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mwall614

Q: ORIGINAL POWERBOOK G3 WALLSTREET QUESTIONS

Hello all,

I purchased a powerbook G3 Wallstreet for 5 dollars off of ebay, yes thats right FIVE DOLLARS. It didn't come with a cd drive so I had to buy one for 10$ and I bought a stick a 128 stick of ram to bump me up to 160 MB and installed Jaguar on there...I use Firefox 2.0 to surf the web and to tell you guys the truth its really not that bad. It's like just "fast enough" to not be "unbearably slow", for the price I paid...I'm very happy with it. However I have a few questions...

1.Would adding more ram be sensible, would it recognize any more then 192MB and what kind of stick should I buy and how much more can I put in here? It is the model with NO L2 Cache, so will it really make a difference or not?
2.The monitor flickers and has "flickering lines" across it when I move the screen back and forth, just lightly touching it either makes it worse or better. I can find a good angle where it is fine, and its no big deal, but is this the display itself or the display cable?
3.What kind of EXTERNAL hard drive can I hook up to this thing, being as there is no USB port?
4.What is the best wireless card for this model with the best RANGE?

Powerbook G3 Wallstreet 233,IMac G3 233 Rev.A Bondi Blue, Mac OS X (10.2.x)

Posted on Mar 31, 2009 6:47 AM

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Q: ORIGINAL POWERBOOK G3 WALLSTREET QUESTIONS

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  • by a brody,

    a brody a brody Mar 31, 2009 7:19 AM in response to mwall614
    Level 9 (66,781 points)
    Classic Mac OS
    Mar 31, 2009 7:19 AM in response to mwall614
    Welcome to Apple Discussions!

    1.Would adding more ram be sensible, would it recognize any more then 192MB and what kind of stick should I buy and how much more can I put in here? It is the model with NO L2 Cache, so will it really make a difference or not?


    I've seen some successfully excede the 192MB maximum, but only with RAM that is exactly to spec and rated for that specific Mac model by the manufacturer of the RAM. 192MB is a good optimum though.

    2.The monitor flickers and has "flickering lines" across it when I move the screen back and forth, just lightly touching it either makes it worse or better. I can find a good angle where it is fine, and its no big deal, but is this the display itself or the display cable?


    This can be a power inverter issue. Since you are happy with the machine, it is probably going to cost you more than it is worth to fix it. VGA external displays can be added to them as well.

    3.What kind of EXTERNAL hard drive can I hook up to this thing, being as there is no USB port?


    SCSI. The mini-30 pin port in the back is designed to take a 29 pin SCSI to a 25 pin SCSI-2 cable. 30 pin SCSI adapters are used for SCSI Disk mode, rendering the Mac as an external SCSI drive to another Mac supporting SCSI. PCMCIA USB and Firewire adapters exist, but be sure if you buy one it is compatible with your Mac and operating system, and it has its own power. The power in the PCMCIA for the Mac is not enough to power an external hard drive, or iPod.

    4.What is the best wireless card for this model with the best RANGE?


    http://www.macwireless.com/ has several options.
  • by Hardy Geer,

    Hardy Geer Hardy Geer Mar 31, 2009 7:28 AM in response to a brody
    Level 4 (3,165 points)
    Mar 31, 2009 7:28 AM in response to a brody
    I have 512MB in my wallstreet with no problems.
  • by jpl,

    jpl jpl Mar 31, 2009 9:50 AM in response to mwall614
    Level 7 (28,285 points)
    Mar 31, 2009 9:50 AM in response to mwall614
    mwall,

    You can add up to 512MB (2x256) but I doubt it is worth the money. The 256s have special architecture for the early iMac, Wallstreet and Lombard, while the smaller sizes can be more generic. I would suggest this: Restart your Wallstreet to clear swap files and memory. Open your Activity Monitor in Utilities, select System Memory, and watch how your memory is being used. If you start getting 1000s of "Page Outs", more RAM may be helpful. The Page Outs are hits to Virtual Memory due to the lack of free RAM.
    http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/memory/iBooks-PowerBooks/G3-Lombard/

    If you have the cacheless 233MHz, you may also have the 12.1" dual-scan, passive matrix display. Apple quickly dropped this very poor display with version 2 of the Wallstreet. I believe the 233MHz cacheless could be BTO from Apple with the 13.3 or the 14.1. Apple also dropped the cacheless 233MHz since adding the 512K L2 cache provided a 50% boost to this poor CPU.

    Two points on the flickering display:

    -If moving the display causes and solves the issue, it is probably the display ribbon cable; the display cable connector may even be loose at the logic board.

    -If you have the 13.3" display, it has a known problem with the display cable connector in the display itself. Try gently squeezing the left vertical screen bezel (the black frame, with thumb on the front, four fingers on the back) half way up of the bezel, with the powerbook turned on. If you notice a change, this may be your problem. This issue only applies to the 13.3".

    The simplest, fastest way to back up data on the Wallstreet is to buy an inexpensive FireWire PC card for the PCMCIA/CardBus slot, then just connect a FireWire HD. Drivers are already included in OSX so it is just plug&play.

