Q: MacBook Pro Battery 'Service Battery' after Snow Upgrade

rkovelman wrote:
Don,

Again what you perceive is full is actually not. As the battery degrades or fails the battery able to with hold the power goes down. Am I to assume these batteries are also around the same age?

Again, I have had a bad battery in 10.5 and in 10.6 and both times replaced and fixed the issue. 10.5 does not display the bad battery as it does in 10.6 but the same error is in system profiler.

Hi rkovelman,

The two new batteries are both under 50 cycles count. They're both under 4 months old. They're each good for 20-30 minutes. It's sounding like Snow Leopard is hosing the chip on the battery, so both the green indicator light and menu icon show the battery is low when it's actually not. Just a guess.

When I bought the second battery, I was convinced the issue was resolved...a few days later the same thing happened. Rinse, lather and repeat for the third battery.

Don

The internal chip is can only be changed by a flash program not by an OS. If the battery showed full and the OS said low that be an OS issue. In this case they both report the same thing, low on the battery itself and low from the OS level. This is why I say its battery related and not OS related.

I admire your resolve, but if this is a battery failure, as you maintain, and not an OS related issue, then we're talking about product failure on an epic scale. Realistically that should spark a recall, Apple should be more then thrilled to replace the batteries since they are as faulty as you imply.

But the opposite is happening, Apple is refusing to replace the batteries, sometimes, even if the battery is under AppleCare, citing "Normal Usage".

If I follow your thinking, in this thread, I'm left to believe that there are two errors here:

1. The Sony Battery is indeed faulty.
2. Leopard overlooked the faults in the Sony Battery, allowing it to perform properly.
3. Snow Leopard is more strict about battery usage and doesn't allow the Sony Battery to perform properly.

All in all, if this is solely a battery failure issue, then this is one huge coincidence that all of these batteries are failing almost at the exact same time, and also a coincidence that Snow Leopard was involved.

I don't buy it. Buying a new battery, at this point, is just throwing money into the garbage.

Regardless, Apple needs to release a formal statement acknowledging the problem and ways to resolve it.

rkovelman wrote:
The internal chip is can only be changed by a flash program not by an OS. If the battery showed full and the OS said low that be an OS issue. In this case they both report the same thing, low on the battery itself and low from the OS level. This is why I say its battery related and not OS related.

I'm sorry, but I can't buy that. We have hundreds of MacBook Pro users traveling the globe. The majority of our early MacBook Pro users who we've upgraded to Snow Leopard are having this problem. Battery life drastically reduced, just from upgrading the OS. I see your point, about the battery chip only being effected by a flash upgrade, but there's clearly an issue related to Snow Leopard. Not one of our Leopard users are having a problem. We've stopped upgrading users, at least until Apple resolves this issue.

Don

I am guessing you were not around for this issue with the PowerBooks. Also Apple does not do Recalls they call them Support Extensions, as its up to the consumer to either fill in the forms to get a replacement. The last extension on the Powerbooks took a LOOONG time to happen. Again Apple does NOT make the batteries, Sony does. Apple in the past has done a voluntary extension with the batteries and took the heat until Sony officially said this was our mistake. I think Apple is working with Sony to resolve this. Again I stated before look at the Dell and IBM forums they always have battery issues, and LI-ION is owned by Sony.

In regards to OS, 10.6 showed more issues because the OS is, I feel, more power dependent from my research. 64 OS's typically run faster as the processors can mathematically process more data. While this occurs you need more power, hence why 10.5 did not see this issue. I am sure 10.6 has other things occurring making battery use happen more often putting more strain on the battery but either way a battery at 60 cycles should be fine. Sure Apple can do some tweaking but the FIX is in the battery. As a IT professional I want fixes not bandages.

rkovelman wrote:
In regards to OS, 10.6 showed more issues because the OS is, I feel, more power dependent from my research. 64 OS's typically run faster as the processors can mathematically process more data. While this occurs you need more power, hence why 10.5 did not see this issue.

The Snow Leopard users we have who are having this issue are early (pre-64 capable) MacBook Pro users.

Don

Actually I'm on my 5th Apple Laptop, starting with the Black Clam Shell PowerBook.

As a consumer I want my failed battery to be replaced, not told that its considered "normal wear" despite having Apple Care.

If, as you say, there are "Support Extensions", I'm extremely disappointed that Apple didn't present this option when they tested my battery.

I'm still not convinced that this is solely a Battery Issue, given my experience with Apple and OS/hardware related glitches, I tend to think that Software bugs are involved. Especially given some of the testimony in this thread about Sony and Non-Sony batteries failing rather quickly (in one case within days of purchase).

All in all, the take away from your argument is the same as mine:

Don't buy a replacement battery until Apple officially addresses this issue, otherwise you're ******* your money away.

