Brett L

Q: MacBook Pro Blank Screen (Built - in & External) - continued

This thread is a continuation of [MacBook Pro Blank Screen (Built - in & External)|http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1478474]. The thread was getting too long and some browsers were timing out.

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Posted on Sep 25, 2008 1:42 PM

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Q: MacBook Pro Blank Screen (Built - in & External) - continued

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  • by nomadman,

    nomadman nomadman Sep 20, 2010 3:06 AM in response to Edbert
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 20, 2010 3:06 AM in response to Edbert
    I've had some problems with this 2007 mbp in the past. The first year after I got it, there was an issue with the screen having multi-colored vertical lines and the battery would only charge to 90% after a full drain and full recharge. It was under warranty then so I took it to the Apple Store and they replace the screen and the battery free of charge.

    5 months ago, this MBP suddenly would not chime on re-boot or cold start. Although the HDD and the DVD writer would spin up. I took it to 2 Apple ASPs and they concluded that it was the logic board which would cost me USD $600.00. I've known about the nVidia problem since day one and the fact that i've RMA'd 2 other 2007 MBP the 2nd month after Apple announced that it was an nVidia problem. This MBP had trouble late in the game and Apple decided that it wasn't worth it to replace my logic board. I shelved the machine until I can get back to the main land and have a real ASP look at the problem and have the logic board replaced.

    This month, I had some time off to read some blogs about heating the main board to temporarily fix the problem. Having nothing to loose, I took the machine apart because i wanted to apply some thermal compound on the bridge chip, processor, and graphics chip in hopes of getting it working, but to no avail.

    My last test was to fully charge the battery, keep the machine on, place a card board sheet between the keyboard and the LCD (as to not damage the new screen) and close the lid. Then I placed the laptop inside the laptop sleeve. Again this is while the machine is on. I let it sit for 30 minutes.

    I removed the machine from the sleeve and removed the battery, then immediately plugged the battery back in and started the machine. I was surprised the I heard a chime and the machine booted! After a week of not rebooting or turning the machine off, i finally got the balls to reboot it. Once again I got a black screen and no chime. To get the machine started, I would have to redo the previous steps of over heating the machine for 30 minutes. It has worked this way after every update that needed a reboot.

    My question to you fine folks is, does this warrant a free logic board? I still think it's a graphics chip problem and i would love to have it fixed locally instead of taking it back to the main land and have it replaced during the holidays.
  • by nomadman,

    nomadman nomadman Sep 20, 2010 11:48 PM in response to nomadman
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 20, 2010 11:48 PM in response to nomadman
    This is in response to my last message. Hearing no response from anyone on this board, I called the nearest Apple ASP and insisted for someone to visit my condo and do the test while the machine is working. The engineer came over and thank heavens the machine booted and he was able to run the GPT test. I took a screenshot of the error code and confirmed that it was a graphics chip error and not logic board problem. Please see link:

    http://cl.ly/2ce56e9791f6e24d9d5e

    Without the test output, the ASP will not and can not request for a free logic board replacement from Apple. What concerns me is, what about those who do not have the technical knowledge to diagnose a machine? Apple simply asked them to purchase another unit on the customers' expense. This makes me think twice about buying another Apple product and recommending Apple products to friends and clients.

    Great job Apple!

    :-\
  • by bosonnoit,

    bosonnoit bosonnoit Sep 22, 2010 4:33 PM in response to Edbert
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 22, 2010 4:33 PM in response to Edbert
    Hi,

    Brought the machine to the Apple Store : GPU is dead.
    They are replacing it, and I will get my baby back within a few days:-D
    They charged me nothing, due to the AppleCare still running, but I invite you to read this : http://support.apple.com/kb/ts2377
    NVidia having recognizing their responsibility, it says that Apple will replace any incriminated broken NVidia chip FREE OF CHARGE, provided it is less than 4 years old.

