jbranc

Q: Whole Foods required a signature after using Apple Pay

I just setup Apple Pay with my Chase Debit and used it at Whole Foods.  The process worked well, up until the point where the CC terminal asked me to sign. I had to use their little digital pen to sign on their terminal screen.  I thought the whole point of this was to not have to do that?

iPhone 6

Posted on Oct 20, 2014 12:12 PM

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Q: Whole Foods required a signature after using Apple Pay

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  • by Bill999,

    Bill999 Bill999 Dec 7, 2014 4:22 AM in response to anypats
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 4:22 AM in response to anypats

    I trried asking a few stores about my experiences using Apple Pay at their POS terminals. Here's part of the response I got from the Front End Manager at my local  Wegman's:


    "I have communicated to our corporate offices about the apple pay procedures as I have had a few customers inquire about our process at Wegmans.  Unfortunately our electronic systems here at Wegmans cannot differentiate an apple pay from credit or debit which is why the terminal will prompt the question to the customer after scanning the phone.  This is similar with the signature over $50.  Because our systems cannot distinguish an apple pay credit versus an on hand credit card, it will ask the customer to sign for any purchase over $50.  I completely understand your frustrations with this particular process, especially since a highlighted feature of apple pay is how fast and convenient it is.  If you have any further questions or concerns please feel free to contact me at the store."


    Even if every merchant rolled out an EMV-compliant POS terminal soon, if this is any example that still wouldn't make using Apple Pay more convenient than using a credit card. Perhaps I'm overreacting, but this reminds me a little bit of the Maps app fiasco. Is Apple Pay ready for prime time? If Apple doesn't find a way to get its iPhones recognized by all those new POS terminals, how likely is Apple Pay to be in wide use a year or two from now?

  • by G3gator,

    G3gator G3gator Dec 7, 2014 4:28 AM in response to Bill999
    Level 3 (571 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 4:28 AM in response to Bill999

    So, if this is a general issue with Apple Pay, why aren't thousands of other merchants using the system having this same problem?  It sounds like to me that this is a Wegmans problem.

     

    George

  • by Bill999,

    Bill999 Bill999 Dec 7, 2014 4:41 AM in response to G3gator
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 4:41 AM in response to G3gator

    Well, each time I use Apple Pay at my local Wallgreens pharmacy, i have a somewhat similar experience. After scanning my iPhone, I have to answer a question about whether or not I want to contribute to a Wallgreens charity. Next, I have to enter my telephone number for their rewards program, or else explicitly decline to enter it. In addition, if my bill totals over $50 or so, I also have to furnish a signature. Frankly, if I were using my credit card at CVS's auto-checkout terminal, I'd be out of the store a lot quicker. I really don't think even the participating merchants are ready for Apple Pay, at least not in my experience.

  • by G3gator,

    G3gator G3gator Dec 7, 2014 4:58 AM in response to Bill999
    Level 3 (571 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 4:58 AM in response to Bill999

    I have had no problems at Walgreens using it multiple times. And, I have never furnished a signature. 

     

    But, yes, Apple Pay doesn't enter awards program points and it doesn't make coffee, sweep the floor, etc., etc.

     

    George

  • by Bill999,

    Bill999 Bill999 Dec 7, 2014 7:08 AM in response to G3gator
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 7:08 AM in response to G3gator

    By "no problems," do you mean you've never had to answer the kind of questions I do? My Walgreen's is in Boston--where's yours? What's the largest amount you've ever charged at Walgreen's? Beyond their threshold, they will ask for a signature.

     

    I just used Apple Pay at Whole Foods for the first time, and I have to say it was fairly easy. I had to agree explicitly to the amount (why?), but that was all. I did not purchase enough to have to enter a signature, but I realize they would have asked for one if I'd bought more.

  • by G3gator,

    G3gator G3gator Dec 7, 2014 7:32 AM in response to Bill999
    Level 3 (571 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 7:32 AM in response to Bill999

    By no problems, I mean the only thing I do is hold my phone near the terminal and touch the home button to approve. I have never had to do anything else. It is possible that I haven't gone over some limit requiring a signature. I think the highest charge I have had using Apple Pay (by looking at the last few transactions) was $47.47.

     

    But, I do have to have my Walgreens app scanned for reward points (as I did when I used a physical credit card).

     

    My Walgreens is in Gainesville, Florida.

  • by Bill999,

    Bill999 Bill999 Dec 7, 2014 7:54 AM in response to G3gator
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 7:54 AM in response to G3gator

    Maybe we could swap Walgreen's managers? ;-).

     

    Personally, I don't care for the rewards cards business because there's no way I can opt out of it permanently. My ideal is just to be able to scan my iPhone and be done with it--the way the top Apple execs keep showing us. In Boston, in a number of chains that accpet Apple Pay, we're far from that ideal. Can Apple help?

  • by jjkraw,

    jjkraw jjkraw Dec 7, 2014 8:49 AM in response to Bill999
    Level 2 (337 points)
    Apple TV
    Dec 7, 2014 8:49 AM in response to Bill999

    I also am in the Boston area and the charity contribution and rewards card questions at Walgreens come up whether I use a credit card, debit card, or Apple Pay. So those parts are not an Apple Pay thing. They are a Walgreens thing.

