Q: Firmware update and SATA II hard drive

katmeef wrote:

syd-@69 wrote:
I wont try to upgrade to 1.7 again, even after have installed de performance update, since it doesn't seem to solve the problem according to the posts in this forum.

Really? Performance update solved it for me - and a number of previous posters. Based on the reduction of volume of posts in this thread, likely quite a few others, too... Might be worth trying, worst case you can downgrade again (and maybe even take your macbook in to an apple store to get checked out)

^^^ I cannot deny it any longer, I take this back... After discovering a newfound love for hellanzb (which manifested itself in a 100+GB newsgroup download binge over the past few days)... I no longer feel PU resolved the problem for me.

The beachballing seemed better for a while under normal usage; however, since the downloading binge it's really pronounced now.

(btw I've had hella installed for over a month, only bought a new stack of DVD+R DL last week. point being I don't think hella or macports is contributing to the problem)

Guess I'll be taking the drive out and setting back to 1.5Gb/s again, the apple store's too far away and I don't want to risk running the leaked efi 1.6 downgrade available online for any length of time...

Robert Gulyas wrote:
DaGangsta:

Best of luck to you!

However, the issue is with the SADA // 7200 RPM 3.0 gps 3rd party HDs--like my 500 GB Seagate:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but this issue has nothing to do with 7200 rpm drives. It's all about SATA II controller issues after 1.7 was released. Any SATA II (3.0 Gb/s) drive can potentially be impacted, be it 5400, 7200, or SSD drives

I am quite sure there are a number of people posting in this thread affected by the problem with SSD drives. Which don't spin at any RPM

@katmeef

Guess I'll be taking the drive out and setting back to 1.5Gb/s again, the apple store's too far away and I don't want to risk running the leaked efi 1.6 downgrade available online for any length of time...

you mean it's not recommended to do the rollback itself ? why ?

-----

I have a june 2009 15", 2.53 Ghz Macbook Pro, than came in with a fujitsu 250 GB 5400 rpm drive.

I wanted a faster HD, I'v tried the following drives :
Seagte Momentus 7200.3 (320 gb - 7200 rpm)
Seagate Moment 7200.4 (320 gb - 7200 rpm)
Hitachi Travelstar 7K320 S-ATA II (250 gb - 7200 rpm)

None of these drives were working on my Mac (I/O errors, Beachball issue, Mac OS X installation failure etc…)

So my questions :

I never applied the EFI 1.7 update, my mac came directly with it, will I be able to rollback to EFI 1.6 ?

If you buy a june 2009 15" or 13" Macbook Pro with a 7200 rpm, why it's working ? what drives use apple in 7200 rpm that are working in their june 2009 MBP ?

Hi, the Hitachi hdd does work. You must dl the hitachi feature tools and configure the Firmware of HDD to run with sata 1.5 .
Sata 3.0 doesn't support. I think the cable between hdd and chip is the problem.
sorry for my bad english...

Shifty08 wrote:
@katmeef

Guess I'll be taking the drive out and setting back to 1.5Gb/s again, the apple store's too far away and I don't want to risk running the leaked efi 1.6 downgrade available online for any length of time...

you mean it's not recommended to do the rollback itself ? why ?

If you can get Apple to do it, no problem. If you're doing it yourself with the leaked rollback tool, you're taking a risk (which I'm not willing to take)

Raptor25 wrote:
Hi, the Hitachi hdd does work. You must dl the hitachi feature tools and configure the Firmware of HDD to run with sata 1.5 .
Sata 3.0 doesn't support. I think the cable between hdd and chip is the problem.
sorry for my bad english...

x2, for those of us lucky enough to have a Hitachi drive which can be downgraded out of this beachball he11...

Also, along with setting it to 1.5 Gb/s in the feature tool, don't forget to disable the other feature which is presented as well (something along the lines of spread spectrum clocking or something...)

Message was edited by: katmeef

I did the roolback myself twice. It is simple and I had no problem at all.

syd-@69 wrote:
I did the roolback myself twice. It is simple and I had no problem at all.

You trust that the rollback image hasn't been modified by anyone after being leaked by apple? Maybe i'm just paranoid... but I'd rather downgrade my drive to SATA I than the firmware (if apple released the rollback tool online officially, I would have no problems doing it myself)

Yes, it's right, i've forgotten the name of the feature.
Spread Spectrum Clock must been disabled too.
So that is ( i think ) the reason, we can't buy any hgst hdd in germany with 7k2 upm. The Hitachi have the feature, to clock down the sata speed.
The Hitachi are for 24/7 hours/days made, they are the best in laptop use.
The HDD's sold with the mbp's ever where SATA 1.5 HDD's, science users make trouble with the port setting by firmware of the mid09 mbp's and the sata speed, apple launch firmware 1.7 so the problems begin's. Science User's buy unsupported HDD's with 7k2 or 5k4 upm, they have problem's with to high sata port speed. Apple say', they support only sata 1.5. A closer look into the datasheet of every hdd can clear the compability of each hdd as samsung, wdc or seagate; for SSD's too.

Message was edited by: Raptor25

With all the experimentation I have done I have done the 1.6 rollback myself a lot of times. It has caused no problems. If I had to go to an Apple store every time I needed something I would be broke from buying gasoline.

Can anyone show where the 'leaked" rollback tool has caused anyone any kind of problem? Or is it only paranoia?

Gregory Mcintire wrote:
Can anyone show where the 'leaked" rollback tool has caused anyone any kind of problem? Or is it only paranoia?

It's not that it will cause problems, it's that if it does, you're S.O.L.

