WAV files and Apple Lossless

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WAV files and Apple Lossless

I have spent weeks ripping about 700 CDs into iTunes using WAV files, because I thought they were the highest quality, only to figure out that Apple Lossless will provide the same audio quality but utilizing much less space on the external hard drive. How do I convert those WAV files to Apple Lossless? I have another 700 CDs to rip, but I want to get this done before I continue, so everything will be in the same format. Am I right to use Apple Lossless, which I understand is a FLAC-type file, rather than WAV?

Macbook, Mac OS X (10.5.5)

Posted on Jan 21, 2009 6:52 AM

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Answer 1

Mr Al

Level 1

4 points

Feb 12, 2009 12:21 PM in response to Chris CA

Hey, thanks for the response.
I guess from what I have read in the audiophile magazines is that Wav has more resolution than Apple lossless. And when I download a CD in AL vs. Wav, the Wav does take up more space which to me, seems like that is equivalent to more data, ie. 1's and 0's? Is that not the case? Or do both bring over the full 16 bit file, bit for bit, but only that Wav utilizes more space in doing so? Are there any audiophiles out there who can help me here? What about XRCD's, any differences there? I am new to this and never thought I would use an Ipod as a music server because the sound quality from the IPod's $0.60 DAC was poor. But with the Wadia transport, it bypasses the IPod DAC, and pushes the digital data to a high-end DAC to do the processing. The sound is better than listening to the cd through a good sounding cd player. That is why I want to make sure I am getting the highest resolution possible when I upload my cds, but if both capture the full 16 bits of data, in theory they should sound the same. Oh well, sorry to rattle on. Thanks for any help.

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Answer 2

Chris CA

Level 10

82,513 points

Feb 12, 2009 1:32 PM in response to Mr Al

WAV and AIFF will retain every bit from the CD file which is why a CD and the RIP'd files are the same size.
Apple Lossless will toss out the redundant bits but keep track of where they were and put them back during playback. (ie. the next 10 bits are a 1 so keep the first and note that the next 9 are also a 1).

Lossy encoders take out bits (such as higher frequencies and silence) and no longer care about them.

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Answer 3

Zevoneer

Level 9

52,705 points

Jan 21, 2009 7:13 AM in response to wyatthudson

If you are planning to convert the whole library then change your import setting, highlight the first song in your library and go to Edit>Select All. With everything highlighted go to Advanced>Create Apple Lossless Version. When the conversion of all the files is done click at the top of any column in your library and choose Kind from the list. Click at the top of the Kind column to sort the files into WAV and Lossless. Click on the first WAV file in the list and hold down the Shift key, scroll to the last WAV file and click on it to highlight all the WAV files in between. Press the delete key on your keyboard.

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Answer 4

Zevoneer

Level 9

52,705 points

Jan 21, 2009 6:56 AM in response to wyatthudson

You can convert songs in your iTunes library to another format. When you convert a song in iTunes it will be converted to the format that you have set to import your CDs in. Converting creates a second copy of the song in the format you have chosen which gives you the opportunity to either keep or delete the original. If you are using iTunes 8 go to Edit>Preferences>General and click on Import Settings, change your option to Apple Lossless. Go back to your library and highlight the songs you want to convert and go to the Advanced menu at the top of your iTunes window and choose "Create Apple Lossless version: iTunes: How to convert a song to a different file format

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Answer 5

wyatthudson Author

Level 1

0 points

Jan 21, 2009 7:03 AM in response to Zevoneer

Thank you. Is there anyway to do this en masse? Or do I have to do it by marking one track at a time? (all my music is classical, by the way.) Also, is there anyway to delete the WAV files all at once? I have thousands of files at this point.

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Answer 6

Zevoneer

Level 9

52,705 points

Jan 21, 2009 7:22 AM in response to wyatthudson

From what I've read Apple Lossless will give you a CD quality file as long as it's created from an original uncompressed format such as WAV or AIFF. So on those grounds alone there doesn't seem to be any point keeping larger duplicate files. You should make two copies of something you are familiar with in WAV and Apple lossless and have a listen for yourself to see if you feel the quality is still what you want. People will have different preferences and tolerances to compressed music so it's always best to go by your own ears.

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Answer 7

wyatthudson Author

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Jan 21, 2009 7:25 AM in response to Zevoneer

Good idea, and since I am ripping from the uncompressed digital file on the CD, I don't have to worry about making a WAV intermediary. I will do some A/B comparisons before I convert everything, many thanks.

