Unreliable Aliases

This has been happening for ages but I usually just fix it. Now it's starting to get on my nerves:

I create an alias of something; a folder, an application, a file, a file on a networked Mac . . . whatever. All is well for a while and then, maybe a few days or weeks later, I use the alias and it's 'connected' to something quite different.

Am I alone? Is there a fix? Perhaps I'm doing something I shouldn't . . or not doing something I should?

Thanks in advance.

Posted on Oct 22, 2005 3:27 AM

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20 replies

Oct 22, 2005 3:21 PM in response to R J Kerr

That was just an example: perhaps I set up an alias to a Appleworks database file on another Mac (we use lots of these). I put the alias in my Documents folder on my Mac. It's OK for a while then, one day, I double click on the alias and it takes me somewhere totally different, or says "cannot find this alias" or words to that effect - I can't remember the exact Finder message.

But this happens even if the alias points at somewhere on my Mac. Say I create an alias of a folder which is on a firewire drive connected to my Mac, put that alias in my Documents folder (which I keep open for most of the time - it's the way I work). It's OK for a while then, one day, I double click the alias of the folder and another un-related folder opens. If I try to fix the alias in the 'Get Info' dialogue it doesn't work. The only thing I can do is trash the first alias and create a new one - which is fine . . . for a while.

Or maybe I create an alias of an application and put that in my Documents folder. It's fine for a while then, one day, I double click the alias and some un-related folder opens - not an Application, a folder.

The one that prompted me to make this post is: I have a folder on an always connected firewire drive which I call "scrap when printed", that's the folder, not the drive. I use this folder to temporarilly hold files that I will trash when I am happy that the job concerned is completed. Sort of a 'trash it next week' drop-box folder. I created an alias and put it into my Documents folder. As I go along with my daily workflow I may toss files into this alias believing that they are ending up in my "scrap when printed" folder on my Firewire drive. Once a week or so I go and trash the files that I no-longer need. Today I double clicked on the alias to do a bit of clearing out and, instead of opening the "scrap when printed" folder it opened the Documentation folder where Tiger puts my user guides etc. for OSX. In there, with the user guides were a few days worth of my trash next week files, so the alias had been wrong for a few days.

Hope I'm explaining myself a little better.

Oct 22, 2005 5:51 PM in response to R J Kerr

If it's on the network, probably even DHCPed, you have to expect this. You'd have to tinker with netinfo and your network settings to make aliases like this stick.

If it's on the external hard drive, the point is, after some time, your hard disk goes to sleep. If you double-click the drive's symbol before you ever touch the alias it should be fine otherwise it will only work if the drive is ready - which it normally isn't after some time (I'd say 30 minutes, but it could be less). This appears as random to you. You can change these settings in the Energy Saver Preferences, but I think it's not advisable not to put a hard disk to sleep, when possible, because you'll shorten its lifetime. Just make sure, the drive is ready, before using the alias.

The third point with the application is inexplicable to me.

Oct 23, 2005 1:52 AM in response to R J Kerr

When you prefer to use aliases instead of Unix symlinks, you may have to look at the network configuration, as suggested. Use your files from a server that has a fixed network address.

In our network we got the 'normal' Finder aliases pretty stable now. We have an xServe and a Linux server, they're both on a fixed network address. On the linux server it was needed to build the Netatalk application with CNID database support to find back the right files for aliases. One time we had to start with an fresh CNID database and all aliases were lost.

[ to Apple development team :-]
In my view the alias filetype should have had some evolution intelligent design to provide better support for the different environments MacOSX works with. I think an enhanced alias format holds more potentional, what if it could:
- Store the original files' metadata, with a preview image and keywords.
- Store symlinks, weblinks as well as the original ID-based links.
- Track back originals in a smart way combining symlink, ID and metadata.
It would be great if i could move files to DVDs or a remote webserver, and store aliases instead that are searchable and viewable. Of course programs like CDFinder, Qpict, Cumulus would loose some userbase...

