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Snow Leopard changed the brightness range of MBP 13" ?

This is my question : after a clean install of Snow Leopard on my MacBook Pro 13" (9CC2 panel), it seems that Snow Leopard definitely change the brightness range on the MacBook Pro 13" !

The range was much "wider" with Leopard, and allow me to set brightness to a dimmer level...
Now, the brightness is on the bright side, and can't be set really dim (not as far as before...).
And that's not great for my battery life!

Any other experience with MacBook Pro 13" brightness settings ?
Hope Apple will fix that as soon as possible...

Bests from France,
Nicolas

MacBook Pro 13" 2.53Ghz, Mac OS X (10.6)

Posted on Sep 2, 2009 3:05 PM

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Posted on Sep 2, 2009 3:13 PM

See this:
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3712
112 replies

Sep 2, 2009 3:28 PM in response to A A P L

Thanks!

In fact, it seems to be more related to real brightness setting, more than gamma setting. The problem is the same with Apple default setting, or with some calibrated profiles I've made with a Spyder2: it remains the same in gamma 1.8 or 2.2...

My feeling is that's really related to the brightness range setting for the display. But maybe this only occurs with the 9CC2 panel?

Indeed, Snow Leopard is unable to offer the usual standard profile for this particular panel: it seems to be a bug.

Sep 2, 2009 3:40 PM in response to A A P L

Well, not sure my english is good enough, but I have at home my MacBook Pro 13" (9CC2) and my brother's one (9CC2 too).

Both laptop are set a the same visual level of brightness: the Snow leopard one (my own MBP) is a level 1, but my brother's one is set at level 8 (but both show same brightness).

When both are set to level 1, my brother's one is really (really!) less bright (but less power eater).
When both are set to level 16, they show the same max level of brightness (logical, it's the same panel!)

Hope my explanations are better to explain this specific problem?

Thanks! 🙂

Sep 2, 2009 3:44 PM in response to NiCOOo

It's tough to compare two units unless they've been calibrated and have a clean OS installed.
Your English is fine, BTW.
The best I can offer is to use the Advanced option in the Color tab of the Displays preferences.
Do a calibration as best as possible, make sure all settings are the same, and compare.
If you feel the one unit is not bright enough, maybe it should be brought to the store you purchased it to have a look.
You could also try booting both from the DVD that they shipped with, and compare that way.
It should be the same, as the disks should also be the same.
Might help clear it up.

Scott

Sep 2, 2009 3:56 PM in response to A A P L

Thanks Scott!

Well, I'm using gamma 2.2 since many years now (I use Spyder2 Pro and ColorEyes software to calibrate).

This is Snow Leopard related I think, since both computers use the same profile (custom 2.2, 6500K). But since there is a bug with 9CC2 panels (SL doesn't recognize this panel, and offer an horrible default profile!), maybe that's also related to that?

I think about it, cause I've met a similar situation a few month ago. I used to have a MacBook unibody 13" (late 2008), and I've bought a brand new MacBook Pro 13" (mid 2009).
I've cloned my 2008 MacBook to my brand new 2009 MacBook Pro, and there was that kind of problem. Then, I decided to install the OSX version that come with the 2009 model (it was a slightly different 10.5.7 build), and everything comes back to normal: brightness adjustment was fine again....

So, the actual situation with Snow Leopard looks the same: not hardware related (panel is fine!), not profile related (I use 2.2 6500K Spyder2 profiles...), but more "system" related.

But, maybe I'm wrong?

Anyway, if some others have the same problem with a MBP 13" (9CC2 panel) and Snow Leopard, let me know!!!

Sep 2, 2009 4:23 PM in response to Gary Sumlak

Yes, I'm talking about backlight level: you can set it from the F1-F2 keys, or with the control panel preferences, as you want.

I think on 9CC2 panel, Snow Leopard set it's minimum brightness for level (1) too high (approx level 8 on other displays), but the max brightness (level 16) is the same, since that the panel "hardware" limitation: it's own max level.

I'd love to talk about it with an Apple tech, with a MBP 13" 9CC2 panel.

Sep 2, 2009 9:01 PM in response to NiCOOo

I'm having the same issue. I just updated to Snow Leopard yesterday and now my 13" MBP seems way too bright. The first "notch" of brightness (adjusted using the function keys) seems roughly equivalent to the halfway point pre-Snow Leopard. Turning the brightness all the way up is almost blinding. Adjusting the gamma doesn't have any effect.

Sep 3, 2009 12:48 AM in response to uriaha

uriaha wrote:
I'm having the same issue. I just updated to Snow Leopard yesterday and now my 13" MBP seems way too bright.


The first "notch" of brightness (adjusted using the function keys) seems roughly equivalent to the halfway point pre-Snow Leopard. Turning the brightness all the way up is almost blinding.


It may be that your previous calibration was not the Leo default, and SL reset your display settings to default levels, which seems considerably brighter to what you were use to. This would include the calibration for 100% White and 100% Black

Adjusting the gamma doesn't have any effect.


You are correct. The brightest white will NOT be affected by gamma. The reason is, is that gamma refers to the gray mid-point (50% white).

Gamma is the point where gray should be half way between 0-black and 255-white so that the gray levels of a monitor are smooth throughout the brightness range. However, the problem is that gamma only adjusts the 50% white, where actually proper calibration requires setting at least 10 gray levels (i.e. 10% white, 20% white... 90% white, 100% white). In your case, the problem is probably that the upper gray points (over 50% white) are skewed too close to the mid-point, and further away from 100% white (or 100% white is skewed left so the 100% white is remapped to what should be 90% white) causing an inappropriate larger range of the screen being drawn as white, or whiter. So, adjusting the 50% point does very little to the 60%... 90% white points, and you see no change to the brightness of the monitor.

