EXS in L8 versus L7: no more 3.5 GB RAM limit (with screen grabs)
okay
i’ve done some testing of EXS in Logic 7.1.1 and Logic 8. while all of this testing originated in the “is logic 64 bit” thread, i’ve started a new thread to post these results since, honestly, i really have no idea where to post in that old thread anymore. suffice it to say that Orren and Rohan are absolutely correct -- if we use Virtual Memory in EXS in Logic 8, we are no longer limited by Logic's 3.5 GB RAM limit for EXS and we can now use all of the RAM in our computers with EXS and Logic.
a couple of notes:
1. all songs were created and/or opened on a fresh system directly after a reboot. i never reopened a song or switched songs without a reboot in between. and all testing was done on my dual G5 with 8 GB of RAM, OS 10.4.10, Logic 7.1.1 or Logic 8.
2. i never had any programs other than Logic, Activity Monitor, and Grab open.
3. all testing was done with the EXS Virtual Memory option Active and set to “disk drive speed: slow” and “disk recording activity: extensive”. one of the confusing things in reporting this testing has always been that both EXS and Activity Monitor have a thing called “Virtual Memory” and they are not the same thing. i use Activity Monitor VM as my “how much RAM is this program using” reference because it is the one consistent figure i can find: when Logic hits 3.55 GB of Virtual Memory space in Activity Monitor, it crashes. but Activity Monitor’s Virtual Memory figure is a completely separate thing from the EXS Virtual Memory option. so from here on, when i refer to VM, it is the figure as reported by Activity Monitor. please know that the EXS VM option was active for all testing reported here.
so i started by creating a song in Logic 7 and i added EXS instruments (and ONLY EXS instruments) to the song until i was about to hit the 3.5 GB Virtual Memory limit. as you can see in this screengrab...
...once i had loaded 18 EXS Vienna Symphonic Library instruments, Logic’s Memory figures in Activity Monitor were:
Logic Pro 7.1.1
Real Memory: 3.08 GB
Shared Memory: 47.4 MB
Virtual Memory: 3.42 GB
the system was using 4.15 GB of RAM, leaving 3.85 GB of RAM free. when i tried to load a 19th EXS VSL instrument, the program crashed.
so i then rebooted and opened this same song in Logic 8. as you can see in the screengrab, the memory figures as reported for Logic 8 are very different:
Logic Pro 8
Real Memory: 1.94 GB
Shared Memory: 562 MB
Virtual Memory 2.45 GB
Logic’s Real and Virtual memory figures are much smaller, but the Shared memory figure is much larger. also, the system is using almost the exact same amount of RAM: 4.13 GB (leaving 3.87 Free).
i then proceeded to add EXS instruments (and ONLY EXS instruments) to this song (it has a new name because i didn’t want to save over the original song) until the System RAM was almost all used. as you can see in the following screengrab, the song now has 32 EXS VSL instruments loaded and the system is using 7.68 GB of RAM.
what’s interesting is that despite all of the added EXS instruments, Logic’s memory figures have seen little change. they are:
Real Memory: 2.12 GB
Shared Memory: 571 MB
Virtual Memory: 2.62 GB
and while Activity Monitor isn’t showing a process that is responsible for storing the EXS samples, all 14 of the new EXS instruments are playable (as are the original 18).
so clearly what Rohan and Orren reported about EXS in Logic 8 is true -- we can now load/stream more instruments in EXS in Logic 8.
to test further, i removed a couple of instruments from this song so that i wouldn’t be running quite to the edge of my system RAM, saved it, rebooted and reopened the song. as you can see in this screengrab...
there are now 28 EXS instruments open and Logic’s memory figures are reported as:
Real Memory: 2.07 GB
Shared Memory: 562 MB
Virtual Memory: 2.52 GB
The system is using 6.75 GB of RAM, leaving 1.25 GB free.
so then i added 7 Altiverb plug ins to 7 channels in Logic 8 (different settings for each altiverb instance so they were each using their own RAM).
