Cannot Connect to WEP Wireless Network, Connection Timeout

Question

Level 2

210 points

Cannot Connect to WEP Wireless Network, Connection Timeout

I've started using my old 17" PowerBook G4 running 10.5.4 as my work computer to see how I can manage in a corporate environment. While my company isn't against Macs, like most, it's predominately a Windoze environment. That said, I've been very happy to discover my Mac works great for just about everything at work with the exception of a few Windoze only applications or Active X enable web portals.

However, I was disappointed this week to discover that I was unable to connect my PowerBook to a WEP enabled wireless network at the office. Everyone else using Windoze machines had no issues and even my iPhone was able to connect without a problem but the Mac simply refused to connect, giving me a "Connection Timeout" message almost immediately every time I tried. I've read many support post from users saying they too were having difficulty connecting to a WEP enabled network under Leopard while it works without a hitch on Tiger. I also read a few trouble shooting tips like using the Network Diagnostics in Safari or putting a $ in front of the password, etc. I've tried them all with no success.

What's especially troubling about this is that we're at 10.5.4 now and if this is a bug in Leopard, I'm very surprised it hasn't yet been addressed. Clearly people are connecting to WEP enabled networks so it much be some combination of hardware and software that prevents connections on some networks and not others. Whatever the case, everyone at the office was able to connect but me and for a guy who's trying to show how great Macs can be in a Windoze world, it was pretty embarrassing.

I've read most of the posts on this topic and it doesn't seem like there has been any word on an official fix from Apple or a way to work around the problem. I'm hoping someone has learned something new and can share what they've learned.

Also, please don't reply with posts about how WEP isn't secure and shouldn't be used. It's fine to make that argument if it's someone's personal network but this is a business network and I have no control over what security they use. All I know is that WEP should work on my Mac and with this network, it didn't and I'd like to find out why.

Thanks,
Eric

1 Ghz G4 PowerBook 17", iMac 3.06 GHz 24", iPhone 3g, Mac OS X (10.5.4), 2 Gigs RAM

Posted on Aug 3, 2008 11:27 AM

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Answer 1

chart97

Level 1

4 points

Aug 5, 2008 7:28 PM in response to Eric D.

What Eric D. said. I have the same situation, have followed the same steps, same issue. My client's (I am a contractor) Router WEP Key is not set to Key1. I love being embarrassed in front of a client, and having to justify having a mac.

All windows computers connect, my iPhone connects, but not the MacBook. This just makes me really happy, and even happier to know this is a known bug.

If Apple is listening, how about posting some clear unix commands for us to reconfigure the wireless network interface, or a real fix.

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Answer 2

Dogcow-Moof

Level 8

36,185 points

Aug 4, 2008 7:26 AM in response to Eric D.

Eric D. wrote:
Also, please don't reply with posts about how WEP isn't secure and shouldn't be used. It's fine to make that argument if it's someone's personal network but this is a business network and I have no control over what security they use. All I know is that WEP should work on my Mac and with this network, it didn't and I'd like to find out why.

Just as an aside, you really should find someone to ask the WEP question.

I'm sure your company has competitors or others who would love to know your access points are WEP-encrypted so they can sniff your company's private data.

As far as the WEP password goes, I trust you followed the steps listed for joining third-party WEP networks here:

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1126

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Answer 3

Eric D. Author

Level 2

210 points

Aug 4, 2008 5:32 PM in response to Dogcow-Moof

Yes, I tried all the suggestions in the Apple support article. Clearly there is a some issue with WEP and Leopard. There are posts all over the Apple Discussion Forums as well as other internet sites.

As for the WEP question (I knew someone couldn't resist the urge to comment), the reason WEP is in use is because it's a guest network. The company is trying to provide internet access to visitors using the least common denominator which has been WEP. WPA was troublesome for many Windows users because they didn't have the right service packs to support it. This network is a separated from the main company network. In certain cases, accessibility is what's important. Security can be handled through software. Anyway, my real question is still why Leopard can't connect to some WEP networks.

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Answer 4

BobHarris

Level 9

53,081 points

Aug 4, 2008 6:54 PM in response to Eric D.

