Apples refusal to return old hard drive under warranty

Question

Apples refusal to return old hard drive under warranty

Our macbooks hard drive recently failed and has to be replaced by apple under the warranty. We wanted to retain the old drive, (sensitive data) so that we could retrieve any data ourselves at some future date (assuming it was possible). Apple have refused to return our hard drive,saying they have to send it back to apple for checking why it had failed.

Having been through this before with an iBook; we know that apple did not advise us of what their finding are, as they have never come back to us with any report etc.

We assume that the hard drive is our property and that legally we should get it back. How can apple insist that they will keep the drive, against our wishes?

Has anyone any knowledge or experience in this matter?

Apple have said that they will not replace the drive under the warranty, unless they they keep the faulty drive.

Please could someone out there help!!!???

Thank you

imac G4 Mac OS X (10.4.9) Netgear ADSL wireless modem

imac G4 and Macbook Mac OS X (10.4.9) Netgear ADSL wireless modem

imac G4, Mac OS X (10.4.9), Netgear ADSL wireless modem

Posted on Jul 18, 2007 9:40 AM

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Answer 1

varjak paw

Level 10

182,668 points

Jul 18, 2007 9:57 AM in response to Desmond Ezekiel

We assume that the hard drive is our property and that legally we should get it back.

That is an incorrect assumption. Any parts replaced under warranty become the property of Apple (as is the case with every computer vendor I've ever worked with). They probably have to send it back to the drive manufacturer for Apple to get credit for the replacement. The only way you would have gotten to keep the old drive would have been for you to purchase a new drive.

Sorry, but this is the way warranty repairs work, and as I said, it's true for every computer vendor I've ever worked with. So there's nothing anyone here (and we're just your fellow users anyway) can do to help you. If you want the drive back (presuming they still have it), you'll have to pay for the repair.

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Answer 2

Jul 18, 2007 9:59 AM in response to varjak paw

in future..sorry to say this sounds a bit..well you no. but simply back up the harddrive and erase the disk..tahst what they advised me

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Answer 3

First Magus

Level 7

21,299 points

Jul 18, 2007 10:02 AM in response to Desmond Ezekiel

Why would you think apple should replace your drive and then let you keep the old one. They also can get credit for the drive by turning around and sending it into the manufacturer.

Once they have replaced your drive their obligation to you as far as the old drive is ended. What good would it do for them to contact you and say part so and so was bad.

If you bought a new TV and it failed would you expect the company to replace it and then say go ahead and keep the old one?

If the data is that important just keep the old one and replace it yourself. Hard drives are not that expensive and it is an easy do it yourself project.

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Answer 4

Jul 18, 2007 10:07 AM in response to Desmond Ezekiel

We assume that the hard drive is our property and
that legally we should get it back. How can apple
insist that they will keep the drive, against our
wishes?

From the Apple warranty:
"When a product or part is exchanged, any replacement item becomes your property and the replaced item becomes Apple’s property."

You may not like it, but that's what it says.

In most cases, it's not a problem. In the case of a storage device, I can see the problem. If you're sensitive about giving away your data, accept responsibility for the drive. They're cheap these days.

MacBook 2.0GhzCore2Duo, 2.Gig, 160G HD, PowerBook G4 1.5Ghz 15" Mac OS X (10.4.10) Logic Pro 7.2.3, Focusrite Saffire...

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Answer 5

a j

Level 3

555 points

Jul 18, 2007 10:21 AM in response to tele_player

Desmond's issue with Apple isn't so much about the physical drive - exchaning the faulty one for a new one - but retrieving the data on the old one.

It seems that most people learn about the wisdom of backing up after the event ... so I guess there is a moral in this tale. Always back up.

Desmond, all you can do at this stage is to contact Apple and ask whether it is possible to retrieve the data on your old drive.

Unfortunately, the hardware is under warranty and not the data.

Data recovery can be an expensive and time consuming procedure, so I don't think it's very likely that Apple would do that for you, assuming that they can locate your old hard drive at this stage.

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Answer 6

First Magus

Level 7

21,299 points

Jul 18, 2007 10:54 AM in response to a j

Good points A J

Unfortunately, the hardware is under warranty and not
the data.

Data recovery can be an expensive and time consuming
procedure, so I don't think it's very likely that
Apple would do that for you, assuming that they can
locate your old hard drive at this stage.

Also from the Apple Warranty for the OP

If your product is capable of storing data or software programs, you should make periodic backup copies of the data and programs contained on the product’s hard drive or other storage media to protect your data and as a precaution against possible operational failures. Before you deliver your product for warranty service it is your responsibility to keep a separate backup copy of the system software, application software and data, and disable any security passwords. You will be responsible for reinstalling all such software, data and passwords. Apple and its Authorized Service Providers are not liable for any damage to or loss of any programs, data, or other information stored on any media, or any non-Apple product or part not covered by this warranty. Recovery and reinstallation of system and application software and user data are not covered under this Limited Warranty.

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Answer 7

Jul 18, 2007 12:18 PM in response to varjak paw

Dave

Thanks for such a prompt reply. What you say makes sense and is logical.

