Jerome Del Ray

Q: Your internet on life support?  Blame Photos app.

Unbelievable.

 

This morning my internet slowed down to a crawl.  Noticed that iMac, iPhone, and iPad all crawling.  So I turned on my iPhone hotspot and waited it out.  (That works sometimes.)  It didn't this time.  Reset modem, airport, and such three times.  Broadband would come, then go.

 

Then I had a theory.  Maybe it was the iMac bringing the network down, since other devices were not really being used.  Turned off iMac.  Broadband explodes to 50 Megabit and stays steady.  Turned iMac back down, internet is crawling on it's knees.

 

So I open up Activity Monitor.  Under the network tab, something called 'nsurlsessiond' is sending packets everywhere.  I Google this process and learn it's buddies with iCloud. 

 

Then it hits me.  That weird 'pause for a day' button in Photos preferences.  I mean why not STOP AND START?  I'm like, "Did this thing turn on by itself?"  Opened up preferences, and yup -- Photos is trying to sneak upload what is still THOUSANDS of photos.

 

The problem here is that this isn't in the spirit of 'doing something in the background'.  Because it decimates what a user is doing in foreground.  This would be like if 'repair disk permissions' happened in the background... with no warning... for hours on end.

 

Again, unbelievable.  Hope this helps someone.

Posted on Apr 13, 2015 3:16 PM

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Q: Your internet on life support?  Blame Photos app.

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  • by Csound1,

    Csound1 Csound1 Apr 15, 2015 10:51 AM in response to Jerome Del Ray
    Level 9 (51,196 points)
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    Apr 15, 2015 10:51 AM in response to Jerome Del Ray

    The issue is that Apple has an automatic upload process

    Absolute rubbish, it is NOT an automatic process, the user (you) had to turn the iCloud Photo Library on. Now maybe you are the type who switches things on without bothering to read what will happen but that is your issue.

     

    In the meantime you are posting falsehoods.

  • by Csound1,

    Csound1 Csound1 Apr 15, 2015 10:59 AM in response to MedicosMom
    Level 9 (51,196 points)
    Desktops
    Apr 15, 2015 10:59 AM in response to MedicosMom

    MedicosMom wrote:

     

    My internet almost stops when Photos is loading to the iCloud! I need a T-1 line based on what has been transferred so far

    A T1 line is 1.5Mb/s, very slow. Why would you want that?

  • by Jerome Del Ray,

    Jerome Del Ray Jerome Del Ray Apr 15, 2015 10:59 AM in response to Winston Churchill
    Level 1 (73 points)
    iPhone
    Apr 15, 2015 10:59 AM in response to Winston Churchill

    Winston Churchill wrote:

     

    It stalls for long periods of time (hours),

    Yes, we know it does this and the likely reason is server load, but this is not the complaint made by the OP, they said their network came to a standstill and it was Photos fault. You are discussing an entirely different issue to the OP, which will only mislead others who are hoping to get help. It's very important that a thread stays on topic, indeed it's part of the rules you agreed to when you signed up to use these forums.


    It's very important a thread stays on topic... says the rude and snarky fool... who has been trying to change the topic for pages and pages.

     

    Here's the funny part:  I was never seeking help.  I never asked a question.  I simply made a warning to users that when auto uploading resumes in the background, you'll receive no warning of such and likely believe your network or ISP is screwed up.  Couldn't be simpler.

  • by Csound1,

    Csound1 Csound1 Apr 15, 2015 11:04 AM in response to Jerome Del Ray
    Level 9 (51,196 points)
    Desktops
    Apr 15, 2015 11:04 AM in response to Jerome Del Ray

    And your warning was false, so that aspect of it was pointed out in case other readers actually believed your nonsense.

     

    For all readers, the basis of Jeromer's post is that there is an automatic upload. there is not, uploading requires that the user MANUALLY switch on the iCloud Photo Library, unless and until you do nothing uploads. Except possibly in the minds of some posters.

     

    If you do not want to upload then do not switch the library upload on. Simple as that.

  • by Jerome Del Ray,

    Jerome Del Ray Jerome Del Ray Apr 15, 2015 11:15 AM in response to Csound1
    Level 1 (73 points)
    iPhone
    Apr 15, 2015 11:15 AM in response to Csound1

    Csound1 wrote:

     

    The issue is that Apple has an automatic upload process

    Absolute rubbish, it is NOT an automatic process, the user (you) had to turn the iCloud Photo Library on. Now maybe you are the type who switches things on without bothering to read what will happen but that is your issue.