as you can see, not only has the System used more RAM, but Logic’s memory figures have increased as well because Altiverb is loaded into Logic’s RAM. Logic’s RAM figures now are:
Real Memory: 2.63 GB
Shared Memory: 582 MB
Virtual Memory: 3.15 GB
so i then proceeded to add two more EXS instruments to this song and you can see that the System is now using a lot more RAM (around 750 MB more RAM) but Logic’s memory figures have remained almost the same:
Real Memory: 2.65 GB
Shared Memory: 587 MB
Virtual Memory: 3.16 GB
and, of course, all 30 EXS instruments are playable. how well they will perform in real world use remains to be seen. but they all work.
finally, as near as i can tell, Logic 8 doesn’t let EXS have its own memory space until Logic hits around 1.75 GB of Virtual Memory (as reported in Activity Monitor). before that point, it appears to me that Logic keeps EXS “inside” the Logic memory space. the “real” and “virtual” memory figures for Logic continue to rise as EXS instruments are added and the “shared” memory figure for Logic stays at around 40 MB.
but after 1.75 GB of VM, the “shared” figure starts to rise with each instrument until Logic hits around 2.4 GB of VM, at which point, all EXS appear to be loaded into non-Logic RAM because the “used” System RAM increased but all Logic figures remain almost the same. (i’m sorry if describing this is confusing -- i’m doing the best i can)
anyway, i apologize for the long post, but i wanted to clarify as best i could what the state of EXS is on Logic 8 for anyone still curious.
while i certainly make no claim to know how or why this is happening, i can say that on my system, what Rohan and Orren have reported is correct: EXS in Logic 8 is no longer limited to Logic’s 3.5 GB RAM limit so long as you have the EXS Virtual Memory option active (if it isn’t active, the old RAM limit remains).
thanks to all who helped get to the bottom of this. i hope this post is helpful in demonstrating what EXS can now do in Logic 8. if not, well, i tried. 😉
cheers
i’ve done some testing of EXS in Logic 7.1.1 and Logic 8. while all of this testing originated in the “is logic 64 bit” thread, i’ve started a new thread to post these results since, honestly, i really have no idea where to post in that old thread anymore. suffice it to say that Orren and Rohan are absolutely correct -- if we use Virtual Memory in EXS in Logic 8, we are no longer limited by Logic's 3.5 GB RAM limit for EXS and we can now use all of the RAM in our computers with EXS and Logic.
a couple of notes:
1. all songs were created and/or opened on a fresh system directly after a reboot. i never reopened a song or switched songs without a reboot in between. and all testing was done on my dual G5 with 8 GB of RAM, OS 10.4.10, Logic 7.1.1 or Logic 8.
2. i never had any programs other than Logic, Activity Monitor, and Grab open.
3. all testing was done with the EXS Virtual Memory option Active and set to “disk drive speed: slow” and “disk recording activity: extensive”. one of the confusing things in reporting this testing has always been that both EXS and Activity Monitor have a thing called “Virtual Memory” and they are not the same thing. i use Activity Monitor VM as my “how much RAM is this program using” reference because it is the one consistent figure i can find: when Logic hits 3.55 GB of Virtual Memory space in Activity Monitor, it crashes. but Activity Monitor’s Virtual Memory figure is a completely separate thing from the EXS Virtual Memory option. so from here on, when i refer to VM, it is the figure as reported by Activity Monitor. please know that the EXS VM option was active for all testing reported here.
so i started by creating a song in Logic 7 and i added EXS instruments (and ONLY EXS instruments) to the song until i was about to hit the 3.5 GB Virtual Memory limit. as you can see in this screengrab...