I've used the rollback tool myself, and I believe it to be genuine (not messed with by 'baddies'). But I did so with the complete understanding and acceptance that any problems that might arise (and there can be some serious problems when flashing firmware) would be completely on my head — i.e., Apple's warranty would not apply.

If someone is uncomfortable taking that responsibility, then I fully support them not doing the rollback themselves. In fact, my general recommendation to everyone is to let Apple do it. That way, if something goes wrong (keep in mind a firmware flashing problem may require a complete logic board replacement), they have to fix it on their dime.

Shifty08:



+I never applied the EFI 1.7 update, my mac came directly with it, will I be able to rollback to EFI 1.6 ?+



Response:

Yes you should be able to modify the MB Pro--just use the roll back tool. The site location of this roll back was posted recently on this discussion thread.

This may be the same roll back that Apple uses at their Apple Stores.

If you can--check with Apple Care first.

I had to have my 500 GB SATA // HD removed first and then the roll back was applied from an external HD. Then the Seagate SATA // HD was re-installed in the MB Pro and I did the performance Update 1.0.

The Genius locked out the EFI 1.7 Firmware updater for me.

Apparently the Firmware roll back may write to the logic board--and not the drive. The Apple Genius tried it with the Drive installed and he had issues. It was only successfully done when he removed the HD and installed it from an externally connected HD.


Now all is OK.



+If you buy a june 2009 15" or 13" Macbook Pro with a 7200 rpm, why it's working ? what drives use apple in 7200 rpm that are working in their june 2009 MBP ?+

Response:

Because Apple had them configured differently to avoid this problem if you purchase them directly from them.

It is only when these are larger HDs are purchased as 3rd party HDs can you run into this issue.

Now some suppliers have apparently adjusted the configuration--but SEGATE AND W/D did not have these larger capacity HD reconfigured for the larger capacity stock drives.

I have my Seagate SATA // HD details here:

Capacity: 465.76 GB
Model: ST9500420ASG
Revision: 0002SDM1

My factory supplied Hitachi 250 GB HD which came from Apple as an OEM HD has these details when I have it installed in a MacAlly enclosure:

Manufacturer: PI-145
Model: 0x540
GUID: 0x101005403D819F
Maximum Speed: Up to 400 Mb/sec
Connection Speed: Up to 400 Mb/sec
Sub-units:
1394/USB20 Drive Unit:
Unit Software Version: 0x10483
Unit Spec ID: 0x609E
Firmware Revision: 0x265
Product Revision Level: 2.65
Sub-units:
1394/USB20 Drive SBP-LUN:
*Capacity: 232.89 GB*
*Removable Media: Yes*
*BSD Name: disk2*
*Mac OS 9 Drivers: No*
*Partition Map Type: APM (Apple Partition Map)*
*S.M.A.R.T. status: Not Supported*
Volumes:
*Leopard Universal Boot:*
*Capacity: 220.76 GB*
*Available: 171.27 GB*
*Writable: Yes*
*File System: Journaled HFS+*
*BSD Name: disk2s3*
*Mount Point: /Volumes/Leopa*

I hope this helps you and the rest out there coping with this issue.

bobg

katmeef

+Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but this issue has nothing to do with 7200 rpm drives. It's all about SATA II controller issues after 1.7 was released. Any SATA II (3.0 Gb/s) drive can potentially be impacted, be it 5400, 7200, or SSD drives+

+I am quite sure there are a number of people posting in this thread affected by the problem with SSD drives. Which don't spin at any RPM+

Response:

I can only speak form my personal experience of someone who has their MB Pro locked up 3 different times with this EFI 1.7.

As soon as I had it back rolled to EFI 1.6 and installed the Performance Update, all issues were resolved.

This was with my SATA // 3rd party Seagate HD.

bobg

Fishbert, Firstly, please understand I mean absolutely no disrespect to your opinion or anyone else's for what I am going to say. It is just another way of looking at this situation.

I completely understand your position and it makes good sense for many of us. But for me for instance it is quite a drive to go to an Apple Store. If I had to drive there every time I had a new idea with regard to getting my SSD to work on my 15" MBP I simply could not experiment.

Too, we are not talking abut life and death, at least in my case. I paid $1600 for the computer and I keep it backed up on two separate external drives. My older stuff even exists on some old SCSI drives for that matter. The odds of the rollback being destructive weighed against the possible harm it can do me is low in my opinion. Also, I never keep bank account numbers, S.S. card numbers etc on any computer, ever. I feel that it is far more safe for me to risk this 1.6 rollback than it is to drive to work every day.

My computer is a convenience to me and it is entertainment to me. My livelihood does not depend on it.

One last thing. The Apple store near me has never heard of the rollback or the whole issue until I told them about it. They still do not have a rollback tool. Without the firmware rollback that I found on the web I could not be using my SSD.

I am just saying that we all have different situations. I am the boss of my computer, it does not control me, nor does Apple. If I am curious about some element of the hardware inside my computer I take it apart and look at it. I don't care about warranty's. Again, this is because it is my computer, not Apple's. Life is too short to let our material things boss us around. Just one man's opinion and I realize it is not the opinion of the majority.

Robert Gulyas wrote:

The Genius locked out the EFI 1.7 Firmware updater for me.

Apparently the Firmware roll back may write to the logic board--and not the drive. The Apple Genius tried it with the Drive installed and he had issues. It was only successfully done when he removed the HD and installed it from an externally connected HD.

Anybody can lock out any software update so you don't keep getting it to show up every time you check for updates. There is a place in the update menu to do that.

The firmware rollback MUST write to the logic board, not the hard drive. It is firmware. Normally there is no need to remove any hard drive in order for the rollback to work. This is the first I have heard of that.