Oct 23, 2005 2:36 AM in response to R J Kerr

Thanks for explaining things. I am probably mistaken about item 3, I just had it in my head that all aliases are unreliable and thought I had seen the application alias fail in the past, but again, I am probably mistaken.

So evidently it's a reasonable 'problem' to have, aliases failing on sleeping hard drives and networked Macs. It's not that I have something wrong with my system and it will all come crashing down one day in the future because I hav a corrupt file structure or something - a latent fear.

The last post is getting all too technical for me so I'm out of here.

Thank you very much for the explaination.

Bob.

Oct 23, 2005 3:09 AM in response to Ben van Setten

Thx for chiming in.
Is there a GUI application to create symbolic and / or hard links?

For the evolution of aliases - I don't fully agree with you, Ben. It's hard enough to understand for the rest of them to work with Finder aliases, how could they ever distinguish between the three. I mean what you suggest would need a pop-up-windows or something alike to give me actually the choice of what I want to create.
The track-back function would be nice and should be possible to implement with journaled HFS+, as fas as I understand it.

Oct 23, 2005 3:31 AM in response to madconqueror

From madconqueror: 'I mean what you suggest would need a pop-up-windows or something alike to give me actually the choice of what I want to create.'

Ehm no, please not. Just the alias file the way it 'just works' now (alt-cmd-dragging the original file), only the Finder could store more information into the alias: a Unix-like symlink or weblink, metadata, preview.

Only when you open the alias, and the system recognizes that the original file doesn't match the profile in the alias, a window could popup showing some choices to pick the right file.

Oct 23, 2005 4:07 AM in response to R J Kerr

Bob: I found a handy explanation about how aliases actually work, this may help you to live with the shortcomings:
http://tactileint.com/doc/glos/a.html#alias

Using a symlink instead of an alias might work better in some cases because it will force the system to follow the given file path instead of the ID, but it has it's typical problems with server volumes and deattatched disks too. I do not know an easy way to make symlinks, apart from opening a terminal and typing 'ln -s ' andsofort.

Oct 23, 2005 10:16 AM in response to madconqueror

Here's a Panther user chiming in to support R.J Kerr, the OP: Because no one told me different, I've assumed X's aliases are, and operate, like OS 7,8,9's and I use them extensively, taking full advantage of their robustness—renaming and re-locating them all the time. But just as R.J reports, after awhile Xaliases 'forget' and 'reassign' themselves—frequently to the folder they themselves are in. This has nothing to do with networks and servers; although I'd love to have aliases as functional as OS7/8/9's that could 'remember' to mount the remote volume where their original was, I've long ago resigned myself to X's lesser competence, and given up using such. Thanks all, for the symlink ifo; I'll experiment.

But the problem of unstable aliases is real, and has existed since at least Panther. If the 'solution' is to use symlinks, would not Apple have had Command L make a symlink instead of an alias? Or perhaps: Shouldn't Apple …etc. ?

For R.J. and anyone else: running MacJanitor (or the like) frequently, along with RebuildDesktop will prolong the life of your weaklink aliases. You could also pretend you're an admin at some multiversity and just leave your 'puter running 24/7 to take advantage of Apple's idea of automating such maintenance.

Oct 23, 2005 10:36 AM in response to Ed Hanna

Your problem with "unstable" aliases is not real. Aliases are working in a way you haven't yet adapted to. OS 9 was to stupid to realize an alias points to nowhere, when an external device was not mounted.

It's about external devices, it's about aliases over dynamic network connections. The aliases don't work, if you don't use them properly.

How does MacJanitor possibly have anything to do with this? Do you even understand what it actually does? You mislead others by pointing them to apps that are not needed in 10.4 anymore - and don't have anything to do with what we're talking about in this thread.

We have LaunchDaemons now that take care of the 24/7 problem.

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Unreliable Aliases

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