UltimateDavid

Q: Buy Or Not, Final Cut XVs Avid Or Premier?

Many say that Final Cut Pro X is just an upgrade version of imove and nothing else. That many applications do not become any more good than they were in Pro 7. What do you think? Should I buy this kind of sofware or just buy Premier or Avid?

OS X Yosemite (10.10.1)

Posted on Dec 25, 2014 12:02 PM

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Q: Buy Or Not, Final Cut XVs Avid Or Premier?

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  • by David Bogie Chq-1,

    David Bogie Chq-1 David Bogie Chq-1 Dec 29, 2014 11:17 AM in response to Ziatron
    Level 7 (25,807 points)
    Video
    Dec 29, 2014 11:17 AM in response to Ziatron

    Ziatron wrote:

     

    why would any of us here, on an Apple-sponsored user forum for Final Cut Pro, recommend anything other than FCPX?

    Because we care about the customer ?

    You have seen the movie “Miracle on 34th St." ?   Remember the Santa Claus working at Macy's.  He sent a few customers to Gimbel's department store when it best suited their needs.

    The public reaction?  It made them love Macy's.

    Not a good comparison. The OP didn't tell us why he needs any of these video editing products nor did he indicate he knew what he was going to do with what he bought; Santa knew what the Macy's customers were asking for.

  • by David Bogie Chq-1,

    David Bogie Chq-1 David Bogie Chq-1 Dec 29, 2014 11:19 AM in response to Ian R. Brown
    Level 7 (25,807 points)
    Video
    Dec 29, 2014 11:19 AM in response to Ian R. Brown

    Ian R. Brown wrote:

    I started my NL editing in 2001 with iMovie 2, a totally different beast from the current apps bearing the same name.

     

    We started with Media 100 in 1996 or '97. Premiere was a pathetic joke and Avid was ten times the money.

    I walked to work in the snow carrying my RCA TK70 and three battery belts.

  • by NotAppleSupportGuy,

    NotAppleSupportGuy NotAppleSupportGuy Jan 2, 2015 7:38 PM in response to David Bogie Chq-1
    Level 1 (25 points)
    Jan 2, 2015 7:38 PM in response to David Bogie Chq-1

    What ? A very sensible Mac user. Bugger me!

     

    I have done what you said, but on a far greater scale, before you said it. I committed to F.C.P.X because I have never rented anything in my life, other than a car, and Adobe is but a software rental company. So I not only had to buy the F.C.P.X etc., but also I spent $4,000.00/$5,000.00 on a Mac Pro. Unfortunately no-one told me that you had to get lessons and trawl forums like this to be able to use F.P.C.X at all. I taught myself Premier Pro without any help what-so-ever, because it stays within recognisable bounds, and if you have used a DAW of high quality Prem. Pro. is a piece of ****. (Oops I didn't realise I couldn't use that word instead of urine.)

     

    I wish I had never seen Mac OS and FCPX!! But I have, and now I have to heed your sensible advice and just get on with it!

     

    I'm off to the library to get my projects! Hope it's open!

  • by Ian R. Brown,

    Ian R. Brown Ian R. Brown Jan 3, 2015 1:04 AM in response to NotAppleSupportGuy
    Level 6 (18,660 points)
    Mac OS X
    Jan 3, 2015 1:04 AM in response to NotAppleSupportGuy

    I'm not sure whether you are having problems getting to grips with FCP X, but if you are, there is a very useful free 2 hour online video course to get you up and running with the basic essentials.

     

    http://www.izzyvideo.com/final-cut-pro-x-tutorial/


    The 2 hours plus course is broken down into 27 bite-sized lessons.

