Obtaining a (legal!) copy of Mac OS 9.1

Hi, mattlondon -

Welcome to Apple's Discussions.

You will need to obtain a retail OS 9.0, 9.0.4. or 9.1 Install CD; then use the download updater for OS 9.1 on the install of either of the first two.

Note - the langauge version of the download updater (International English or North American English) must match the langauge of the installed OS to be updated.

All retail disks for OS 9 versions have a white label with a large gold 9; disks with a gray or gray-blue label will not work - these are OEM disks, designed to work only with the model with which they originally shipped.

This site carries the various retail disks -
http://store.yahoo.com/hardcoremac/index.html

Whether they can ship to a non-US address is a different issue, something only they can answer.

Another possibility is eBay or equivalent sites - be sure, though, that you get a retail disk, not an OEM one.

A local Mac User Group may also help in getting the right disk; most large cities and universities have them.
http://www.apple.com/usergroups/

Hi, Matt, and welcome to Apple Discussions. Buying a legal copy of OS 9.1 is certain to cost you far more than the 5200 is worth. I'm glad if your machine has given you good service, but in fact that model is one of the very worst Mac designs ever (read why here). It has essentially no market value at all now, so you're right to be thinking of giving it away instead of trying to sell it. It would be a mistake to sink any money into it first. It is truly obsolete now, and OS 9.1 would tax its extremely limited RAM capacity (64MB) much more heavily than System 7.5.

Matt,

I would have to agree with eww, ironically, the cheapest way to obtain a copy of OS9.1 would be to buy another 2nd hand Mac, either a late G3 or early G4.

As for the worst design Mac ? There's a few that could take the title, I'm after an old Qudra 840AV, a bad idea really. Same with a PowerMac 9500, but it would be loved just the same.

Any charity would gladly take the old 5200, original disks would help more than OS9.1.

ps. pop into your local Apple Store ? Regent St ?

Hi,

I am in a similar but different situation and need help restoring my OS9 Classic system so that I can use older apps in my OSX environment. I was doing so until about two months ago when I might have trashed the system in a drunken stupor (or something to that effect) in an effort to clear away stuff I no longer used. Well, wouldn't you know it, I now need to get to those apps that ran in Classic.

I dug up my original software install discs from the original purchase of my G4 but they are only OS9.0.4. My mac, now running in 10.3.9 will not allow me to recognize or install from these discs because they are older than OS9.1; Classic launches whenever I try to install and I go through the process of using System Preferences to try to assign a system folder for Classic to use (and there is none found on the entire computer system).

I looked up an article on "blessing" the Classic system folder -- not much help since the Classic system i does not show up in the Startup Disc selection window. What's odd is that I still have a System Folder on my mac for the Classic environment, complete with a Finder icon, support folders and files , etc. And whatever I click on either tells me OSX is already using it or else it triggers a "Classic Launch" which fails when a suitable system folder can't be found.

I've tried downloading the OS9.1 Update and trying to launch or get it to cooperate with the OS9.0.4 disc sitting in my DVD drive, to no avail (but I wasn't expecting it to work. Each time I try launching anything related to the process Classic starts launching and looking for a suitable system disc, which it can not find.

When I upgraded to OSX Panthe 10.3 I got software that did not include Classic support which I now find a trifle irksome since I really NEEED to restore that environment to use my computer.

Is there any way I can restore the Classic system to my Mac using the tools I have or do I now also need to try to locate a commercially sold OS9.1 disc to reinstall from?

Thanks in advance for any help...
Tony

Hi, Anthony -

From the symptoms you've described, it would appear that you have been trying to run the OS 9 installer(s) while the machine is booted to OSX. This won't work - the installers on all stand-alone OS 9 install disks and all OS 9 updates will run only when the machine is booted to OS 9.

Try booting the machine to its original OS 9.0.4 Software Install disk (do not use the Software Restore CD). If it will boot to it, then perform a Clean Install of OS 9. This will install a brand new System Folder, rename the old one to Previous System Folder, and will otherwise leave the hard drive (and its data) intact.

Once that has been installed, boot the machine to the newly installed OS 9.0.4 on the hard drive - use the Startup Disk control panel to select that. Once you have done that, you can run the OS 9.1 download updater, followed by using the Software Update control panel to obtain those additional items that have been individually updated past the versions installed by the OS 9.1 updater.

***

A shortcut to that process that it won't hurt to try first.

Boot the machine to the OS 9.0.4 Software Install disk. Then run the OS 9.1 updater that you previously downloaded, being sure to select the hard drive as the destination. If this works, it may be able to re-install whatever files got lost.

Hi Don,

First, thanks very much for the response and the help. Seemed to me like what you said made sense so I attempted to reboot from the OS9.0.4 Software Install disc and reinstall.

Booting up worked, but the OS would not recognize my hard drive and kept asking if I wanted to Initialize it or Eject it (I continually opted for Eject). The software installation began but failed just when it was about to end because, the error message said, the volume wasn't a valid disc (or something like that) and then the icon for the hard drive disappeared from the desktop. Rebooting didn't help -- I could get the mac to boot off the 0S9.0.4 Software Install disc but could not get the DVD OS to access the hard drive. I knew it had to be there, because I hadn't asked the computer to erase or write over anything. I also couldn't access OSX on reboot. The only thing I could do was reboot using the OS9.0.4 disc to boot from.