     

    I usually don't exceed the credit card signature threshold, so I normally don't have to sign w/ a credit card and I've never had to with Apple Pay (but again, only because I didn't hit the threshold).

  • by Thatchcote,

    Thatchcote Thatchcote Dec 7, 2014 8:57 AM in response to Bill999
    Level 3 (615 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 8:57 AM in response to Bill999

    While Apple may be one of the richest companies in the world, it is not "boss" of the entire world...yet.  Ha!  If companies want to complicate a secure, simple system of payment, then they can and Apple can do nothing about this unless they wish to drop the company from participating, not a good idea in these early days.  I have no doubt that the company's IT dept is antediluvian.  Insulting?  Perhaps, but probably true - just look at the various debacles this past year at Target, Home Depot and Neiman Marcus.  HUGE companies whose IT departments for credit card use should have known better. 

     

    Some people will find Apple Pay convenient, some will not.  I think women are the most likely to really like it.  A woman's handbag is like a black hole.  Her wallet is filled with 20 credit cards.  Fumbling with all of this (after extracting the wallet from the black hole) is far more cumbersome that having to sign a terminal after using Apple Pay. 

     

    Personally, I think Apple was brilliant to already have so many major credit cards and merchants signed on when it was first announced.  This is something Google did not do and as a result, the system is difficult to use - just find someone who takes it.  Yes, in Oct 2015, there will be a learning curve for all the new chip terminals - I have no doubt there will be some chaos.  Personally, I might have chosen AFTER the beginning of the year to introduce it as "new" at the beginning of the Xmas shopping season can be a nightmare.  On the other hand, less fraud during this huge shopping season. 

     

    I love the statement of one poster "only" 86% of businesses will be participating in the new chip technology by Oct 2015.  "ONLY"?  Good grief - that is HUGE! 

  • by jjkraw,

    jjkraw jjkraw Dec 7, 2014 9:09 AM in response to Thatchcote
    Level 2 (337 points)
    Apple TV
    Dec 7, 2014 9:09 AM in response to Thatchcote

    Agreed, Thatchcote. Even some guys like me find just grabbing the phone (always in an easily accessible pocket) is easier than pulling out the wallet, grabbing the right card, etc.  The signing doesn't bug me.

     

    First World problems...

  • by xenolalia1,

    xenolalia1 xenolalia1 Dec 7, 2014 10:15 AM in response to G3gator
    Level 1 (14 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 10:15 AM in response to G3gator

    I have been outside the USA for three weeks, but in my limited use of ApplePay I had to sign only for a purchase over $50 at Walgreens.

  • by anypats,

    anypats anypats Dec 7, 2014 10:51 AM in response to Bill999
    Level 4 (1,791 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 10:51 AM in response to Bill999

    I don't think signatures are going to go away and some businesses will require it for any transaction regardless of the price. By signing a credit card slip you are agreeing to pay the amount stated on the receipt. That way if you ever dispute the charges the company can produce a signed receipt and it can help with the disputed charges. I worked for a company once that I needed to fill out forms. We would get disputes for even partial amounts because they didn't think the product was worth what they agreed. I always had to produce a signed receipt to the credit card company. I had one that the employee forgot to get a signature and we lost the disputed amount. The reason that companies Have stopped requiring signatures for lower amounts is that they typically don't have people disputing charges for those lower amounts and if they did have a handful then it's not going to be a huge issue.

     

    Someday there may be a way to indicate that your fingerprint is just as good - or better - than a signature. But there would need to be a way for the terminal to recognize it is an Apple Pay transaction ( which currently they only recognize it as a credit card). Also it would need to recognize that you input with a fingerprint since you can also enter a pin if Touch ID isn't working or if it's not reading your fingerprint for some reason.

  • by anypats,

    anypats anypats Dec 7, 2014 11:08 AM in response to Thatchcote
    Level 4 (1,791 points)
    Dec 7, 2014 11:08 AM in response to Thatchcote

    My comment about "only 86%" was only quoted because they say they will support it within two years - not the October 2015 deadline that has been imposed. Therefore it may take longer for EMV payments to become mainstream in the US. Add the gas stations that have an additional two years and I don't think EMV payments will be too prominent until 2016 sometime.

  • by Bill999,

    Bill999 Bill999 Dec 11, 2014 3:44 PM in response to anypats
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Dec 11, 2014 3:44 PM in response to anypats

    Good news! I shopped at Walgreens in Boston again today, and they have drastically revised their POS terminal software. I was able to use Apple Pay, scratch a signature, and leave the store. No more charity solicitations, no more telephone number entry,, no more hassle. I even walked away with a coupon for a  future purchase without the use of any rewards card. I have to say, Apple Pay is really nice when the merchants support it this way. Hurrah!

  • by NR2D,

    NR2D NR2D Dec 11, 2014 4:12 PM in response to jbranc
    Level 1 (35 points)
    Mac OS X
    Dec 11, 2014 4:12 PM in response to jbranc

    Depending on your credit card company they may require a signature if your purchase is over a certain dollar amount. I know that when I use my American Express either by using the card or using Apply Pay I have to sign the terminal if the purchase is over $50.

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