Stange behaviors; unable to diagnose

Question

Level 2

454 points

Stange behaviors; unable to diagnose

For the last few weeks, I have been getting these behaviors with increasing frequency:
1. unable to shut down-have to shut down by holding power switch for 5 sec
2. having to force-quit a number of non-responsive apps: System Prefs, Firefox 3, Word 2004, PowerPoint 2004
3. Dock icons bounce interminably but dont open.
4. Restarting in single user mode and running fsck -fy ends with "the volume appears to be OK AND FILE SYSTEM WAS MODIFIED. After running fsck -fy again, no problems. Typing exit starts login sequence that sometimes ends with just a black screen. Have to hold down start again to shut down and restart.
5. Disk repair today from install disk: no problems
6. Apple Hardware Test today" no problems
7. Disk Warrior 4.1.1 today: no problems
8. Cocktail run today without apparent problems.
9. Also, sometimes ForceQuit wont work: report to Apple is a "hang"

I was planning on updating to OSX.5.7 but am leery of doing so while this weird behavior is going on. I can't find anything wrong...what am I missing???

Thanks in advance.

ph

Message was edited by: pomme-homme

PowerMac G5 2.0 GHz Dual Processor, Mac OS X (10.5.6), 6 GB RAM

Posted on May 27, 2009 4:47 PM

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Answer 1

May 27, 2009 4:52 PM in response to pomme-homme

Sounds like hard disk failure. I know, I see you ran the AHT and Disk Utility... that doesn't always detect problems.

How much free drive space is there?

Control or right click the MacintoshHD icon on your Desktop. Click "Get Info". Under the General tab you will see Capacity and Available. Make sure there is at least 10% available disk space, 15% is better.

Carolyn 🙂

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Answer 2

pomme-homme Author

Level 2

454 points

May 27, 2009 4:57 PM in response to Carolyn Samit

The HD is a Western Digital 640 GB (WDC WD6400AAKS-00A7B0) that I bought new in December 2008 and installed in the lower bay because the HD that came with the G5 (160 GB) was getting full!!

There is 520 GB available space on the 640 GB HD.

ph

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Answer 3

thomas_r.

Level 7

32,031 points

May 27, 2009 5:06 PM in response to pomme-homme

Just because you don't have any hard drive problems doesn't mean you can't have file corruption. Disk Utility, DiskWarrior, AHT and fsck can't diagnose that problem. Hard drive problems by themselves don't cause problems, it's the file corruption that results.

So, my guess is that something has gotten corrupted somehow. Dunno how, but that really doesn't matter that much at this point. Fixing it is top priority. First, you didn't mention anything about repairing permissions... do that now, while running from the affected system. (It works better that way, rather than when running off the install disk.)

If that doesn't work, there are undoubtedly some solutions you could try... deleting some .plist files, clearing caches, etc. However, there's no guarantee any of these things would work and you can easily waste a lot of time troubleshooting. My personal preference in such cases is to just back up my files (if they aren't already, which they should be), wipe the drive clean with Disk Utility and reinstall the system and all apps. I try not to copy any settings or apps over from the backup of the old system, since any of those items might be damaged. Reinstall apps from scratch and re-set any settings manually.

Good luck... these things are never fun to fix!

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Answer 4

May 27, 2009 5:10 PM in response to pomme-homme

Are you familiar with the Terminal application?

Mac OS X: How to force background maintenance tasks (logs and temporary items)

If Terminal seems daunting... get Macaroni and run Maintenance.

Carolyn 🙂

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Answer 5

thomas_r.

Level 7

32,031 points

May 27, 2009 5:15 PM in response to Carolyn Samit

Running these maintenance tasks *will not* solve any of these problems, and is, in fact, absolutely unnecessary unless you *shut down* your machine at night. See myth number 2 on this page:

http://www.macworld.com/article/133684/2008/06/maintenance_intro.html

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Answer 6

pomme-homme Author

Level 2

454 points

May 27, 2009 5:25 PM in response to thomas_r.

Thanks for the quick responses:

1. I did repair permissions today
2. I do shut down the machine at night but ran the complete Cocktail suite today; shouldn't that do the same as Macaroni?
3. All my files are backed up (the good news)
4. I was hoping not to have to reinstall system (the bad news)

Doh.

ph

for my information: is there any way to diagnose file corruption? (in my day job we like to diagnose before we treat...)

Message was edited by: pomme-homme

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Answer 7

TildeBee

Level 7

31,923 points

May 27, 2009 6:53 PM in response to pomme-homme

pomme
A couple questions for you, OK???

