Mac Pro 2008 with 8800 GT, hard freezes with screen savers/OpenGL. You too?
I have been experiencing random intermittent hard crashes of my "early 2008" model 8-core Mac Pro. Now I have finally found an easy reproducible test case (see below), and hope others will try it and post the results. This is a video-driver related crash that I have now duplicated with two different video cards.
The symptom is that my screen randomly freezes. The mouse moves, but there's no way to use the Mac[1]. Holding the Power button to force the Mac to shutdown is the only way out.
Usually, this occurs when I get to my office in the morning, or after the gym. That's because the screen saver is running. I found that the screensaver, other OpenGL/3D type applications, are what triggers this bug.
The bug seems to be with the graphics driver. Immediately before the freeze, messages like this are printed in the system log:
----------
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception!
status = 0xffff info32 = 0xd = GR: SW Notify Error
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 0000000c
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 00200000 0000502d 00000470 00000000
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 00000482 000002ac 00000003 00000003
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 00000000 00000000 01be0003
...
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception!
status = 0xffff info32 = 0x3 = Fifo: Unknown Method Error
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 0000000b
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception!
status = 0xffff info32 = 0x3 = Fifo: Unknown Method Error
----------
Other errors like these also appear (the actual log output volume is too large for this forum):
-----
Mar 26 21:15:15 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception! status = 0xffff info32 = 0x6 = Fifo: Parse Error
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception! status = 0xffff info32 = 0xd = GR: SW Notify Error
-----
Anyway, finally I found on another thread about a similar issue[2], a recommendation to run Folding@Home program to trigger the freeze. They were talking about another Mac model, but sure enough, it triggers my problem every time. I downloaded the client[3], installed it, and then launched the app which gets put in the Applications folder. It doesn't even finish bouncing once in the dock before the Mac Pro freezes.
This is not a bug specific to Folding@Home; juding from the log messages and the effect, this is exactly the same crash that is intermittently triggered by the default Mac OS X screensavers (I use Arabesque, but I think any OpenGL screen saver does it). It's just that running Folding@Home is an easier way to trigger the bug than leaving your screensaver running for hours.
So, that is pretty unfortunate, right? I mean, not only can my new Mac Pro not sleep without losing all unsaved data (yes, I have the reboot-instead-of-wake problem[4], too, but that is another issue...) but it also crashes at random whenever the screen saver runs for a while, or somebody uses OpenGL programs. I have set my machine to never use the screen saver, but still.
So, first and foremost, my question for other 2008 Mac Pro owners with the 8800 video card is: does your Mac puke all over itself when you launch Folding@Home?
I just found it a little bit hard to believe that every Mac owner of the most expensive new Mac and the higher end video card will have these crashes. It could be, but it seemed far-fetched. So I tried some troubleshooting:
a
1.) I considered that I had a bad video card, so I got another GeForce 8800 GT and installed that. Still crashed.
2.) I disconnected my second monitor, and tried it with only one monitor. Still crashed.
3.) I booted from the pristine boot disk my Mac shipped with (10.5.1). Still crashed.
4.) I reduced the resolution on my 30" Cinema display to 800x600. Still crashed.
5.) Just to stave off the usual chorus of "try zapping your PRAM" posts, I zapped the PRAM. Of course, this did nothing (I don't think this has really fixed a problem since the 1990s...). Anyway, it still crashed.
6.) In doing all these tests, I disconnected all USB/FireWire peripherals.
7.) My Mac is totally up-to-date with Software Update as of Thu, Mar 27, 2008. Mac OS X 10.5.2.
I don't want to return this Mac to Apple; it is wicked fast and that really helps me with my work. But, the frequent crashing really is a productivity-killer.
So: does every 2008 Mac Pro owner with an 8800 GT have this problem?
(Note: there are lots of similar problems with other Macs and the new Mac OS X 10.5... I hope to specifically address this particular model and crash in this thread.)
If not, I will go to the next extreme step: pulling out some of my RAM. I have 12GB of RAM, and it all seems to work fine, no parity errors or anything. But I know sometimes problems don't happen unless there's "too much" RAM, "too high" resolution, and so on. But I would like to hear from others before I go banging on my precious DIMMs and riser cards.
Thanks for any information!
The next step will be to determine if this is just another unfortunate defect that affects ALL 2088 Mac Pros (in which case I would want to keep my fast Mac and wait for fixed drivers), or if perhaps just a subset of them have defective video cards that cause the driver to crash in this way (in which case I would want a replacement).
---------- NOTES: ----------
[1]: I can connect via SSH on the command line to the Mac. However, the GUI environment seems borked; opening apps or trying to gracefully quit them via AppleScript either does not work or really hard freezes everything, such that SSH no longer works either.
[2]: A similar (but perhaps different) issue affecting notebooks is discussed here, and there are some people with Mac Pros, too: http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=6786960
[3]: The Folding @ Home client, which can be used to trigger this bug, can be gotten here: http://folding.stanford.edu/English/Download
[4]: The severe defect affecting many (most?) 2008 Mac Pro machines' ability to sleep without losing data is discussed in this other thread: http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1353551
The symptom is that my screen randomly freezes. The mouse moves, but there's no way to use the Mac[1]. Holding the Power button to force the Mac to shutdown is the only way out.