     

    In the meantime you are posting falsehoods.


    Yes, a user must first turn on uploading.  And I did notice that it says, "Pause for a day" when I hit the pause button.  So I presumed it would likely come back on a day later.   That a process would automatically resume uploading the next day.  That's how I can say Apple has an automatic upload process.

     

    Since there is no warning when this automatic upload process resumes, users can (and do) mistake it as network issues.

     

    Csound.  Why can't you and Snarkhill admit you've lost this one. 

  • by Jerome Del Ray,

    Jerome Del Ray Jerome Del Ray Apr 15, 2015 11:30 AM in response to Drew Reece
    Level 1 (73 points)
    iPhone
    Apr 15, 2015 11:30 AM in response to Drew Reece

    link removed

  • by Csound1,

    Csound1 Csound1 Apr 15, 2015 11:56 AM in response to Jerome Del Ray
    Level 9 (51,196 points)
    Desktops
    Apr 15, 2015 11:56 AM in response to Jerome Del Ray

    Jerome Del Ray wrote:

     

    Csound1 wrote:

     

    The issue is that Apple has an automatic upload process

    Absolute rubbish, it is NOT an automatic process, the user (you) had to turn the iCloud Photo Library on. Now maybe you are the type who switches things on without bothering to read what will happen but that is your issue.

     

    In the meantime you are posting falsehoods.


    Yes, a user must first turn on uploading.

    Which makes it a manual rather than automatic process, except in your mind.

     

    I'm done with your falsehoods and fantasies, have a good one.

  • by Drew Reece,

    Drew Reece Drew Reece Apr 15, 2015 12:06 PM in response to Alley_Cat
    Level 5 (7,746 points)
    Notebooks
    Apr 15, 2015 12:06 PM in response to Alley_Cat

    Alley_Cat wrote:

     

    I think it's largely irrelevant if uploading is a background/foreground process, though for some people an ability to control upload bandwidth used would be helpful.  Perhaps their routers offer some QoS options which could be configured during large library uploads if there is no in-built solution.

     

     

    QoS (Quality of Service) could help here if you were willing to set it up, however it is a part of the router & network infrastructure, not the OS. As such it is beyond Apple's control for a huge percentage of users. Do Apples own routers even offer QoS?

     

    The solution is quite clear to me (and some others here), but unfortunately I don't know how to implement it (or have the time to test it).

     

    The OS needs to throttle the upload rate to a level that allows other outbound internet traffic to still function on the network - for each person that is likely to be a different value.

     

    Look at other apps that upload large quantities of data (Dropbox, BackBlaze, Mozy, Arq) even Torrent clients get this right! – They offer a preference to limit the upload rate, some offer automatic or time based throttling too (automatic throttling is an oxymoron - it can't know how other users are loading the internet connection but it is better than nothing).

    These throttling settings allow apps to upload whilst not killing other clients using the same internet connection. Apparently this is too complex for Apples users to understand - so Apple left this feature out.

     

    OS X 10.10 uses the 'pf firewall' - that can be configured to filter & throttle traffic from specific processes. I'd suggest that any experienced Mac user/ Unix admin takes a look at that. I think it needs to rely on 'dummynet' to achieve this, since Apple built the kernel without support for filtering per process in pf.

     

    Another more brutal option is to use Network Link Conditioner to alter all uploads on a Mac. It could help other users on the local network, but at the price of slowing all outbound data on the Mac.

    http://osxdaily.com/2011/08/10/simulate-internet-connectivity-bandwidth-speeds-n etwork-link-conditioner/

    That is part of Xcode.

     

    Configure network link conditioner & see how it edits the pf rules as a starting point would be my suggestion. Then look at how to limit the rules for a single process (or the 2 processes that have been mentioned here).

     

    This issue is 'solvable' IMO, but I don't know of any easy GUI apps that make it simple to do, so the answers involve reading manuals…

    https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/documentation/Darwin/Reference/ManPages/ man5/pf.conf.5.html

    https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/documentation/Darwin/Reference/ManPages/ man4/dummynet.4.html

     

    Frankly it is simpler to turn of iCloud uploads & wait for something to change, even with throttling there will be a long duration of uploads that effect other users on the network it just needs to be reduced to make it bearable.

