hi guys when i say random i mean it 4 times in 4 months, and i cant predict when it might happen so that is a no go. I dont install quiktime updates cos i dont really use it enuff the bother and the only other updates that have been applied are the official apple security updates. The screen is just over a year old with very little use so im pretty sure its not that, i have a second monitor but its up in the attic and i nearly bust my neck getting it thru the loft hatch on my own i think the only way down for it is if i give it to a mate while im up in loft,as i live on my own.i will try checking and repairing disk permissions in case something has gone awry there. Im also gonne get my air compressor out give the internals a good blast with air to remove some crap as i am a smoker it mb be a bit blerrrrrrghgh inside.Any more ideas folks i let you know what happens.AHHH just thought of something will there be anything visible in the apple log, if it is a microsecond finder crash it should be recorded somewhere, does anyone know where of if it is recorded,thanks for your help.If you know any of the answers let me know please,thnx again.