Timestretching In Logic

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Level 1

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Timestretching In Logic

Just wondered if anyone here has got any advice for using logic's built in time stretch function?

So far my opinion of it has been less then impressive. It adds a lot of vibrato to certain parts...in particular held notes, high notes and choruses.

I've had limited success of calming this by using the autotuner, and a very short reversed reverb to try and smear the noise out... but I'm still not happy with how it sounds compared to my old standalone Serato Pitch & Time software on the pc. I've compared a logic stretch to a serato stretch and it's easy to spot them apart..

Macbook 2.2, Mac OS X (10.5.1)

Posted on Feb 17, 2008 5:49 PM

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Answer 1

amplayer

Level 1

40 points

Feb 17, 2008 6:26 PM in response to EdwardRyan

I haven't used it that much, but when I have, I think the results have been more than acceptable. Have you tried changing the algorithm it uses?

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Answer 2

noeqplease

Level 4

3,589 points

Feb 18, 2008 12:54 AM in response to EdwardRyan

Hi,

I try not to use it, but when I do, I try not to go too far up or down in pitch, say 10%. And I do test with all the different algorhythms, until I find the one that works best with the material to be messed with.

Cheers

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Answer 3

EdwardRyan Author

Level 1

0 points

Feb 18, 2008 2:37 AM in response to EdwardRyan

Ok. maybe I should elaborate more.

I'm doing some house mixes of R&B tracks, and I'm trying to stretch the vocals to to the right tempo. There's one in particular that bugs me. I want to go from 88 to 125 bpm...or just over a 44% compression.

Now In serato this crazy ask would come out fine, but in logic the resultant audio has so many wobbles that it makes it sound terrible. The tuning stops some of this, and the reverb helps cover it up...but I can still hear it pretty bad on some parts...

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Answer 4

Feb 18, 2008 2:54 AM in response to EdwardRyan

Hi Edward,
I think stretching over 40 % is too much to be good enough, I use it between 5% to 15% and it is very good. I woder if it is possible to stretch so much with no wobbles.
In my opinion, may try go from 125 to 100.

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Answer 5

samplaire

Level 2

184 points

Feb 18, 2008 3:20 AM in response to EdwardRyan

Stretching or pitchshifting more than 10% is not advisable at all. It makes everything not natural no matter what algorythm or plugin you use. Perhaps the logic feature isn't that perfect (though in my experience it is good) but the serato plugin you mention adds an mp3-like-effect to the sound which is also a sound quality degradation. In the percentage range you mention you can make some nice artificial effect but forget about naturality. If you want you can try the Digidesign X-form plugin (http://store.digidesign.com/be/index.cfm?page=product_detail&partnumber=9910-554 50-00&categoryid=109) but it works only with ProTools software I belive. And it costs much, though you can hire it for 2 days for a small amount of money.

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Answer 6

noeqplease

Level 4

3,589 points

Feb 18, 2008 8:47 AM in response to EdwardRyan

Wow, that's a huge stretch, for any plug in.

You can try doing it in small increments, and see if this gives better results.

Cheers

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Answer 7

Feb 18, 2008 9:02 AM in response to EdwardRyan

I've also had some recently unpleasant discoveries re:stretching in Logic. Try using an apple loop more than 10% out of its range and you'll notice the same tremolo effect, and if you're lucky it will add it's own delay feature to the loop. Quite annoying.

I'm in the same boat as you, doing R&B remixes, not house. You might really enjoy melodyne. It's very good for vocals, as long as they don't have backing vocals mixed in.

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Answer 8

Feb 18, 2008 12:24 PM in response to EdwardRyan

and yet, amazing slow downer, serato and Pro Tools 7.4 do a better job than Logic. That's your simple answer, Logic just doesn't have the best algorithms for this. Not sure what to suggest, other than using these instead.

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Answer 9

samplaire

Level 2

184 points

Feb 18, 2008 3:58 PM in response to scot_stafford

... and remember, 10%. Sooner or later you will hear the difference. Max of 10% is the rule. This is not a parent advise. This is practise. No matter your will is strong. 10% tells you the future. 10% is god.

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Answer 10

EdwardRyan Author

Level 1

0 points

Feb 18, 2008 6:05 PM in response to Logic 8 on Mac Intel

Please, call me Ed 🙂

It is not possible to time-stretch without any artefacts such as vibrato appearing. Time & Pitch are linked to sample length. When you shorten a sample you reduce the time between the sample points, and by doing this the pitch has to increase to match. You hear this as a change of frequency.

When you 'pitch correct' a sample you are breaking the natural relationship between these three factors. Good processing routines and certain flaws of the human ear mean that we can go so far without it being detected. I understand that.

What I don't understand is why the routine in Logic 8 sounds so poor compared to older software. Coming from an old Pc with Serato P&T I expected Logic to be better at time and pitch functions. I'm also amazed that it doesn't seem to do audio warping unless you convert the file to an apple loop. The apple loop utility doesn't derive the bpm or anything...it is annoying !

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Answer 11

qroniq

Level 1

0 points

Feb 19, 2008 3:07 AM in response to EdwardRyan

Hi all,

Has anyone had any success using Izotope's "Radius" plug-in for Logic?
http://izotope.com/products/audio/radius/

Features sound great... but what is it like in "real-life"?

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Answer 12

David_Pye

Level 4

2,325 points

Feb 19, 2008 3:48 AM in response to EdwardRyan

Ed, have you tried the other options for compression algorithms? I find the Monophonic setting works really well for vocals. But don't forget to check out the complex and version 5 settings too.

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Answer 13

Feb 19, 2008 4:40 PM in response to David_Pye

Thats a big old time stretch 88 to 125 you will never get that in Logic without some artifacts in there

i never use logic to stretch that much if i really need to speed something up i usually use Ableton & rewire it into Logic but i have never gone from 88 to 125 i think the biggest i have tried is 90 to 105 & that sounded grainy & nasty

Maybe some use of eq's & effects could make it sound better

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