    I read somewhere in this thread that the GPU might not be well connected to the motherboard if cold. So I tried what the guy suggests : let the computer heat, then reboot.
    It actually kinda work for me, but it also might be a coincidence.
    The point is the GPU is not totally broken. My opinion is that it is misconnecting (physically), and that the misconnection occurs only on Apple logic board, though it could have been any other hardware. Or if you prefer : just bad luck.
  • by Chad916,

    Chad916 Chad916 Sep 23, 2010 10:46 PM in response to bosonnoit
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 23, 2010 10:46 PM in response to bosonnoit
    Me too. My 2008 Macbook Pro died yesterday (no display or ext.). Took it to Apple today and they ran a test, they knew about the problem. Well it failed so they said it was FREE repair!! My Macbook shows alot of wear but they didn't care. I was going to argue this one because they screwed me on a Magsafe, my original one died two weeks after warranty expired!!!
  • by tgs102002,

    tgs102002 tgs102002 Sep 25, 2010 8:51 AM in response to Brett L
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 25, 2010 8:51 AM in response to Brett L
    My MBP has done exactly what you all are talking about on this forum but has a ATY,RadeonX1600.

    Does this board get the same free replacement treatment?
  • by gbullman,

    gbullman gbullman Sep 25, 2010 4:32 PM in response to tgs102002
    Level 2 (301 points)
    Sep 25, 2010 4:32 PM in response to tgs102002
    The problem most talked about on this thread which is covered under an extended repair plan by Apple is for NVidia graphics cards only (in fact NVidia 8600M s only).

    If you're still under Applecare they should replace it, but doubt they'll do anything except charge for repairs if it is out of warranty.

    Good luck.
  • by amtprod,

    amtprod amtprod Sep 27, 2010 11:59 AM in response to Brett L
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 27, 2010 11:59 AM in response to Brett L
    I am surprised that this thread is still open, so I thought I would get this in ASAP. I also have had failure of the logic board: Computer was running for a few hours, closed the lip while on, opened up the next day and it was dead. REstart and no chime, hard drive spin, etc etc. Had it repaired and was told it WAS NOT the graphics card, it was only the logic board. I was told they are able to test the graphics card on it's own, and it tested fine, it was the logic board. Apple charged me for it, and I am currently fighting this. I find it alarming that there are this many people that have had this exact same issue. I will concede that maybe the graphics card didn't fail, but that then raises another issue with the logic boards failing at an alarming rate.

    The senior technician at Apple stated that the only thing that can be done is to lodge a formal complaint to Apple, and post on their feedback site. Refund? No way. However, this appears to be a very common issue with the 2007-2008 MBP's as a graphics card issue, AS WELL as a logic board failure. So I am hoping that being another addition to this list will have weight on Apple, and there will be some future rebate. Good luck.
  • by nomadman,

    nomadman nomadman Sep 28, 2010 2:03 AM in response to nomadman
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 28, 2010 2:03 AM in response to nomadman
    So it's 6 days after Apple ASP ordered the new logic board and they installed it within the hour. My 2007 MBP works again.

    Does anyone know if this new logic board is identical to the the logic board they used in 2007? What I mean to ask is if this new logic board will have the same cancer as the old logic board. If so, I will sell this MBP before it starts causing video problems and let the new Mac user deal with it. It's only fair to spread the cancer to other people so that they learn the same lesson as we did about purchasing Apple products.
  • by gbullman,

    gbullman gbullman Sep 28, 2010 9:13 AM in response to nomadman
    Level 2 (301 points)
    Sep 28, 2010 9:13 AM in response to nomadman
    My understanding from reading a couple of Mac news sites is that the Nvidia "cards" on the logic board had a physical flaw that would allow a specific area of the "card" to get to hot. Nvidia fixed the issue through a design / production change and to the best of my knowledge the updated "cards" are not susceptible to the same failure.