Without access to internet to inquire further, I opted to do the following (and now have a whole new set of problems on my hands to ask about):

I installed OS9.0.4 onto my hard drive from the Software Restore disc instead -- I know you said not to, but I could boot off of that disc as well, and -- for whatever reason -- it would at least allow me to install onto the hard disc (not sure why it could "see" the hard disc but the Software Install disc could not -- even on repeat tries).

In any case, what the process did was take my existing hard disc (which I had named Barbarella) and "cloak" it in a new OSX Macintosh HD "environment". I ran the 9.1.5 updater and then my OSX update discs and performed the recommended software downloads/installs to bring the OS back up to OSX 10.3.9.

At least this installation of OSX can access Classic. But now I have to "get rid of" the older OSX installation and apps and reinstall them (yuck) or bring all my existing OSX apps into the new environment somehow. I tried using the "new" Apple Mail to import all my stuff from the Apple mail I had installed on Barbarella and it only picked up most of the messages and didn't acquire any of my Sent messages.

What's the best way out of a situation like this? Have I made an irrevocable error?

Thanks, very much, by the way for the help. I am otherwise at a loss.

Hi, Anthony. The reason the OS 9 installer disc couldn't see your hard drive is that last time you installed OS X on it, you didn't opt to install OS 9 hard disk drivers along with all the other stuff you installed. That makes it impossible for OS 9 to do anything with the drive, and because the OS 9 installer disc boots the computer into OS 9, you couldn't do anything. When you used your Restore disk, it booted into OS X, which was able to see the drive just fine. Unfortunately, it then erased the drive and reinstalled exactly what was on it when it came from the factory brand new — that's what a Restore disc does. So everything that you had created and stored on the drive since it was new is now gone, and all the software that you had added, updated or upgraded since the computer was new will have to be added, updated or upgraded all over again. This is why Don urged you not to use the Restore disc.

I owned a Performa 5260 (48MB ram) for a few years. When I tried 9.1 on it I ran into problems. That was a slow computer to begin with, but with 9.1 it was worse. Even the iMac 350 with 64MB wasn't that great with 9.1, but improved dramatically with 192MB. Had to go back to 8.1 on the Performa. Don't think I would go any higher with that ole' Road Apple.

Everything I had on the disc is not gone. It is all located in a file called "Original Items". All my old files are there, even my old software. Now, to get to older files I click on the "new" Macintosh HD within which is a list of Applications, Documents, Library, System, System Folder, Users, etc. AND a file called Original Items. When I used the Restore disc to put OS9 back on the system I chose the option not to write over anything, but to preserve the elements on the hard disc. This it did. Pardon me, but you seem to make it sound like I wiped out my hard drive entirely. I did not. What I have now is two versions of OSX installed, one on top of the other. Yes, I know this is a big boo-boo and not what anyone recommends. But, since what Don told me to do would not work because the original Software Install disc refused to recognize my hard drive, I did what I figured was the only other thing I could do in that situation -- I could not re-boot into OSX and ths Software Install disc that came with my mac was no longer recognizing my hard disc (unless I wanted to wipe everything out and reinitialize it).

The OSX 10 discs that I received to upgrade to Panther did not offer Classic support as an option so while I first tried using those to restore the classic environment (system) to my mac, this was futile or I would have done it that way to begin with.

Hi, Anthony. I wasn't aware of an option with some Restore discs to save whatever was on the drive previously, so I stand corrected — happily, for your sake! Many earlier Restore discs didn't offer that option, but wiped the drive in order to replicate exactly what was shipped preinstalled from the factory.

Classic support is not included on retail OS X installer disc sets or OS X upgrade disc sets — only on the model-specific discs that are shipped with new Macs. On earlier Macs that can support Classic, it was preinstalled at the factory; on later models that could support it, it was not part of the default installation, but could be added later at the user's option, from the original model-specific disc set. Intel Macs don't support Classic, so it isn't included on the model-specific discs that are shipped with them.

Thanks for the reply ewww -- indeed, I would not have even considered using the Software Install disc as an option (first, off I was warned against it) unless I saw that it offered the three installation options (which included: a) erase everything and install a new OS; b) preserve the existing OS and only modify necessary components; or c) perserve everything and install a different copy of the OS -- the "safest" choice to me was "C").

I guess my original query has graduated from an OS 9 issue to a problem about having a mac set up with piggy-backed OSX installations, so I may need to refer it to a different discussion board to get input on how to fix this, eh?

I presume the most certain way to fix the problem is to do a completely new clean install of the software from scratch, eliminating everything on the hard drive; that would wipe out both installations of OSX, but I would still need to reinstall from OS9.0.4 forward once again in order to preserve my ability to use Classic (since the OSX Panther discs didn't offer Classic Support).

I feel very lucky I was able to get email to work again -- sort of -- even though I've lost all my sent mail, and whatever was in my inbox, my filtering preferences, etc. And there are issues now sending and receiving mail that I didn't used to encounter. A new installation of Firefox fell flat (won't launch in this new OSX environment), so I assume there are some serious functional problems with the install-over-install situation I have created. I will need to find some kind of solution...

I am digging back into the Support files for a situation like this with guidelines, but haven't located anything yet.

In any case, thanks for the help -- for listening -- and for any further advice anyone can share.
Tony