I'm assuming the WiFi access point is from a company besides Apple. If that is the case you need to use the Hexidecimal password with a $ in front of it.

The password should be either 10 hex digits or 26 hex digits long.

For example: $1a2b3c4d6e
or $1234567890abcdef1234567890

The only exception to this rule is if the text password is exactly 5 characters for a 64/40bit WEP password, or 13 characters for a 128/104bit WEP password. In that case, you can enter the text password.

The WEP standard allows up to 4 different keys. Most home WiFi access points only use Key 1, however some home WiFi access points and commercial WiFi access points allow the use of any of the 4 keys. And this sometimes means that it will not accept key 1 if the access point is only accepting keys 2, 3, or 4.

I worked for a company that rotated the required key every month. So once ever 4 months my Mac could use the company WiFi access point.

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Answer 5

Eric D. Author

Level 2

210 points

Aug 4, 2008 7:50 PM in response to BobHarris

The access point is definitely not Apple hardware, most likely it's Cisco but I can't be sure. The password is 0123456789 (I know, creative). I've tried $0123456789, 0x0123456789, OX0123456789 and "0123456789", none of them worked. All the other Windoze machines and my iPhone connected without any problem using just 0123456789, no special characters, quotes or conversions. I understand that many routers can use up to 4 keys. I confess I don't fully understand how that works but based on what I know, entering a specific key in Windoze requires you to go into the advanced settings for the wireless network. I'm assuming that since I was able to connect other PC's and my iPhone by only entering the password, it was using Key 1 (which must be the default for both the iPhone and PC). If that's the case, my PowerBook should have connected as well. If that's not the case, how could the other devices connect without specifying a key number? Still sounds like a bug in Leopard unless I'm missing something.

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Answer 6

Dogcow-Moof

Level 8

36,185 points

Aug 5, 2008 7:47 PM in response to chart97

Mac OS X has only supported WEP Key 1 since at least 2006, and considering use of WEP is a very, very bad idea in most situations I don't see this changing any time soon.

Feel free to leave feedback with Apple about this, but really, you should convince your clients that they should either use WPA or WPA2, or just leave their access points open as using WEP simply provides a false sense of security.

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Answer 7

chart97

Level 1

4 points

Aug 5, 2008 8:19 PM in response to Dogcow-Moof

Thanks for the timely response. After I get done convincing my clients to upgrade security, I will get them all to buy Mac.

Really, I know that Apple is not going to address this. My contract is for 18 months of User Interface Design and I may have to buy a PC. Considering Apple is marketing ease of use, compatibility with the PC world, and has fixed the issue with the iphone, maybe they should consider fixing this issue.

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Answer 8

Dogcow-Moof

Level 8

36,185 points

Aug 5, 2008 8:24 PM in response to chart97

Long story short, there are all kinds of things in the 802.11 spec that no one really uses.

The Wi-Fi alliance spec for WEP only provided for Key 1, and that's what Apple coded to, and since WEP should really be dropped into a deep, dark hole at this point it's not surprising it's still an issue

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Answer 9

Eric D. Author

Level 2

210 points

Aug 5, 2008 9:49 PM in response to Dogcow-Moof

It wasn't stated directly but I just want to clarify what I think I'm hearing. 1) the problem I'm having is most likely that the access point is using keys 2, 3 or 4, not key 1. 2) that when accessing an access point, devices only needs to know the password, not the key number. As long as the password is the correct, the key number doesn't matter. 3) iPhones, despite running some version of Leopard, are able to connect using WiFi to access points using keys 2, 3 and 4 even though a computer running Leopard cannot.

For those knowledgeable about this issue, can you confirm this is what you're saying?

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Answer 10

RodneyW

Level 4

3,035 points

Aug 5, 2008 10:09 PM in response to Eric D.

The bottom line is that Leopard wireless networking is too "sensitive". Unfortunately the real world of wireless is such that there are out-of-date routers operating!

I have seen another thread where a Mac user can only connect to networks by setting his firewall to "allow all". I have no idea why the firewall would block anything to do with establishing a connection....

