font book won't show thai?

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Level 1

65 points

font book won't show thai?

hello,

i'm just starting a book project, my first in thai! no, don't read it... but cutting and pasting and designing... which means choosing a nice thai font. however, font book seems to fight me on that one. is it really true that it won't show thai?

if i choose a custom preview, and paste in thai encoded text, it just shows odd placeholder boxes for each character (if i zoom in the preview, i can see strange code in the surrounding box - DE00 DE7F).

am i doing something wrong? is there a way to preview thai encoded fonts in font book? japanese works quite well, so surprised. thanks!

macs, Mac OS X (10.4.9)

Posted on Jun 22, 2007 1:30 AM

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Answer 1

Jun 22, 2007 3:06 AM in response to pauls73

no, the font book will show Thai and right now I am looking at Ayuthaya in all its glory (so to speak). Do you have the additional Asian fonts installed?

You need to use the installer disk (the one that came with your machine) and run the Language Translations installers found in the OptionalInstalls.mpkg of the DVD. That give you about 5 fonts if I have it right.

For more information about this, you might try Tom Gewecke's site. I bow to his expertise on languages/fonts.

As an additional note, once you have these installed, you should not need to use Font book when typing in Apple applications, for example Text Edit. Just use Command + T and that will give you all the fonts (and more).

Message was edited by: Graham K. Rogers

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Answer 2

Tom Gewecke

Level 10

122,164 points

Jun 22, 2007 3:28 AM in response to pauls73

OS X comes with full support for Unicode Thai, including keyboard layouts and a number of fonts (Lucida Grande, Ayuthaya, Silom, Krungthep, Thonburi). You should be able to preview any of those in Fontbook. In character palette, use View = Code Tables, Tab = Unicode, range 00000E00. You can also preview fonts there in the Font Variation pane. Do you have those fonts on your font list?

If you are trying to use old non-Unicode fonts or Windows fonts you have added to the system, you will likely have problems with correct display. What apps are you using as source and destination of your text? (Some apps like Appleworks and Word X cannot be used for Thai). Is the source Unicode? If not, you may need to recode it.

Feel free to email me details or sample text if you want (tom at bluesky dot org).

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Answer 3

Tom Gewecke

Level 10

122,164 points

Jun 22, 2007 2:33 PM in response to pauls73

no, don't read it...

PS I forgot to mention, if you don't know the Thai script, then you should have a native speaker review your final product, because it is easy to produce errors in a) diacritic placement and b) linebreaking which could seriously damage it quality.

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Answer 4

pauls73 Author

Level 1

65 points

Jun 22, 2007 11:30 PM in response to Tom Gewecke

yes, i think they are NOT newer unicode fonts - the ones i was trying. i found a free site of some newer thai fonts (looked like some design student work) - and they DID show properly. as the apple ones, of course.

the source text seems to be unicode. the writer is sending me word files which i open in textedit. the type shows up fine that way, then i cut and paste it into indesign. seems to work okay. thanks for the pointers! and, thanks for the offer for help. at some point in this project, i certainly might need it! i think this might be more complicated then i initially thought (thinking cut and paste and go). cheers!

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Answer 5

pauls73 Author

Level 1

65 points

Jun 22, 2007 11:32 PM in response to Tom Gewecke

yes, i'm just now discovering this from reading about thai input around the web. unfortunately i have to work remotely with anyone thai. this might make things quite difficult. i have recently heard mentioned that there is supposed to be some thai-input plugin for indesign that helps with this? but, i've found basically no info on it except for a mention on this adobe forum thread:

http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx?14@@.3bc1b02d/21

i'm hoping CS3 has some new magic that might help in this. otherwise, i think i'll be harassing a thai designer friend of mine to fix all my type for me! not fun 😟

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Answer 6

Tom Gewecke

Level 10

122,164 points

Jun 23, 2007 3:30 AM in response to pauls73

i have recently heard
mentioned that there is supposed to be some
thai-input plugin for indesign that helps with this?
but, i've found basically no info on it except for a
mention on this adobe forum thread:

http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx?14@@.3bc1b02d/
21

Yes, that's the only info I have as well. You might try asking in that forum yourself or checking here:

http://www.thaiadobeuser.com

I don't think CS3 does Thai linebreaking on Mac, only Apple apps can do it.

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Answer 7

Jun 23, 2007 9:37 AM in response to Tom Gewecke

That plugin (which requires a hardware dongle I believe) comes from Maccenter here and there is a link on that Adobe page. I find that, instead of working in Word (I don't use MS stuff anyway), text from a PC can be opened in TextEdit (it uses RTF) and the same in reverse: type in TextEdit and save as a .doc file.

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Answer 8

pauls73 Author

Level 1

65 points

Jun 24, 2007 8:53 AM in response to Tom Gewecke

hmmm... all apple apps do this? does that mean if i open the word docs in text edit, the line breaking will be correct? i'm thinking if that is so, then i can change the document's margins to fit my layout's columns, then maybe i can put soft returns where textedit is breaking the text (i assume, properly). then, maybe i CAN copy and paste this from textedit? would this work?

btw, i sent a test layout to the writer and she confirmed that the lines breaks were chopping words up incorrectly. her first offer was to get indesign and do it for me. hmm... maybe the fastest alternative, but quite the burden for the writer to have to do. plus, then, i can do the usual designer text tweaking, manual ragging, etc. that good obsessive compulsive designers excel at.

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Answer 9

Tom Gewecke

Level 10

122,164 points

Jun 24, 2007 10:00 AM in response to pauls73

then, maybe i CAN copy and paste this from textedit?

would this work?

I think the only way to know for sure would be to test it.

her first offer was to get indesign
and do it for me.

That would be my advice, as it should guarantee it is correct. How good the Apple Thai linebreaking dictionary is I have no idea.

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Answer 10

pauls73 Author

Level 1

65 points

Jun 26, 2007 10:55 PM in response to Tom Gewecke

hello,

just an FYI - if you're desperate to input thai in indesign, AND don't have the thai support plugin - you CAN use apple apps as i described above. again:

i just opened the text in text edit, then, made the columns match the size of the ones i made in indesign. then, i hit returns at each line. cut and pasted into indesign - and my thai writer says everything reads fine now.

of course, only downside (and that's what i'm hitting), is if i want to wrap text around images and such, this no longer works. also, fyi, here is the thai support plugin: http://www.maccenter.co.th/TSP.html - NOTE: to work, it requires a hardware dongle that costs around $150 or so, that's generally only available in thailand.

i REALLY wish there was a way to access the apple thai dictionary from every app. then, all problems would be solved. thanks all!

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Answer 11

Tom Gewecke

Level 10

122,164 points

Jun 27, 2007 3:22 AM in response to pauls73

i REALLY wish there was a way to access the apple
thai dictionary from every app. then, all problems
would be solved. thanks all!

That's good news you were able to use that workaround!

Best tell Adobe what you think. They are the ones charging $700 for a product with no Thai linebreaking, no Devanagari, and no Arabic -- all provided free by Apple in TextEdit. They are the ones who need to solve the problem.

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