Q: What happened to the option to secure empty trash in Finder?

I think it has been removed.

About the security content of OS X El Capitan v10.11 - Apple Support

"Description: An issue existed in guaranteeing secure deletion of Trash files on some systems, such as those with flash storage. This issue was addressed by removing the "Secure Empty Trash" option."

It appears Apple has changed the way the trash is emptied.

Move the file to the Trash then right or control click the file then click Delete Immediately.

That removes the location and overwrites the file so it can’t be recovered ever by anyone.

From here >  http://www.macobserver.com/tmo/article/el-capitan-beta-the-delete-immediately-fe ature

OS X El Capitan: Delete files and folders

I received the email notification that this topic was answered but it's not showing up yet due to issues with the forum software. Sorry for any inconvenience.

Hi Carolyn: yes today the forum is working very badly, updates randomly late or later post earlier than the early ones (if at all).

Thank you for this contribution, works great.

Lex

A Delete Immediately option may have existed in an El Capitan beta (I have no recollection of seeing it) but it no longer is an option. I have checked all my computers in an effort to find it, but it does not exist any longer. It also doesn't exist in any extant EC betas.

Hi Veteran,

It is in my ElCapitan: open the trash ctl+click the file and delete immediately.

I can not check other macs, since I am not at home.

have a nice day.

Problem still not solved: "Delete immediately" does not mean securely emptying the trash, according to references cited.

MacObserver article explains that "delete immediately" is simply a right click option to delete something without hauling it to the trash, or to delete a single item from the trash, without deleting everything in the trash at once.

El Capitan Os X article mentioned - OS X El Capitan: Delete files and folders  - explains that to securely delete a file, click "Finder", then "choose Finder > Secure Empty Trash."

So, where did "Secure Empty Trash" go, on some computers? "Secure Empty Trash" does not come up as an option for me, even after clicking "Finder Preferences >Advanced."

So, where did "Secure Empty Trash" go, on some computers? "Secure Empty Trash" does not come up as an option for me, even after clicking "Finder Preferences >Advanced."

See Sparkleberry's post above.

The help files weren't updated either because there wasn't time, or because Apple may try to bring it back in a way that makes it reliable.

However, since the best answer would be to encrypt the entire drive, I'm not sure I'd bother to bring it back.

hate to disagree here from from a privacy type person (who secure erases just about everything regardless what it is, so u may say overly cautious., the option to "delete immediately"  does NOT secure delete... It just empties the trash..

So u have basically two option ins El Captian that do the same thing, which is just dumb..

I know this because if u trash a 100MB or larger video file then open up trash, Right click, and choose "delete immediately" it just empiys the trash as it normally does.

if it wrote 0's over the file, as secure delete actually does do, then it would take its time..This is by the way goes against what Apple explains in their security document as to why they removed it.

About the security content of OS X El Capitan v10.11 - Apple Support

"

Finder

Available for: Mac OS X v10.6.8 and later

Impact: The "Secure Empty Trash" feature may not securely delete files placed in the Trash

Description: An issue existed in guaranteeing secure deletion of Trash files on some systems, such as those with flash storage. *This issue was addressed by removing the "Secure Empty Trash" option*."

That utter nonsense..

Apple is just covering up tracks for the reason of removing an option, and in order to fix something, u don't just remove it anyway, that's the quick way of saying "we can't fix it, so we'll just remove it to annoy users"

As a privacy and security type person being #1 for me, this may be an issue, but i'm open to using apps like CCleaner. Just further demonstrates, Apple removing stuff...  pushes app developers to get on board to include this as well as sell u a "pro" version. Hopefully the free version of CCleaner doe sthe job ok.

It is not really relevant anymore: many new computers have a SSD inside: the "secure empty trash" on a SSD did and does not work immediately, because of the way a SSD works. Now the same with "delete immediately": on a SSD it does not work immediately. As HDDs are being less and less used and SSDs more and more, there will eventually come a "new" secure delete approach, I am sure about that.

Was the option removed because TRIM handles garbage collection anyway ?

Noting has changed,, that's my point. we still used SSD back then, we do now..

I guess Apple just reliased that since TRIM handles this anyway, there is no point of secure deletion in the OS...

Despite this u can still use zerodisk from Terminal..... so Apple must still think it's relevant otherwise they would have also removes the Terminal command too. (u can still use diskutil zerodisk /dev/<disk_id) in recovery.

I do this all the time.

Trim has nothing to do with it.

Aside: you should not use trim, The Apple SSD controllers are different and can handle trim; non-apple SSDs can come in serious trouble when using Trim.

In the Linux kernel there are even several SSDs blacklisted and will not accept trim at all:

Micron M500*,  Crucial CT*M500*,  Micron M5(15)0*,  Crucial CT*M550*,  Crucial CT*MX100*,  Samsung SSD 8*.

Almost all modern SSDs have a very competent controller with very competent GarbageCollection, which means that Trim does not bring any advantage as long as the GarbageCollection has enough free space available.

Edit (it went too fast):

Trim is just a command in OS and does not do anything at all on the SSD, it will be used by the SSD controller when the controller supports trim.

Edit2: Apple does not want trim unless they are sure that it is handled well without timing issues. They do not give away what is special in their SSD controllers.

Lex

LexSchellings wrote:

As HDDs are being less and less used and SSDs more and more, there will eventually come a "new" secure delete approach, I am sure about that.

Don't be too sure how effective any "new" approaches will be, particularly for file level (as opposed to whole device) secure deletes. Scholarly papers like Reliably Erasing Data From Flash-Based Solid State Drives explain how difficult this would be. Among other things it would require a redesign of the controllers built into most SSDs & certification that specific SSDs meet the secure delete standards they would need to implement.

Or do a search on "ATA Secure Erase," the command added to the ATA command set to address this issue. You will discover that support for it in ATA/SATA storage devices is optional & worse, often doesn't work even when it is supported.

The short version is that it is a hardware level issue that can't be overcome by software. I assume that is why Apple removed the secure empty trash option. There is nothing they can do about that unless & until their suppliers can furnish SSDs that reliably support secure erases.

I agree, and I did not say "a better ..." only a "new".... I said this to stop speculation or finding "solutions".

And between the lines I suggested that it will be different, has to be different. It was never really secure on a SSD.

But mainly (here comes the "adware") I wanted to make my point (again) to avoid Trim.

Lex