    Note: You cannot boot the Wallstreet through a FireWire/USB PC card; you can, however, boot through a SCSI drive.

    I will get back to you with info on the wireless card...
  • by jpl,

    jpl jpl Mar 31, 2009 10:13 AM in response to mwall614
    Level 7 (28,285 points)
    Mar 31, 2009 10:13 AM in response to mwall614
    mwall,

    I would think an 802.11b wireless PC card will offer all the speed your Wallstreet can handle. Below are some suggestions I made to another poster.

    1. If running any version of Jaguar, you can use a free, third-party driver that supports the 802.11b (11Mbps) wireless PC card that uses the Prism chipset. This website will give you all the details.
    http://wirelessdriver.sourceforge.net/

    2. If you would like the faster 802.11g (54Mbps) wireless card (and use Apple's AirPort software), you will have to update to 10.2.8, install AirPort 3.1.1, and then find an older (g) card that uses the Broadcom chip that is compatible with AirPort; most of the newer Broadcom chipset cards have had firmware updates and now require 10.3.x or newer. Here are some of the older cards:
    http://bcm-specs.sipsolutions.net/Chipsets

    3. Buy a universal driver that supports the slower 802.11b using the Prism chipset and requires a minimum 10.2.3.
    http://www.macsense.com/product/broadband/aerouni_b.html

    4. Here is a third-party driver that requires 10.2 and later and supports 802.11g PC cards using the Atheros chipset.
    http://www.orangeware.com/endusers/wirelessformac.html
  • by mwall614,

    mwall614 mwall614 Apr 1, 2009 3:08 AM in response to mwall614
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Apr 1, 2009 3:08 AM in response to mwall614
    Hello all and thanks for all the responses I got so quickly! I guess there are a lot of Powerbook G3 owners and hobbyist still out there. It really is not a bad computer for over 10 years old, which is ancient in computer age. It goes just about anywhere I want it to go on the web with firefox 2.0.. Anyway I have some more questions about this wonderful and cheap computer I came across. Money is really no problem here, I'm willing to spend a little on this computer to make it great again...I REALLY LOVE THE KEYBOARD!!!!!!!!!

    1. Yes I'm looking for the wireless card, not the fastest card, but the card with the most range? I don't know how I would be able to tell this?
    2.Can I upgrade the processor, buying a 233 WITH the L2 cache and pop it in there? Could I buy a 292 or 266 and pop it in there as well? There are lots of these cheap on ebay...
    3.Is there a hard drive that is both USB/SCSI adapter, meaning can I buy an external SCSI hard drive and then use a USB adapter to hook it to a USB outlet?
    4.The ram I installed is I believe "generic" but how do I tell the difference? What defines what will work and what won't? Is there some specification I should be looking for in particular?
  • by mwall614,

    mwall614 mwall614 Apr 1, 2009 3:11 AM in response to mwall614
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Apr 1, 2009 3:11 AM in response to mwall614
    Oh by the way it is the 14.1 inch screen, and to me it seems like something is "lose" because I can leave it on for hours and hours all day for days on end and it will be fine, but as soon as I go to move it, I get the "flickering lines" and "distortions" on my screen.
  • by jpl,

    jpl jpl Apr 1, 2009 9:58 AM in response to mwall614
    Level 7 (28,285 points)
    Apr 1, 2009 9:58 AM in response to mwall614
    mwall,

    Well, that 14.1" display is nice, the best of the bunch.

    I would have to do some research for your question on wireless PC card range; possibly someone else will have the answer.

    There are two items that will produce a noticeable increase in speed, those being the HD and CPU. If you still have the original 2-8GB HD, a new one is desirable. Obviously a faster CPU, especially with backside L2 cache, is also appealing.

    I would first make sure that someone did not install a cacheless 233MHz in a version 2 Wallstreet. Go to System Preferences > Displays and see if you have resolution switching...640x480, 800x600, and the native 1024x768. This is only available via a hardware component on the logic board. If so, you have a version 2 WS and are limited to the 233MHz/512K (or cacheless), 266MHz and 300MHz. If you have no resolution switching, any CPU will work...the 233s, 250, 266, 292 and 300MHz cards. I might be mistaken but also I believe the version 1 WS did not have an S-Video port on the back panel.

    The Wallstreet was also known for failing display hinges. A failing hinge or just plain wear may have damaged the display ribbon cable. If the cable connector is not loose on the logic board, then it is the cable and/or something in the display. If you were to remove the display (as one piece) and examine the ribbon cable where it passes through the hinge, you would have your answer. Disassembling the plastics on a 10 year old display without breakage to replace a ribbon cable will be iffy.

    These are the specs OWC lists for the correct memory:

    * PC100 SO-DIMM (jpl: original spec was PC66)
    * 2-2-2 CL2 rated refresh
    * 3.3 Volt
    * 144 Pin
    * 1" Low Profile - works in either the upper or the lower slot in all above listed Apple machines.