Cheers,

Rodney

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Answer 11

Dogcow-Moof

Level 8

36,185 points

Aug 6, 2008 12:46 AM in response to Eric D.

Eric D. wrote:
For those knowledgeable about this issue, can you confirm this is what you're saying?

There have been many complaints that the iPhone also won't connect to routers operating in WEP using a index key other than one in the iPhone forums, so I wouldn't be so sure of that.

After doing a little more research, Apple hasn't supported a WEP key index other than one since AirPort was introduced back in 1999, so it's not a Leopard issue but rather an Apple design decision.

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Answer 12

BobHarris

Level 9

53,081 points

Aug 6, 2008 6:37 AM in response to Eric D.

It wasn't stated directly but I just want to clarify what I think I'm hearing. 1) the problem I'm having is most likely that the access point is using keys 2, 3 or 4, not key 1.

You would have to tell us if the WiFi access points are using keys 2, 3, or 4. MOST network admins do NOT use the 2,3 or 4 keys, but they do exist and some net admins think they are being more secure by using them. But you would have to talk to your companies net admin to see if they were using these keys.

Since you say your iPhone is able to connect, I would think the WiFi access points DO NOT use keys 2, 3, or 4. But that is not proof, just my feeling.

2) that when accessing an access point, devices only needs to know the password, not the key number. As long as the password is the correct, the key number doesn't matter.

No, if WEP keys 2, 3, or 4 are being used, the password must be associated with the key, as each key can have a different password. So when setting up a PC you would have to know you are setting the password for key 2, 3, or 4, unless the net admins provide a utility for getting and setting the WiFi keys (the company I used to work for that used WEP keys did just this for PC; it would automatically use the old key to get the next key and put it in place; everyone else needed to figure it out manually).

3) iPhones, despite running some version of Leopard, are able to connect using WiFi to access points using keys 2, 3 and 4 even though a computer running Leopard cannot.

I do not know that iPhones can use WEP keys 2, 3, or 4. And it being OS X based, I would think it uses the same WiFi software as Macs which would mean it uses only key 1 for WEP.

Personally, I would try creating a new network location and try from scratch setting up WEP. System Preferences -> Network -> Location -> Edit Locations... -> [+], give the new location a name, configure it as needed, then try using the new location.

Also check Applications -> Utilities -> Console -> LOG FILES -> System and see if there are any network connection related error messages that might indicate what is happening.

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Answer 13

Eric D. Author

Level 2

210 points

Aug 6, 2008 8:01 AM in response to BobHarris

Thanks for your detailed reply. What you state in your post is what I suspected. Although Leopard not supporting keys other than 1 sounded like an logical explanation, it doesn't make sense given the other facts (ie. iphone connecting and no key number being entered with passwords). I did try your suggestion to setup a new location but that didn't work. I will have to look at the log files to see what I find there but otherwise I'm back to square one. I think it's fair to assume that we I'm dealing with an access point using a simple 10 digit password that's associated with key 1. Why my PowerBook running the latest version of Leopard can't connect remains a mystery. There has to be some other bug.

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Answer 14

Aug 25, 2008 4:21 PM in response to Eric D.

Hey everyone, this has nothing to do with WEP. It seems 10.5.4 has trouble connecting to hidden SSID's with the same error message "Connection Timeout". We have several Macbook pro's here with Cisco AP's. After a sleep the MBP will connect to the broadcast ssid and when you try to manually connect to a hidden ssid it keeps giving "connection timeout". A reboot makes it work for a while. I changed the broadcast ssid to the one I was trying to get to and the MBP jumped right on. We run now wireless security (WEP, WPA, etc).
Searching the forums this issue seems to be all over the place with multiple AP vendors so the common thread seems to be 10.5.4. As such I would imagine Apple is already aware of it, though we won't know until the update that fixes it and get a chance to read the release notes.

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Answer 15

Dogcow-Moof

Level 8

36,185 points

Aug 25, 2008 7:32 PM in response to Ronald Zander

There are many, many more people connecting to APs with hidden SSIDs than not, so it's certainly not a general case issue.

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