  • by StianZ,

    StianZ StianZ Jan 3, 2015 6:54 AM in response to UltimateDavid
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Jan 3, 2015 6:54 AM in response to UltimateDavid

    If I may. I am at the moment working on my fcpx, and it is frustrating as ****. It is slow and buggy. I work only on proxy media, but the need to render is killing me. It hangs 1 of 5 times when I just want to open another event. It crashes always when I wish to make a new custom batch renaming on clips. The timeline is sluggish and choppy. I want it to be good, and for smaller projects I often give fcpx another go just to see if it will be a good experience this time. But so far I have never enjoyed fcpx. I work on a macbook pro and iMac. It should be good enough, at least my 2014 IMac!

     

    But when I work on tv-series and films I use Avid, and that is of course not without errors either. But good god you can relay on the Avid software. You can also choose to rent it or buy it. And they have just released their DNxHR codec with full 4k in version 8.3.

     

    I have tried light works, premiere, fcp7, fcpx, davinci 10 & 11. And many of them has super nice features and all. But coming back to Avid after is always like meeting my best friend after I have been away for a long time.

     

    So I would recommend to work in a combination of these programs:

     

    Avid for all editing and delivery to grade, sound and vfx.

    Davinci lite 11 for transcoding to Avid, added online and output options

    Adobe after effects of course for many things

    Adobe photoshop and illustrator for creating to AE.

    Sorenson squeeze for super nice transcoding

    A subscription on google drive as a shared platform for everyone on the project

    Rsync

     

    I have only used fcpx for adding nice titles and for it's ability to fast render to nice looking h264.

     

     

     

     

  • by Karsten Schlüter,

    Karsten Schlüter Karsten Schlüter Jan 3, 2015 7:24 AM in response to StianZ
    Level 7 (32,713 points)
    Video
    Jan 3, 2015 7:24 AM in response to StianZ

    StianZ wrote:

    …  working on my fcpx, and it is frustrating as ****. It is slow and buggy. I work only on proxy media, but the need to render is killing me. It hangs 1 of 5 times …

     

    I'm wondering what's wrong with your FCPX ... reading how Mark Spencer delivers 'over night' from a Hotel-room-desktop-set-up.

    http://www.fcp.co/final-cut-pro/articles/1572-using-multicam-in-final-cut-pro-x- to-edit-the-bioneers-25th-anniversary-conference

     

    or, how the Tour de France reports are done...

    http://www.fcp.co/final-cut-pro/articles/1480-editing-the-tour-de-france-on-fina l-cut-pro-x

     

    or, how the BBC delivers its news with 'its' FCPX

    http://www.fcp.co/final-cut-pro/articles/1487-the-bbc-adopts-final-cut-pro-x-for -news-gathering

     

    or, ...

    No, FCPX is, in general, 'buggy'.- StianZ does know.

     

    < … >

  • by innocentius,

    innocentius innocentius Jan 3, 2015 7:45 AM in response to StianZ
    Level 4 (1,885 points)
    Jan 3, 2015 7:45 AM in response to StianZ

    WHy are you posting this negative comments ? Why on earth are you using those hopeless products from Apple. You have been using FCP X for about a day or so. With your attitude you should stay with your favorites, Avid and Premiere. They both work on your mac.

  • by StianZ,

    StianZ StianZ Jan 3, 2015 8:31 AM in response to innocentius
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Jan 3, 2015 8:31 AM in response to innocentius

    I am posting negative comments because I have negative experiences. I have done jobs now and then over a two year period on fcpx and had to many things go wrong. I don't say fcp in general is bad, I am simply telling about a few of the things I struggle with. I am well within system requirements and should not have these issues. I can see that Mark Spencer is doing alright on his "hotel-room-desktop-setup" with his IMac for DIT work and Mac Pro with thunderbolt Pegasus drives editing, and of course his Macbook for internet. I see he have encountered a problem with wave forms and I will also try to not use them when I work with long footage though.

     

    I will stay with my favourite Avid, and of course it works on OS X, I believe they designed it so. On that subject, I would definitely recommend everybody to use OS X for tv & film production. Rsync, preview and Davinci is three of many reasons:)

  • by StianZ,

    StianZ StianZ Jan 3, 2015 9:03 AM in response to Karsten Schlüter
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Jan 3, 2015 9:03 AM in response to Karsten Schlüter

    I raise you with this link: FCPX 10.1 Very slow on iMac and lots of spinning beach balls

     

    Articles about success stories is great, but threads like this does not appear for no reason.