...once i had loaded 18 EXS Vienna Symphonic Library instruments, Logic’s Memory figures in Activity Monitor were:
Logic Pro 7.1.1
Real Memory: 3.08 GB
Shared Memory: 47.4 MB
Virtual Memory: 3.42 GB
the system was using 4.15 GB of RAM, leaving 3.85 GB of RAM free. when i tried to load a 19th EXS VSL instrument, the program crashed.
so i then rebooted and opened this same song in Logic 8. as you can see in the screengrab, the memory figures as reported for Logic 8 are very different:
Logic Pro 8
Real Memory: 1.94 GB
Shared Memory: 562 MB
Virtual Memory 2.45 GB
Logic’s Real and Virtual memory figures are much smaller, but the Shared memory figure is much larger. also, the system is using almost the exact same amount of RAM: 4.13 GB (leaving 3.87 Free).
i then proceeded to add EXS instruments (and ONLY EXS instruments) to this song (it has a new name because i didn’t want to save over the original song) until the System RAM was almost all used. as you can see in the following screengrab, the song now has 32 EXS VSL instruments loaded and the system is using 7.68 GB of RAM.
what’s interesting is that despite all of the added EXS instruments, Logic’s memory figures have seen little change. they are:
Real Memory: 2.12 GB
Shared Memory: 571 MB
Virtual Memory: 2.62 GB
and while Activity Monitor isn’t showing a process that is responsible for storing the EXS samples, all 14 of the new EXS instruments are playable (as are the original 18).
so clearly what Rohan and Orren reported about EXS in Logic 8 is true -- we can now load/stream more instruments in EXS in Logic 8.
to test further, i removed a couple of instruments from this song so that i wouldn’t be running quite to the edge of my system RAM, saved it, rebooted and reopened the song. as you can see in this screengrab...
there are now 28 EXS instruments open and Logic’s memory figures are reported as:
Real Memory: 2.07 GB
Shared Memory: 562 MB
Virtual Memory: 2.52 GB
The system is using 6.75 GB of RAM, leaving 1.25 GB free.
so then i added 7 Altiverb plug ins to 7 channels in Logic 8 (different settings for each altiverb instance so they were each using their own RAM).
as you can see, not only has the System used more RAM, but Logic’s memory figures have increased as well because Altiverb is loaded into Logic’s RAM. Logic’s RAM figures now are:
Real Memory: 2.63 GB
Shared Memory: 582 MB
Virtual Memory: 3.15 GB
so i then proceeded to add two more EXS instruments to this song and you can see that the System is now using a lot more RAM (around 750 MB more RAM) but Logic’s memory figures have remained almost the same:
Real Memory: 2.65 GB
Shared Memory: 587 MB
Virtual Memory: 3.16 GB
and, of course, all 30 EXS instruments are playable. how well they will perform in real world use remains to be seen. but they all work.
finally, as near as i can tell, Logic 8 doesn’t let EXS have its own memory space until Logic hits around 1.75 GB of Virtual Memory (as reported in Activity Monitor). before that point, it appears to me that Logic keeps EXS “inside” the Logic memory space. the “real” and “virtual” memory figures for Logic continue to rise as EXS instruments are added and the “shared” memory figure for Logic stays at around 40 MB.
but after 1.75 GB of VM, the “shared” figure starts to rise with each instrument until Logic hits around 2.4 GB of VM, at which point, all EXS appear to be loaded into non-Logic RAM because the “used” System RAM increased but all Logic figures remain almost the same. (i’m sorry if describing this is confusing -- i’m doing the best i can)
anyway, i apologize for the long post, but i wanted to clarify as best i could what the state of EXS is on Logic 8 for anyone still curious.
while i certainly make no claim to know how or why this is happening, i can say that on my system, what Rohan and Orren have reported is correct: EXS in Logic 8 is no longer limited to Logic’s 3.5 GB RAM limit so long as you have the EXS Virtual Memory option active (if it isn’t active, the old RAM limit remains).
thanks to all who helped get to the bottom of this. i hope this post is helpful in demonstrating what EXS can now do in Logic 8. if not, well, i tried. 😉
cheers