    As I mentioned earlier, the 256s must have the correct architecture for the Grackle memory controller since it can only address 128MB at a time. If you were to buy 256s off eBay, the 256s usually have 8 chips on each side of the memory card (see the OWC link) but I do not believe this guarantees you have the correct module. The incorrect 256 module will only read 128MB.

    Just a note on the Wallstreet and OSX: Apple never wrote a video accelerator (GPU) driver for this powerbook; as a result, scrolling is very slow and any video playback is affected.
  • by jpl,

    jpl jpl Apr 1, 2009 12:11 PM in response to mwall614
    Level 7 (28,285 points)
    Apr 1, 2009 12:11 PM in response to mwall614
    mwall,

    There is no SCSI-to-USB adapter. USB and FireWire HD enclosures use the older ATA/IDE (PATA) HDs or the newer Serial ATA (SATA) HDs used in the Intel Macs. The internal HD in a Wallstreet is ATA/IDE and the logic board also has the SCSI interface for external devices; USB and FireWire replaced the legacy SCSI. In order to boot to a SCSI HD, it must be directly connected to the SCSI port as 'a brody' described; SCSI HDs are old and expensive.

    Another way to boot the Wallstreet is via an expansion bay HD. These enclosures were made years ago but are still available new and used. MCE made an enclosure like the expansion bay floppy drive but you would install an ATA/IDE HD of your choice plus it was bootable. You would just quickly swap the optical drive for the HD. You can also use two main batteries at the same time, one in each bay.

    XPKIT:

    http://store.mcetech.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&ProductCode=XPKIT&CategoryCode=
  • by SpankyToo,

    SpankyToo SpankyToo May 31, 2009 1:03 PM in response to jpl
    Level 1 (0 points)
    May 31, 2009 1:03 PM in response to jpl
    I've checked out the resources and actually found a CISCO AIRONET card that says it's compatible with the driver from Orangware.

    Everytime I insert the card into the card slot I get a kernel panic. Any ideas?

    PB G3 Wallstreet 233 MHz, 384 MB RAM, 20 GB HDD, MAC OS X 10.2.8
  • by jpl,Solvedanswer

    jpl jpl May 31, 2009 4:24 PM in response to SpankyToo
    Level 7 (28,285 points)
    May 31, 2009 4:24 PM in response to SpankyToo
    SpankyToo,

    Users with third-party 'G' cards can have this problem and others. I have never had a kernel panic on my Wallstreet with my Buffalo card/AirPort/10.3.9 (XPostFacto). However, my card will not work if I insert it while the 'book is running (no KP) and will stall unless I insert it at just the right moment during startup. This 'moment' is just as the desktop appears. If you cannot insert the card at any point during startup or while running without a KP, I have no answer.

    Are you sure the card is good?

    Try a different compatible card with the OrangeWare.

    From the OrangeWare FAQ:

    "I have a PowerBook G3 and I am experiencing a variety of different problems with my CardBus card. I am running Mac OS X version 10.2.8 or under.
    Mac OS X 10.3 contains a ROM update for older CardBus controllers. Updating to this version (10.3) or later should solve the majority of these issues."

    If you want to stay at 10.2.8 and have no success with OrangeWare, download the freeware utility WirelessDriver and use the a recommended 802.11b PC card. Be sure to uninstall OrangeWare first.
    http://wirelessdriver.sourceforge.net/
  • by SpankyToo,

    SpankyToo SpankyToo Jun 3, 2009 5:55 PM in response to jpl
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Jun 3, 2009 5:55 PM in response to jpl
    I'll try the freeware utility WirelessDriver and use the a recommended 802.11b PC card.

    My Wallstreet G3 doesn't support the install of 10.3x or higher. No built in USB...

    Is there a workaround for that? I'm pretty savvy...
  • by jpl,

    jpl jpl Jun 4, 2009 11:40 AM in response to SpankyToo
    Level 7 (28,285 points)
    Jun 4, 2009 11:40 AM in response to SpankyToo
    SpankyToo,

    You can install both Panther/10.3 and Tiger/10.4 by using XPostFacto:
    http://eshop.macsales.com/OSXCenter/XPostFacto/Framework.cfm

    Be sure to read the above thoroughly. I would use Panther since it came on CDs. Tiger came on DVDs and this will require removing the HD from the Wallstreet to install Tiger; if you need to reinstall Tiger for some reason, same procedure is required.

    There are a few caveats on the Wallstreet:

    -XPostFacto becomes your Startup Disk controller between 9.x and 10.x; using Apple's controllers will freeze the 'book.

    -I like starting the install with a fresh partition. Put 9.x on the second, larger partition, boot to 9.x, erase the OSX partition, then launch XPostFacto and follow its instructions.

    -After Panther is installed, drag-copy the 9.x System Folder from the larger partition to the OSX partition. The Wallstreet seems to have fewer startup issues by having the 9.x System Folder with OSX.

    -If you don't have 9.x, you can use your current 10.2.8 install to run XPostFacto and install Panther.

    I will say this: If you are happy with Jaguar and satisfied with the performance of an 802.11b wireless card using the WirelessDriver, you may not want to bother with this unless you have a some time to get this up and running and still possibly be disappointed with how the 'book runs.