of my own pocket, a brand new iPhone 4S for you, would you take it?

  • kexicus Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 21, 2014 6:57 AM (in response to jigar7)

    Well said jigar7!....Well said!....sadly you will never get TJBUSMC1973 to agree because he's simply an antagonist, on here to annoy the tens of thousands of us frustrated at buying an expensive phone that has a serious problem.  He seems to have far too much time on his hands and has nothing better to do than lurk around here winding people up.  My advice is as before.  Don't reply to him; don't get dragged into an argument with him!

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