1. have you checked your Console log
for notations during the time that you have problems???
2. Have you double checked your RAM sticks?
All seated correctly, etc.? RAM sometimes fails, but doesn't show up as an error.
3. Can you think back to before this started happening -
"... the past few weeks . . ." Did you add anything??? Delete anything???

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Answer 8

pomme-homme Author

Level 2

454 points

May 28, 2009 9:22 AM in response to TildeBee

OK, I backedup everything and reinstalled and updated to X.5.7: I am trying to reinstall software and the same thing is happening again: hangups, force quit doesnt work...is this just a bad HD that should be replaced?

I have checked console logs since reinstalling OS: which ones might be helpful?

Message was edited by: pomme-homme

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Answer 9

TildeBee

Level 7

31,923 points

May 28, 2009 9:26 AM in response to pomme-homme

pomme --
I know you're upset . . .
So take a deep breath, OK?

1. Note when the hangs happen.
Then go into the Console log, and copy and paste
what it says between the startup that time, and the hangs.

2. Have you check RAM?????
3. What was added to deleted to your Mac before it started hanging?

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Answer 10

pomme-homme Author

Level 2

454 points

May 28, 2009 9:54 AM in response to TildeBee

Thanks..I was looking for a gun to shoot the computer...

It just hung on shutdown and I had to hold the start button to shut it down. I restarted, got the gray apple scre

en with the timer, then a short blue screen, then a black screen. Restarted again with the start button in single user mode, ran fsck -fy, got the message that the volume was OK but that the file system had been modified. Exited anyway and it started up. Here is the console log around the time that the shutdown process hung up. I am doing this on my laptop...am going to shutdown the G5 now and check the RAM.