  • by Karsten Schlüter,

    Karsten Schlüter Karsten Schlüter Jan 3, 2015 9:56 AM in response to StianZ
    Level 7 (32,713 points)
    Video
    Jan 3, 2015 9:56 AM in response to StianZ

    StianZ wrote:

    Articles about success stories is great, but threads like this does not appear for no reason.

    You miss my point:

    ANY product with such a complexity as FCPX could have 'issues' … for one or another user.

    So has Avid, AE, AP, whatever.... The fora for those products bristle with 'bad experience reports'.

    … which, by the way, is immanent of any SUPPORT forum, as this.

    (nobody posts here "All fine! Nothing to see! Carry on!" … )

     

    But you're claiming FCPX buggy, slow, hanging... Are you sure the BBC et al would dare to use FCPX, if the problem is inside the box, and not sitting in front of the monitor??

     

    If you have issues with it - you should solve it.

    But don't claim to be smarter than much profounder users.

    Emphasis on users. You don't use it. Me think.

     

    btw: the ToU of this board specifically do not allow 'just rants'.

    If you need help - full description of set-up, source-material, and error report (in your own thread, please)

    If you just want to vent - this way, please …

  • by innocentius,

    innocentius innocentius Jan 3, 2015 10:32 AM in response to StianZ
    Level 4 (1,885 points)
    Jan 3, 2015 10:32 AM in response to StianZ

    STop this ranting, the problem you have is that, you have never tried to learn using FCPX it is no plug and play and you are not going to try to learn it. Ijust wonder what you are doing on this forum, you are certainlynot a professional user.

  • by NotAppleSupportGuy,

    NotAppleSupportGuy NotAppleSupportGuy Jan 3, 2015 12:56 PM in response to Ian R. Brown
    Level 1 (25 points)
    Jan 3, 2015 12:56 PM in response to Ian R. Brown

    Ian........Thanks for a reasonable voice. I actually paid to download Izzy's Beginners and Advance Courses, and it is those that have me being able to use F.C.P.X at all.

     

    My complaint with F.C.P.X is the same as my complaint with OS. It is Apple's way or the highway. Projects in Libraries? A magnetic storyline I can't turn off or can't disconnect a clip from?!! (Maybe I can dis-connect them, but I am yet to find out how. If I can dis-connect them it should be easy to workout.) Would it be so hard to allow me to hold down the shift or option key as I click on a clip and that releases it from the magnetic thingy until I release the held down key? No it would be as easy as ****! (What!!! I can't say a word used a ****-of-a-lot in the bible and by my old sunday school teacher?) But the Apple guys don't think like that. It may be there somewhere as an option, but they'll hide it away incase some idiot uses it. They know best, and I, as a user, should just except this. Again maybe there is some way to do this, but if there is I can not only not find it in F.C.P.X, I can't find it on Youtube or in Izzy's Courses.

     

    I do band videos mainly and band interviews. An interview in F.C.P.X is easy. One storyline, a couple of cutaways, a title and great tools to jig the lighting etc. Piece of urine. (Got it this time) But a band video? Eight musicians and a drummer!?!!?! Six cameras?!!?! and I have all this trying to stick to one storyline. I know one can have multiple storylines, but oh how easy it would be to have things in their own lanes with me deciding what sticks to what. (And yes I have studied Izzy's multi-cam tutorial.)

     

    I came to this forum thinking it would be as helpful to me as the other Apple forums I have frequented, and if there are more guys like Ian then that may yet prove to be the case, but it seems there are some here who are just blind Apple-ites who don't know they don't know, and it's just about justification of their own choices. In case someone here wishes to have a go at me for these views, please be aware that I not only owned Apple computers back in the 80's and 90's I sold them for a living. I thought it would be like coming home. Unfortunately it hasn't been.