  • by Jerome Del Ray,

    Jerome Del Ray Jerome Del Ray Apr 15, 2015 12:16 PM in response to Csound1
    Level 1 (73 points)
    iPhone
    Apr 15, 2015 12:16 PM in response to Csound1

    Csound1 wrote:

     

    Jerome Del Ray wrote:

     

    Csound1 wrote:

     

    The issue is that Apple has an automatic upload process

    Absolute rubbish, it is NOT an automatic process, the user (you) had to turn the iCloud Photo Library on. Now maybe you are the type who switches things on without bothering to read what will happen but that is your issue.

     

    In the meantime you are posting falsehoods.


    Yes, a user must first turn on uploading.

    Which makes it a manual rather than automatic process, except in your mind.

     

    I'm done with your falsehoods and fantasies, have a good one.

     

    I've already granted that the user manually turns on an automatic uploading process.  When it resumes a day later (at an unspecified time), there's no pop up window, alert, or spinning icon in the dock indicating uploading has resumed.  This can create the illusion something is wrong with your network, which is supported by the overwhelming number of posters on this board that agree.

     

    Not one falsehood in that paragraph.  A paragraph you will ignore or distort in your following comment.

  • by Csound1,

    Csound1 Csound1 Apr 15, 2015 12:18 PM in response to Jerome Del Ray
    Level 9 (51,196 points)
    Desktops
    Apr 15, 2015 12:18 PM in response to Jerome Del Ray

    I've already granted that the user manually turns on an automatic uploading process.

    That's a non sequitor, either it is manual (as in you start it yourself) or it's automatic (as in you don't)

     

    Can you not grasp the difference?

     

    Actually I apologize for asking that last question, clearly you can not tell the difference.

  • by lprofitt,Helpful

    lprofitt lprofitt Apr 15, 2015 12:31 PM in response to Jerome Del Ray
    Level 1 (5 points)
    Apr 15, 2015 12:31 PM in response to Jerome Del Ray

    Good frickin lord, I'm an Apple user for over 30 years, work in IT and can generally solve most of my own issues but have been digging around for info on Photos since I enabled Photos several days ago...after wading through this whole thread I have learned several things... I am not alone in experiencing wacky "issues" after Photos was enabled, there is no real way to determine a "true" current status for Photos and it will apparently go on for some time.  Oh, and Winston Churchill and Csound are apparently more interested in serving their own semantic interests and gaining guru points than in actually being helpful, so I now know to cruise past their posts unless I need entertained.  Thanks Jerome.

  • by Csound1,

    Csound1 Csound1 Apr 15, 2015 12:26 PM in response to lprofitt
    Level 9 (51,196 points)
    Desktops
    Apr 15, 2015 12:26 PM in response to lprofitt

    As an IT expert you surely know how to divide the library size by the upload rate and therebye get a time estimate. Have you done that?

     

    What is it?

  • by Jerome Del Ray,

    Jerome Del Ray Jerome Del Ray Apr 15, 2015 12:29 PM in response to Csound1
    Level 1 (73 points)
    iPhone
    Apr 15, 2015 12:29 PM in response to Csound1

    Csound1 wrote:

     

    I've already granted that the user manually turns on an automatic uploading process.

    That's a non sequitor, either it is manual (as in you start it yourself) or it's automatic (as in you don't)

     

    Can you not grasp the difference?


    Time Machine.  When you first plug an external drive into Yosemite, a message/alert pops up and asks if you'd like to back up your computer to said drive.  Let's say you say no.  It will therefore not backup.  Until you ask it to do so manually. 

     

    But it also has an automatic backup process.  A process, like Photos, that you must first manually turn on.  Once this automatic process is turned on, Time Machine animates an icon in the menu bar when a backup is in progress.  It warns you that the automatic backup process you manually turned on once is working.

     

    Photos uploading does not alert you uploading has resumed.  It can therefore create the illusion your network is on life support.

  • by Csound1,

    Csound1 Csound1 Apr 15, 2015 12:31 PM in response to Jerome Del Ray
    Level 9 (51,196 points)
    Desktops
    Apr 15, 2015 12:31 PM in response to Jerome Del Ray

    You're so funny,

     

    Like I said, have a good one.

  • by Csound1,

    Csound1 Csound1 Apr 15, 2015 12:41 PM in response to Jerome Del Ray
    Level 9 (51,196 points)
    Desktops
    Apr 15, 2015 12:41 PM in response to Jerome Del Ray

    I see that you have provided help to at least 7 people in your 10 years on the site, almost one a year.

     

    Keep it up.

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