May 28 09:37:56 Macintosh loginwindow[38]: DEAD_PROCESS: 0 console
May 28 09:37:56 Macintosh kextd[24]: WARNING: /System/Library/Extensions: No such file or directory
May 28 09:37:56 Macintosh shutdown[253]: halt by bpressmd:
May 28 09:37:56 Macintosh shutdown[253]: SHUTDOWN_TIME: 1243528676 799076
May 28 09:37:56 Macintosh com.apple.loginwindow[38]: Shutdown NOW!
May 28 09:37:56 Macintosh mDNSResponder mDNSResponder-176.3 (Jan 27 2009 14:51:59)[37]: stopping
May 28 09:37:56 Macintosh com.apple.loginwindow[38]: System shutdown time has arrived^G^G
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Darwin Kernel Version 9.7.0: Tue Mar 31 22:54:29 PDT 2009; root:xnu-1228.12.14~1/RELEASE_PPC
May 28 09:39:55 localhost com.apple.launchctl.System[2]: fsck_hfs: Volume is journaled. No checking performed.
May 28 09:39:55 localhost com.apple.launchctl.System[2]: fsck_hfs: Use the -f option to force checking.
May 28 09:39:55 localhost com.apple.launchctl.System[2]: /dev/disk0s3 on / (hfs, local, journaled)
May 28 09:40:01 localhost com.apple.launchctl.System[2]: launchctl: Please convert the following to launchd: /etc/mach_init.d/dashboardadvisoryd.plist
May 28 09:40:01 localhost com.apple.launchd[1] (org.cups.cupsd): Unknown key: SHAuthorizationRight
May 28 09:40:01 localhost com.apple.launchd[1] (org.ntp.ntpd): Unknown key: SHAuthorizationRight
May 28 09:40:01 localhost com.apple.launchd[1] (org.x.privileged_startx): Unknown key for boolean: EnableTransactions
May 28 09:40:06 localhost fseventsd[30]: event logs in /.fseventsd out of sync with volume. destroying old logs. (1280 13 1410)
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: standard timeslicing quantum is 10000 us
May 28 09:40:06 localhost fseventsd[30]: log dir: /.fseventsd getting new uuid: C84D2D7B-E463-4BC2-8CCB-DB72CAC85A55
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: vm pagebootstrap: 1527658 free pages and 45206 wired pages
May 28 09:40:06 localhost rpc.statd[21]: statd.notify - no notifications needed
May 28 09:40:06 localhost bootlog[39]: BOOT_TIME: 1243528793 0
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: mig table_maxdispl = 79
May 28 09:40:06 localhost DirectoryService[35]: Launched version 5.7 (v514.25)
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: 110 prelinked modules
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Loading security extension com.apple.security.TMSafetyNet
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: calling mpo policyinit for TMSafetyNet
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Security policy loaded: Safety net for Time Machine (TMSafetyNet)
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Loading security extension com.apple.nke.applicationfirewall
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Loading security extension com.apple.security.seatbelt
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: calling mpo policyinit for mb
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Seatbelt MACF policy initialized
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Security policy loaded: Seatbelt Policy (mb)
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved.
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: MAC Framework successfully initialized
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: using 16384 buffer headers and 4096 cluster IO buffer headers
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: DART enabled
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: FireWire (OHCI) Apple ID 42 PCI now active, GUID 000d93fffeb872b0; max speed s800.
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: mbinit: done
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Security auditing service present
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: BSM auditing present
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: rooting via boot-uuid from /chosen: 15FA4399-9A32-38ED-882F-9ED3279B5871
May 28 09:40:06 localhost kernel[0]: Waiting on <dict ID="0"><key>IOProviderClass</key><string ID="1">IOResources</string><key>IOResourceMatch</key><string ID="2">boot-uuid-media</string></dict>
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: Got boot device = IOService:/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@7/IOPCI2PCIBridge/k2-sat a-root@C/AppleK2SATARoot/k2-sata@1/AppleK2SATA/ATADeviceNub@0/AppleATADiskDriver /IOATABlockStorageDevice/IOBlockStorageDriver/WDC WD6400AAKS-00A7B0 WDC WD6400AAKS-00A7B0/IOApplePartitionScheme/Untitled@3
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: BSD root: disk0s3, major 14, minor 3
May 28 09:40:06 localhost DirectoryService[35]: Improper shutdown detected
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: jnl: unknown-dev: replay_journal: from: 36379136 to: 38530560 (joffset 0x12a3000)
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: jnl: unknown-dev: journal replay done.
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kextd[12]: 422 cached, 0 uncached personalities to catalog
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: HFS: Removed 1 orphaned unlinked files or directories
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: Jettisoning kernel linker.
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: Resetting IOCatalogue.
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: Matching service count = 1
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: Matching service count = 6
May 28 09:40:07: --- last message repeated 1 time ---
May 28 09:40:07 localhost /System/Library/CoreServices/loginwindow.app/Contents/MacOS/loginwindow[26]: Login Window Application Started -- Threaded auth
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: Matching service count = 6
May 28 09:40:07: --- last message repeated 2 times ---
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: Matching service count = 7
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: NVDANV30HAL loaded and registered.
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: PowerMac7,3: stalling for module
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: PowerMac7 2U3TwinsPIDCtrlLoop::adjustControls state == not ready
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: IOPlatformControl::registerDriver Control Driver AppleSlewClock did not supply target-value, using default
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: Matching service count = 1
May 28 09:40:07 localhost kernel[0]: UniNEnet: Ethernet address 00:0d:93:b8:72:b0
May 28 09:40:11 localhost mDNSResponder mDNSResponder-176.3 (Jan 27 2009 14:51:59)[25]: starting
May 28 09:40:11 localhost /usr/sbin/ocspd[63]: starting
May 28 09:40:11 localhost kernel[0]: jnl: disk1s3: replay_journal: from: 4313600 to: 5042176 (joffset 0x17bcdf2000)
May 28 09:40:11 localhost kernel[0]: jnl: disk1s3: journal replay done.
May 28 09:40:11 localhost mds[24]: (/.Spotlight-V100/Store-V1/Stores/A04B985F-6276-43FE-98E9-7C4B86AAC153)(Error) IndexCI in ContentIndexOpenBulk:Unclean shutdown of /.Spotlight-V100/Store-V1/Stores/A04B985F-6276-43FE-98E9-7C4B86AAC153/live.1.; needs recovery
May 28 09:40:12 localhost fseventsd[30]: event logs in /Volumes/Secondary 160 GB HD/.fseventsd out of sync with volume. destroying old logs. (1272 1 1403)
May 28 09:40:12 localhost fseventsd[30]: log dir: /Volumes/Secondary 160 GB HD/.fseventsd getting new uuid: 9A64CD1B-4190-4FEA-B640-D6F51549FB91
May 28 09:40:12 localhost mDNSResponder[25]: Adding registration domain bpressmd.members.mac.com.
May 28 09:40:13 localhost kernel[0]: UniNEnet::monitorLinkStatus - Link is up at 100 Mbps - Full Duplex (PHY regs 5,6:0x45e1,0x0005)
May 28 09:40:13 Macintosh configd[37]: setting hostname to "Macintosh.local"
May 28 09:40:48 Macintosh kextd[12]: IOKitWaitQuiet() timed out waiting to write kernel symbols
May 28 09:40:58 Macintosh kextd[12]: writing kernel link data to /var/run/mach.sym
May 28 09:41:06 Macintosh kextd[12]: WARNING: /System/Library/Extensions: No such file or directory
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: timed out waiting for IOKit to quiesce
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: Busy services :
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3 [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000 [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5 [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge/firew ire@E [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge/firew ire@E/AppleFWOHCI [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge/firew ire@E/AppleFWOHCI/IOFireWireController [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge/firew ire@E/AppleFWOHCI/IOFireWireController/IOFireWireDevice@d04b6b1d032da2 [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge/firew ire@E/AppleFWOHCI/IOFireWireController/IOFireWireDevice@d04b6b1d032da2/IOFireWir eUnit [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge/firew ire@E/AppleFWOHCI/IOFireWireController/IOFireWireDevice@d04b6b1d032da2/IOFireWir eUnit/IOFireWireSBP2Target [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge/firew ire@E/AppleFWOHCI/IOFireWireController/IOFireWireDevice@d04b6b1d032da2/IOFireWir eUnit/IOFireWireSBP2Target/IOFireWireSBP2LUN [1]
May 28 09:41:08 Macintosh configd[37]: InterfaceNamer: PowerMac7,3/MacRISC4PE/ht@0,f2000000/AppleMacRiscHT/pci@5/IOPCI2PCIBridge/firew ire@E/AppleFWOHCI/IOFireWireController/IOFireWireDevice@d04b6b1d032da2/IOFireWir eUnit/IOFireWireSBP2Target/IOFireWireSBP2LUN/com apple_driver_Oxford_SemiFW912 [1]
May 28 09:41:17 Macintosh kextd[12]: WARNING: /System/Library/Extensions: No such file or directory
May 28 09:41:24 Macintosh mdworker[67]: (Error) SyncInfo: Boot-cache avoidance timed out!