     

    You guys who know all the things that we F.C.P.X-luddites don't, should not be so precious if our frustrations cause us to have a bit of a vent. Be like Ian has been and just be helpful........Thanks again Ian.

  • by StianZ,

    StianZ StianZ Jan 3, 2015 2:18 PM in response to NotAppleSupportGuy
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Jan 3, 2015 2:18 PM in response to NotAppleSupportGuy

    Do you mean you wish to move clips around the timeline without magnetic effect, like you can when you press "P" for position editing? Also press and hold alt-cmd and then you can move around the attachment point between the storyline and clips on top of it, also for on audio clips attachment points of course. But this is probably not for this thread:)

     

    The OP asked for recommendations, and I gave him mine. This thread gave him in some cases wrong info, like Avid only being rental. And not that it is important but I have tried fcpx quite a bit. Also I do make my living of feature films and tv drama, and I want fcpx to be as good as you seem to believe. But fcpx seem to be meant for doing everything within the app itself. It is hard to get proper control of the workflow, especially to Pro Tools.

     

    Someone here also seems to believe Avid is hard to learn, but it isn't. And it works really well. Infact most of Hollywood seems to agree, and so do the Norwegian industry believe. I have only seen Avid on all of my freelance jobs the last three years. And that includes 3 feature films and 2 tv-series ( like Lilyhammer season 3 and Dead Snow 2, red vs dead). Our "BBC", called NRK also had to choose, and they went for Premiere. So actually to know fcpx in my job, is almost a useless skill. And I believe that should also be considered when you choose a software to learn.

     

    But, I am trooping on, willing to learn, and no, I will not give up fcpx. Because I think as an editor/post production worker, one must know all software. Do you guys know Avid, can you even compare? Or have you only opened the trial once:)

  • by NotAppleSupportGuy,

    NotAppleSupportGuy NotAppleSupportGuy Jan 3, 2015 2:42 PM in response to StianZ
    Level 1 (25 points)
    Jan 3, 2015 2:42 PM in response to StianZ

    Thanks StianZ.............You'd better be careful old mate. You'll make your detractors here revise their opinion of you..............Nah they probably won't. I'm the one who knows stuff-all. I now know a little more thanks to you. 'Tis a bit hard to test your advice until I get a twenty lane video in, but here's hoping. I'll know when a still image out of view has moved 15 seconds and all the other lanes have moved down and out of the horizontal position I want them in without me knowing it because it's connected to a clip I have moved.

  • by Ian R. Brown,

    Ian R. Brown Ian R. Brown Jan 4, 2015 7:20 AM in response to NotAppleSupportGuy
    Level 6 (18,660 points)
    Mac OS X
    Jan 4, 2015 7:20 AM in response to NotAppleSupportGuy

    When FCP X was introduced to the world on 21.06.2011 (UK dates!) it was quite a radical, innovative app which contained many flaws for the pro user.

     

    Most of them were quickly rectified during the first year and regular updates have improved it even further so that now it is amongst the best NLEs available.

     

    Some would say it is far and away the best but that is a matter of opinion based on personal working practices.

     

    What is certain, is that it is radically different from most other editing apps and requires a somewhat different mindset. Obviously whenever something new challenges what has been the norm for decades, you will need to get accustomed.

     

    I think it would be fair to say that if you cannot accomplish a particular task, the fault  is most likely to be in the user rather than FCP X, which is where these forums come in.

     

    If you can't work out how to do a simple or arcane task, a question posted here will almost certainly produce the required answer  .  .  .  assuming it is humanly possible. The responses can come within minutes and will certainly take no longer than a few hours.

     

    An even quicker answer can often be found by simply googling the web with a question like, "How do you do x in FCP X?"  YouTube can also be a good source of "How to  .  .  . ?"  video tutorials.

     

    The reason that a few "regulars" on this forum get a bit hot under the collar occasionally is that frequently people  blast FCP X without getting to know it, blaming the application instead of their own ignorance.

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