    I'm in the same boat as you, my logic board was replaced for this problem a month or 2 ago so I'm hoping there are no further problems. FYI, my MBP is on 5 to 7 days a week, about 14-16 hours a day since January 2008 and I just experienced this issue recently. I'm still under Applecare until the end of January 2011, so hopefully done with this issue.
  • by Cyn2,

    Cyn2 Cyn2 Sep 28, 2010 9:31 AM in response to Brett L
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 28, 2010 9:31 AM in response to Brett L
    Ach.....My Macbook Pro died about 3 weeks ago. One morning I tried to start it and Nothing! I've read many of the discussion threads and it seems to be experiencing the symptoms of the NVIDIA breakdown...when I turn it on, I get a little rev, but no lights on the keyboard and no video...the white light on the front of the case does come on. Also, I'm able to fully charge the battery. I've taken it to an Apple Solutions Expert in Guadalajara, MX three times. Each time they send it back and say the video is fine. And, it's true, the last time, after they vacuumed the logic board, I got it home and it started. Until I tried to restart the machine and Nothing again. It's been 48 hours and we've tried to start it many times but we keep getting the white light on the front and nothing else. Also, I've noticed that the bar at the back of the keyboard gets extremely hot...nearly burns my fingers.

    The serial number appears to be from the batch with the bad video chips: w880160kx91. I'm not sure what to do next.

    My problem appears to be intermittent. It works for the Apple store but not for me.
  • by nomadman,

    nomadman nomadman Sep 28, 2010 10:30 AM in response to gbullman
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 28, 2010 10:30 AM in response to gbullman
    I apologize for incorrectly stating that it was a logic board problem. Then again, Apple ASP originally state that it was a logic board problem and I had to buy a new USD$1,000.00 replacement board to fix it. This is an nV chip design flaw and Apple isn't to blame for the flaw. Nonetheless, I hold Apple responsible for fixing it's product. In my case, it took me 5 months to prove that it was a graphics flaw. I posted a reply (messageID=12302917) last week on how I proved it. Others would have just gotten a new machine.

    If you are correct about the new design and you live in a mild climate, you shouldn't have any problems. I would install and play a graphics intensive game on it the new couple of months. StarCraft II is a good one . I live in a humid climate and the temp is between 28c - 36c all year long. In this climate, we have a higher failure rate and we do not need a design flaw to add to our problems.

    Once the 3 month warranty expires on this new logic board, I will take it apart again and apply Arctic Silver on the nV chip, Intel chip, and bridge chip. I insisted the ASP to apply it while replacing the board but they said it might cause a warranty issue. For those that care, I compared the temp between Arctic Silver and the compound Apple supplies. AS is giving me 46c on idle, Apple thermal paste gives me 49c at idle. Converting a movie for 2hrs with AS doesn't go above 68c. Converting the same movie for 2hrs, Apple thermal paste gives me just under 90c. There is a big difference between the Apple supplied thermal paste and an after market thermal compound.

    Sorry for rambling. As a final note, I hope someone can give us a definitive answer or link on whether or not the new logic boards are susceptible to the same failure. And how do we know that the board given to us is redesigned or just overstock?

    Message was edited by: makati_guy

    Reworded sentences.
  • by tlp5002,

    tlp5002 tlp5002 Sep 29, 2010 10:46 PM in response to Brett L
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 29, 2010 10:46 PM in response to Brett L
    Hi all,

    I'm curious if anyone has experienced a situation similar to mine. I have a MBP purchased 9/1/07. Just in the past week or so I started to get the blank screen.

    Unit boots and I hear the familiar chime. I can see the back-light get darker and lighter when using brightness buttons on keyboard, but no video.

    Took it to the Apple store and a girl ran a test for all of 5 minutes and said the issue was not the 8600M GT, but could not state what the issue was related to. She hooked it up to an external monitor and it did show the extended desktop.

    She printed a work authorization and several hundred dollars later, all it says is:

    "Send to repair facility and replace any and all parts necessary. Unit passes NVIDIA test."