However, you say that if I paid for a new drive, I could have the old drive back. This is not the case with Apple in London. When the hard drive on our iBook went some months back, it was replaced by Apple and we paid for it outside any warranty; but inspite of arguing with Apple, they refused to hand it back.

Again thanks very much. In fact thanks to all those who have responded.

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Answer 8

JoeyR

Level 6

8,305 points

Jul 18, 2007 12:27 PM in response to Desmond Ezekiel

It's also likely that they couldn't get you the drive back if they wanted to. As mentioned, they typically return failed drives back to the manufacturer for credit. Drives are not considered to be repairable... so they don't usually go through the trouble of tracking what drive came from who after they remove it. Chances are it just ended up in a batch of hundreds of drives that went back to the manufacturer.

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Answer 9

varjak paw

Level 10

182,668 points

Jul 18, 2007 1:06 PM in response to Desmond Ezekiel

If you bought a drive, then Apple should have given you the old drive back. I don't know in the UK, but in the US, our laws would have required it. With a MacBook, though, since the drive is user-replaceable, you could have just purchased a drive aftermarket and replaced it yourself and avoided the entire issue.

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Answer 10

JoeyR

Level 6

8,305 points

Jul 18, 2007 1:16 PM in response to varjak paw

As Dave mentioned... with your iBook... if you purchased your replacement drive... you would have a little more ground to stand on with regards to getting your old drive back.... a drive replaced under warranty clearly belongs to Apple per their policy however. In either case, I don't believe Apple would be responsible for the data on the drive that you sent in. For example, their first step in the repair may have been to wipe the drive... so even if they returned it, it may no longer have your data on it. I'm not aware of any computer manufacturer that guarantees anything more than a fresh installation of an OS and originally installed software. Anything else that may be on your drive when you send it in may be lost.

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Answer 11

Jul 20, 2007 3:27 AM in response to JoeyR

Thanks to all of you for the responses and advice. Unfortunately I am not that technical that I would try to replace a drive myself. Our funds are quite low and we would not want to risk damaging the laptop etc.

Can anyone suggest a source (link) of advice on setting up a backup. People at the genius bar at apple are suggesting I should have 2 drives as back up and if that is the best way forward, how do I set this up? It sounds complicated to me. Also any advice on the type and best quality drives to buy?I am looking in the various threads to see if this is being discussed anywhere.

I have just started following another thread (90 replies so far), which is discussing why so many macbook drives are failing, which is quite revealing. I did not realise that when the book is put to sleep, one should not move it until the white light is pulsing. I thought that laptops could be moved, as they are a portable device.

Thanks to all again.

imac G4 Mac OS X (10.4.9) Netgear ADSL wireless modem

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Answer 12

First Magus

Level 7

21,299 points

Jul 20, 2007 4:38 AM in response to Desmond Ezekiel

Check this document out. Mac OSX: How to back up and restore files. I use SuperDuper to do my backup with. I would suggest a good firewire/usb drive. There are lots of good brands. I use a Western Digital 250 GB USB drive that works well for me. I do a complete clone of my system so I can boot from it if needed to restore my main drive. I have a separate partition for the back up so that I can use the rest of the disk for storage of iTunes and documents.

I think two drives are overkill but it's not that bad an idea.

I take a lot of the threads on here with a grain of salt. The thread about hard drive failure is one. Think of it this way 90 posts about bad hard drives out of how many millions sold. Of course if your hard drive fails it doesn't matter your miffed. I think that the reason they recommend you to not move it when it is first going to sleep is that the hard drive heads are parking so it's best not to disturb them. I could be wrong on that but make sense to me.

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Answer 13

JoeyR

Level 6

8,305 points

Jul 20, 2007 5:40 AM in response to First Magus

Also... all Apple notebooks since the iBook G4 back in 2005 have sudden motion sensors in their drives which lock the drives if they're moved... specifically to prevent damage during movement. You can actually run a little app called SeisMac which will show a real time graph for all three axis' of the sensor... if you just tap your notebook, you'll see how sensitive the sensors are:

http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/30302&vid=388845

Here's more from Apple on the sudden motion sensor:

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=300781

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Answer 14

Jul 20, 2007 6:25 AM in response to Desmond Ezekiel

When you close the notebook and the screen shuts off, the computer starts to go to sleep but it is not immediate.
Before powering down it writes the contents of memory to disk so that if the battery dies before you plug it in again, you won't lose everything - since a small amount of power is needed during sleep to maintain the data in RAM.
If you've ever had your computer sleeping for a long time you may have noticed that when you go to turn it on again, it shows a progress bar at the bottom of the screen as it reads the RAM image off of the hard disk.

The problem is - as others have noted - once you start moving the MacBook, the motion sensor may kick in to protect the drive, but if you haven't given it a chance to finish writing the memory image - wait until the light is pulsing - the computer can't complete the going to sleep process. Once it's pulsing, its fine, move it all you want.

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Answer 15

Jul 21, 2007 9:22 AM in response to Mike-N-nahyunil

Thanks for the advice.This was very helpful!

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