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Answer 8

wyatthudson Author

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Jan 21, 2009 2:41 PM in response to Zevoneer

Zevoneer wrote:
If you are planning to convert the whole library then change your import setting, highlight the first song in your library and go to Edit>Select All. With everything highlighted go to Advanced>Create Apple Lossless Version. When the conversion of all the files is done click at the top of any column in your library and choose Kind from the list. Click at the top of the Kind column to sort the files into WAV and Lossless. Click on the first WAV file in the list and hold down the Shift key, scroll to the last WAV file and click on it to highlight all the WAV files in between. Press the delete key on your keyboard.

f you are planning to convert the whole library then change your import setting, highlight the first song in your library and go to Edit>Select All. With everything highlighted go to Advanced>Create Apple Lossless Version. When the conversion of all the files is done click at the top of any column in your library and choose Kind from the list. Click at the top of the Kind column to sort the files into WAV and Lossless. Click on the first WAV file in the list and hold down the Shift key, scroll to the last WAV file and click on it to highlight all the WAV files in between. Press the delete key on your keyboard.

After I did this, and I admit the possibility of some screw up on my part, ALL my files disappeared, including Apple Lossless. When asked whether to put the deleted WAV files in the trash, I said no, but now I can find all of them, only some of them seem to be on the external hard drive, nothing near the number I had there originally. Before I deleted the WAV files I made sure the Apple Lossless were in place, which they were.

However, upon inspection it looks as if iTunes was not finished converting all the files. What fooled me is that I got a message saying one of the files was not convertible and the process had stopped, so I assumed they were all converted.

What do I do now?

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Answer 9

Mr Al

Level 1

4 points

Feb 11, 2009 6:48 PM in response to Zevoneer

I have a question about converting Apple lossless to Wav. I have uploaded all of my cds using Apple Lossless. I wanted the best resolution possible. I found out that Wav files have the best resolution. I am using the Wadia 170i transport through a high end DAC to play through my stereo. My question is, will I lose any resolution converting the Apple lossless to Wav? Would it be the same as if I went back and re-uploaded all of my cds in Wav? Or do I need to start over? Any help would be appreciated.

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Answer 10

Chris CA

Level 10

82,513 points

Feb 11, 2009 6:57 PM in response to Mr Al

I found out that Wav files have the best resolution

WAV, AIFF and Apple Lossless are all identical to the CD audio (and each other).

My question is, will I lose any resolution converting the Apple lossless to Wav?

If Apple Lossless was less quality (it's not), then yes, converting to WAV would be less resolution. As it is, converting Apple Losssless to WAV will simply double the file size with zero increase in quality.

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Answer 11

Betwixt

Level 1

0 points

Feb 14, 2009 10:24 AM in response to Chris CA

My understanding (perhaps erroneous) was that even Lossy formats contained all of the original data bits but simply compressed them to a greater degree (thus smaller file size) and didn't utilize them upon playback (thus different quality). Otherwise, how could an MP3 file (ripped from an original source) be later converted in iTunes to an Apple Lossless file?

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Answer 12

Chris CA

Level 10

82,513 points

Feb 14, 2009 10:39 AM in response to Betwixt

My understanding (perhaps erroneous) was that even Lossy formats contained all of the original data bits but simply compressed them to a greater degree

Lossy formats lose daa, which is why it's called lossy. If it was still in the file, it could be used.

Otherwise, how could an MP3 file (ripped from an original source) be later converted in iTunes to an Apple Lossless file?

Same way you can burn a 128 kbps iTunes download to an audio CD, which is 10 times the size. The quality of that burned CD will be no greater than the 128 kbps file.
The burning program will "pad" the files with extra bits. The algorithm used to convert the song to MP3 tosses out bits you cannot hear and putting back these bits you cannot hear will not change (improve) the quality.

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Answer 13

Betwixt

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Feb 14, 2009 12:50 PM in response to Chris CA

Yes, the quality of the resulting burned CD (or 'upconverted' file) can't exceed that of the original. [the sample rate is only an issue in the initial conversion from the source] But shouldn't the original (e.g. very compressed, lossy MP3 file) at least CONTAIN the data needed to later upconvert it? Otherwise (again), how can an MP3 (not the original source....e.g. vinyl) be converted to an AL or WAV file?

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Answer 14

Chris CA

Level 10

82,513 points

Feb 14, 2009 4:41 PM in response to Betwixt

But shouldn't the original (e.g. very compressed, lossy MP3 file) at least CONTAIN the data needed to later upconvert it?

No. If all the bits were there, it would not be lossy and would not be any smaller than the original, just as WAV and AIFF are the same size as the original. They contain all the bits in the orignal.

Otherwise (again), how can an MP3 (not the original source....e.g. vinyl) be converted to an AL or WAV file?

As noted above, the program that converts it will fill in the extra bits (with no audio) as needed.

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Answer 15

wyatthudson Author

Level 1

0 points

Jan 21, 2009 7:17 AM in response to Zevoneer

Thanks for the very clear explanation of the process. Do you think there is any reason for me to NOT delete the WAV files, given my concern for audio quality?

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