    I guess I would just like a bit more detail. What exactly will they replace? I'd also like to make sure I don't have to take this thing back again within a couple months as I'm not particularly close to any Apple stores.
  • by Edbert,

    Edbert Edbert Sep 30, 2010 5:22 AM in response to Brett L
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Sep 30, 2010 5:22 AM in response to Brett L
    I've become somewhat of a detractor of Apple after buying this $4,000 laptop, it has been to the genius bar three times for component replacement all handled by my 3-year Apple-Care. Anyone who has read this thread and part one which was closed long ago HAS to realize that the steep price tag of this product is for the slikck design and packaging and should not in any way be constued to indicate the same quality inside.

    Well, depending on how this plays out (http://www.nvidiasettlement.com/), I may be revising that opinion. I suggest everyone who has experienced an issue with their MBP go there and see if yours is covered.
  • by gbullman,

    gbullman gbullman Sep 30, 2010 6:50 AM in response to tlp5002
    Level 2 (301 points)
    Sep 30, 2010 6:50 AM in response to tlp5002
    I was trying to find some information I collected when my NVidia card failed on my late 2007 15" MBP to give you the exact graphic card info that I saw, but don't seem to have it. My MBP did boot up and I was able to get to the desktop with Screen Sharing. I brought up System Profiler and the NVidia graphics card did not show up at all, only an Intel card (which I believe is part of the Intel Chip set for this computer). In all other respects other than display the computer seemed fine.

    I'm pretty sure the Apple genius tried to hook up an external monitor as part of his trouble shooting, and if I remember correctly nothing came up on it. In my case the NVidia test clearly showed the NVidia failure and they replaced the Logic Board without any issues. My MBP is still under Applecare until the end of January so I have more time to see if this issue will recur. I'm pretty optimistic since it took the first faulty one 2 1/2 years to fail, and this one should have the updated NVidia design.
  • by ernieboy,

    ernieboy ernieboy Oct 26, 2010 11:53 AM in response to panros
    Level 1 (4 points)
    Oct 26, 2010 11:53 AM in response to panros
    Hi Guys,
    Same problem with my MBP 17 2.4GHz, suddenly after a restart the screen went black and as all others here did, all the possible measures were done but to no avail...
    Now the frustrating thing is, I am able to remote control my MBP via Log Me In, and on my G5 desktop I am able see it well and alive with absolutely no problem, capable of doing anything with it. Only the screen is the problem. pitch black...
    And thru the remote control i am able to see that in System Profiler, Graphics/Displays listed only the Intel GMA X3100, the NVidia Card that should be there simply disappeared.
    Since I am in Shanghai, I took it over to the newly opened Apple Store and visited a genius. The genius plugged a USB drive into my MBP and press the power button together with the D key, he said if this is the NVidia problem, the sleep light should blink immediately, following my MBP’s S/N will be automatically transferred to the drive. But unfortunately no blinking light and no S/N transfer, he told me it is not this TS2377 problem and insist it has something to do with the Logic board.
    I was not able to use remote control to convince him that my MBP should be fine since i only have Airport configured at that moment and how can i select their Wifi network and punch in their password if i am not able to see the screen, so he simply got a little impatient with me and told me to forget it.
    I returned to my office and re-configured my MBP to using DHCP and hope that tomorrow if i can get there again i can convince him that if it is not the graphics card that is the problem, then please tell me what problem can it be?
    That genius was trained to follow the given procedure to diagnose the NVidia problem and he simply will not use his common sense on this, what a genius...
    I will do as panros said to insist for a better test, and hopes that things can turn around.
    Has any body came across this USB drive diagnostic thing that they use at the store? By the way the store has only opened for less than a month and he showed me that there are already 8 MBPs sent in and qualified for this repair, wow, this seems to be quite widespread to me...
    Will keep posting on this...
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