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Answer 11

May 28, 2009 10:25 AM in response to pomme-homme

When you reinstalled the OS, did you reformat/repartition the drive? If you didn't, do an 'Erase and Install' installation. Make sure that you have backed up all of your files to a second internal or external drive prior to doing this. Why? This line in the log:

May 28 09:41:06 Macintosh kextd12: WARNING: /System/Library/Extensions: No such file or directory

indicates that there is something wrong with the file system on the drive. It could be caused by bad sectors on the physical disk. If you 'Erase and Install', the system files may be placed in a different location than the bad sectors. This could result in other strange behavior however. If it does, replace the disk.

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Answer 12

pomme-homme Author

Level 2

454 points

May 28, 2009 10:36 AM in response to Mabel O'Farrell

When I reinstalled, I did an Erase and Install after backing up all my files (not applications) from my original install disks from the G5 (Tiger.) I then upgraded to Leopard and to 10.5.7 with the combo updater. It is looking to me like the hard disk is failing. Is there anything to suggest something simpler?

I did check the RAM. It is all seated well.

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Answer 13

May 28, 2009 11:37 AM in response to pomme-homme

Hi Pomme,

You have described the same problems I am having. It is horrible isn't it. I have so far used drive genius and it would appear my drive is ok, I've run Rember as suggested on the thread I started http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2018112&tstart=0 and my memory is fine apparently. This behaviour seems to only affect me though strat after start up. once the mac has wamred up (just like this oxandspoon's post http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2018986&tstart=30 ) maybe 2nd or third attempt my machine seems to run ok. I've recently done a fresh install after securely erasing a 7 pass take on my system drive and the problem still persists. I am using a Mac pro and have 4 internal hard drives so I will Back up one of the other drives and do a fresh reinstall to one of these drives. Alternatively, I could wipe my current system drive and install an earlier version of leopard or even tiger to see if these problems are disk related or not. What does everyone think...

Thanks

Pete

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Answer 14

May 28, 2009 11:47 AM in response to pomme-homme

You can check the S.M.A.R.T. status of the disk using SMARTreporter. It probably won't tell you much more than you already know now.

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Answer 15

pomme-homme Author

Level 2

454 points

May 28, 2009 1:27 PM in response to A son of Mr.E

I just installed Leopard on my old 160GB hard disk (on the same machine) with an erase and install...I had the same thought you did. Will see if behavior is the same on another hard disk...

Disk Warrior SMART revealed no problems.

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