Message was edited by: Johnny Storm

rkovelman wrote:
I think Apple is working with Sony to resolve this. Again I stated before look at the Dell and IBM forums they always have battery issues, and LI-ION is owned by Sony.

I don't care about Dell, IBM or any other laptop manufacturer out there. I have a MBP that's on its second battery that has gone defective (again), and I was told that I have to buy a new one because they are refusing to replace it. I also don't care who made the battery, bottom line is that Apple is the point person for providing support to the customer. If we're having problems with these Sony batteries, we're not supposed to go thru Sony support for resolution but instead thru Apple support.

I was treated like total garbage on the phone yesterday, so much so that I am thinking about never buying another Apple product ever again. I'm so steamed right now about it all, and it's a shame that such a gorgeous product is backed up by the rudest support technicians and customer relations personnel. Instead of offering to replace the battery at no cost to me, I was first offered to buy it new for $129 and then later at their "cost" price of $112. Oooh, saving me $17 is really going to make me a happy customer. Sorry, I don't buy it.

In the end, I did end up buying an aftermarket battery from Amazon for $60, I'll use that for a while but will probably sell my MBP. What I buy to replace it will be the big question for me, as I'm still in love with Apple products but not the support they provide.

If its any consolation, my unibody MBP hasn't had any of the issues that my Last Gen MBP has had battery-wise.

I've booked a Genius session for Monday to get the battery looked at. I've found they tend to be far fairer than the phone support people.

This is my 2nd battery, the first displayed this problem very early on with Snow Leopard and was replaced free of charge as it only has 190 cycles on it. I didn't worry as it was 2 years old. Now the replacement has gone bad in the same way but it's only a few months old and has 55 cycles.

This is a 2007 MacBook Pro which seems to be the model experiencing the problems.

I'll post how I get on.

Johnny Storm wrote:
If its any consolation, my unibody MBP hasn't had any of the issues that my Last Gen MBP has had battery-wise.

Johnny,

Our group have several hundred Unibody MacBook Pro users running around the globe who aren't having the problem either.

Don

don montalvo wrote:

rkovelman wrote:
In regards to OS, 10.6 showed more issues because the OS is, I feel, more power dependent from my research. 64 OS's typically run faster as the processors can mathematically process more data. While this occurs you need more power, hence why 10.5 did not see this issue.

The Snow Leopard users we have who are having this issue are early (pre-64 capable) MacBook Pro users.

That would be myself, and again a new battery resolved the issue. I have a Core Duo 2.0

Don

rkovelman wrote:

don montalvo wrote:

rkovelman wrote:
In regards to OS, 10.6 showed more issues because the OS is, I feel, more power dependent from my research. 64 OS's typically run faster as the processors can mathematically process more data. While this occurs you need more power, hence why 10.5 did not see this issue.

The Snow Leopard users we have who are having this issue are early (pre-64 capable) MacBook Pro users.

That would be myself, and again a new battery resolved the issue. I have a Core Duo 2.0

Don

I have a Core Duo 1.83 and I'm on my second new battery in just a few months. So one battery that used to give me 2 hours now gives me 20-30 minutes. Both of the new batteries also now only give me 20-30 minutes apiece. What's happening to me is more in line with the widespread reports of Snow Leopard upgrade negatively effecting battery life.

Don

rkovelman wrote:

That would be myself, and again a new battery resolved the issue. I have a Core Duo 2.0

Until that one dies.

Add me to the list of those experiencing battery troubles since the SL install... I have a MacbookPro late 2008 model. I started receiving the "service battery" within days of the SL install and my battery performance dropped from 98% to under 50% and decreased operating time to under 1.5 hours. Now it seems with every cycle the battery health drops and the % left fluctuates dramatically. These issues began at only 46 cycles (I am currently on 50).

My battery was operating as smooth as the day I bought it (OCT 2008) prior to installing SL and I will not believe for one second that the battery itself is to blame; this is clearly a software and/or firmware issue! Over 50 pages of similar complaints and not one statement from Apple?? I demand an explanation before I shell out $110 for a new battery!

Next option: install Leopard on an external drive and go from there...

My Specs:

Hardware Overview:

Model Name: MacBook Pro
Model Identifier: MacBookPro4,1
Processor Name: Intel Core 2 Duo
Processor Speed: 2.4 GHz
Number Of Processors: 1
Total Number Of Cores: 2
L2 Cache: 3 MB
Memory: 6 GB
Bus Speed: 800 MHz

Battery Information:

Model Information:
Manufacturer: Sony
Device name: ASMB012
Pack Lot Code: 0000
PCB Lot Code: 0000
Firmware Version: 0110
Hardware Revision: 0500
Cell Revision: 0303
Charge Information:
Charge remaining (mAh): 1126
Fully charged: No
Charging: No
Full charge capacity (mAh): 2621
Health Information:
Cycle count: 50
Condition: Check Battery
Battery Installed: Yes
Amperage (mA): -1201
Voltage (mV): 11187