Usually, this occurs when I get to my office in the morning, or after the gym. That's because the screen saver is running. I found that the screensaver, other OpenGL/3D type applications, are what triggers this bug.
The bug seems to be with the graphics driver. Immediately before the freeze, messages like this are printed in the system log:
----------
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception!
status = 0xffff info32 = 0xd = GR: SW Notify Error
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 0000000c
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 00200000 0000502d 00000470 00000000
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 00000482 000002ac 00000003 00000003
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 00000000 00000000 01be0003
...
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception!
status = 0xffff info32 = 0x3 = Fifo: Unknown Method Error
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: 0000000b
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception!
status = 0xffff info32 = 0x3 = Fifo: Unknown Method Error
----------
Other errors like these also appear (the actual log output volume is too large for this forum):
-----
Mar 26 21:15:15 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception! status = 0xffff info32 = 0x6 = Fifo: Parse Error
Mar 26 18:34:14 Mac-Pro kernel[0]: NVChannel(GL): Graphics channel exception! status = 0xffff info32 = 0xd = GR: SW Notify Error
-----
Anyway, finally I found on another thread about a similar issue[2], a recommendation to run Folding@Home program to trigger the freeze. They were talking about another Mac model, but sure enough, it triggers my problem every time. I downloaded the client[3], installed it, and then launched the app which gets put in the Applications folder. It doesn't even finish bouncing once in the dock before the Mac Pro freezes.
This is not a bug specific to Folding@Home; juding from the log messages and the effect, this is exactly the same crash that is intermittently triggered by the default Mac OS X screensavers (I use Arabesque, but I think any OpenGL screen saver does it). It's just that running Folding@Home is an easier way to trigger the bug than leaving your screensaver running for hours.
So, that is pretty unfortunate, right? I mean, not only can my new Mac Pro not sleep without losing all unsaved data (yes, I have the reboot-instead-of-wake problem[4], too, but that is another issue...) but it also crashes at random whenever the screen saver runs for a while, or somebody uses OpenGL programs. I have set my machine to never use the screen saver, but still.
So, first and foremost, my question for other 2008 Mac Pro owners with the 8800 video card is: does your Mac puke all over itself when you launch Folding@Home?
I just found it a little bit hard to believe that every Mac owner of the most expensive new Mac and the higher end video card will have these crashes. It could be, but it seemed far-fetched. So I tried some troubleshooting:
a
1.) I considered that I had a bad video card, so I got another GeForce 8800 GT and installed that. Still crashed.
2.) I disconnected my second monitor, and tried it with only one monitor. Still crashed.
3.) I booted from the pristine boot disk my Mac shipped with (10.5.1). Still crashed.
4.) I reduced the resolution on my 30" Cinema display to 800x600. Still crashed.
5.) Just to stave off the usual chorus of "try zapping your PRAM" posts, I zapped the PRAM. Of course, this did nothing (I don't think this has really fixed a problem since the 1990s...). Anyway, it still crashed.
6.) In doing all these tests, I disconnected all USB/FireWire peripherals.
7.) My Mac is totally up-to-date with Software Update as of Thu, Mar 27, 2008. Mac OS X 10.5.2.
I don't want to return this Mac to Apple; it is wicked fast and that really helps me with my work. But, the frequent crashing really is a productivity-killer.
So: does every 2008 Mac Pro owner with an 8800 GT have this problem?
(Note: there are lots of similar problems with other Macs and the new Mac OS X 10.5... I hope to specifically address this particular model and crash in this thread.)
If not, I will go to the next extreme step: pulling out some of my RAM. I have 12GB of RAM, and it all seems to work fine, no parity errors or anything. But I know sometimes problems don't happen unless there's "too much" RAM, "too high" resolution, and so on. But I would like to hear from others before I go banging on my precious DIMMs and riser cards.
Thanks for any information!
The next step will be to determine if this is just another unfortunate defect that affects ALL 2088 Mac Pros (in which case I would want to keep my fast Mac and wait for fixed drivers), or if perhaps just a subset of them have defective video cards that cause the driver to crash in this way (in which case I would want a replacement).
---------- NOTES: ----------
[1]: I can connect via SSH on the command line to the Mac. However, the GUI environment seems borked; opening apps or trying to gracefully quit them via AppleScript either does not work or really hard freezes everything, such that SSH no longer works either.
[2]: A similar (but perhaps different) issue affecting notebooks is discussed here, and there are some people with Mac Pros, too: http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=6786960
[3]: The Folding @ Home client, which can be used to trigger this bug, can be gotten here: http://folding.stanford.edu/English/Download
[4]: The severe defect affecting many (most?) 2008 Mac Pro machines' ability to sleep without losing data is discussed in this other thread: http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1353551
Mac Pro, Mac OS X (10.5.2), NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GT, 12GB RAM,