And to complicate matters even more, all monitors have different brightness/color response curves; even the same model may change curves between production batches.

In addition, each OS has its own interpretation of what the proper gamma setting is, based on how the OS displays a screen. i.e. Mac OS 10.6 has a setting of 2.2, where Windows is 1.6 (I think) because Windows draws the screen just slightly darker than Mac OS, and has to compensate with a lower gamma to brighten the display. Previous version of Max OS had gamma at 1.8 (according to tech notes).

re A A P L previous post:
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3712

Linux has yet another gamma because it draws the screen differently than either Windows or Mac OS.

It is also possible that the screen drawing algorithm has changed with SL, but for me, gamma seems about the same as before, just the overall brightness changed a bit, which was corrected by recalibration with the hueyPRO.

The easiest way to illustrate what gamma is, is to see the results when you use the Levels layer effect in Photoshop. The middle adjuster is analogous to the gamma. Move it closer to the black and the overall picture gets brighter (which decreases contrast and lightens dark areas, but brings out detail in the shadows); move it closer to 255 white and the overall picture gets darker (which brings out detail in the lighter areas, but shadows get darker or black). You will also notice if you bring the 100% white point to the left, you will blow out the image without affecting 50% white and 0% white (black). And conversely, moving the black point right, the image gets darker without changing whites.

Regardless of whether you move the mid-point left or right, the blackest possible and the whitest possible parts of the image do not change. This is the same for the gamma monitor setting.

Proper calibration, using a Colorimeter or manually, is supposed to set the proper 0% white (black), 100% white, 50% white (gamma), multiple gray points and color response curves for the monitor.

Nicolas mentions that he uses a Spider 2 colorimeter, which should be able to properly calibrate the monitor, but seems to be falling short. It may take a couple runs for the Spider 2 to get it right. I use the hueyPRO on my MBP 17", but I made sure the brightness level was up full during calibration, otherwise, the colorimeter will try to set the pure white level to the wrong value.

After I calibrated my MBP at full brightness, I find that I will typically have my screen brightness set at 50%. I find it easier on the eyes. If I am actually doing color correction, I will bring the brightness back up to 100%.

A free tool I used before I got the hueyPRO is SuperCal. Through a series of guided visual tests, it allows you to "Visually" set the brightness, gamma, multiple gray points and colors levels. Not 100%, but it is easier to work with than Apple's Calibration tool IMO.

Color calibration is very complicated (yes, even more than my ramblings, and too much so for this discussion). If you download SuperCal and go through the calibration process, it will give you a better idea of how color and curves are set, and just how non-linear they are. Hopefully, you will also be able to get the monitor displaying to your liking as well.

OK, enough geek speak. To Much Information!! 😉

Hope this helps and Good Luck.
Gary

Sep 3, 2009 4:01 AM in response to Gary Sumlak

Thanks Gary, for this interesting feedback,

Regarding the backlight issue I'm having, it's clearly not gamma related. It's not a hardware problem neither, since my screen used to be able to dim much more on Leopard.

In fact, I'm pretty sure this is a Snow Leopard 10.6 problem: this version of the the OS doesn't recognize 9CC2 panels in MBP 13" (mid 2009). There is 2 consequences:

— the default profile (named "Display", and not "Color LCD") after a clean install is buggy: gamma isn't correct (blueish), and a good and calibrated gamma profile correct this issue, that's right.

— the range of brightness adjustment is perturbed, and the screen can't dim under a certain level of brightness equivalent to level 8 on other MBP 13" (and also equivalent to level 8 on 9CC2 model running Leopard).

Right now, the lower level is very bright, especially in a dark room for example, were I'd love to be able to dim the backlight more.

Another consecutive issue, is that the MBP is more power eater, since it's minimum backlight level is too high...

This particular issue (Brightness adjustment) is system related in my opinion. When Apple will correct this, we'll then be able to dim again the screen, as usual: hope they read this! 🙂

Sep 3, 2009 4:23 AM in response to NiCOOo

I'm not sure if this applies to you or not, but here is what I know:

Starting with 10.5.8 whenever the Mac is "restarted" the screen brilliance would always return to maximum even if it had been set to minimum prior to the restart. Apple engineers were aware of this problem and stated that it would be corrected in the next update.

However, with 10.6 this anomaly persists (Apple is aware).

For those wishing to keep the brilliance low (which, for me, is still too high) and survive through a restart, the temporary work-around is to use F1 to show only one bar on the graph. Do not reduce the illuminated bars to zero; it is important that just one shows.

Sep 3, 2009 4:56 AM in response to NiCOOo

Mmm, all quite perplexing.

You said you used a Profile created by a Spider2. Was that since upgrading to SL or prior? Although the article ref posted by A P P L says the old profile should still be valid, if you have not generated a new profile since installing SL, maybe try creating a new one.

If you don't have access to the Spider2, give SuperCal a try. Since the profile is just software, and does not matter what SL thinks the display is, only what you tell the calibration method, it does not matter with what the profile is generated: SL, Spyder2, hueyPRO or SuperCAL; you should be able to generate a new profile that will correct all the gray points - nothing really for Apple to fix. If the profile does not show in System Prefs, then uncheck the "Show profiles for this display only". If the profile was created properly, it will be on the list,

But, the more you describe the problem, the more it sounds like your 100% white is set too close to the black point, and the 0% white (black) is actually set to be in the gray tones, so that you can never achive 0% white while the display is on. As a reference, when you screen is off, the screen should look like what 0% white (black) should look like when the screen is on with a full range picture displayed. If black on the screen does not look "black", but a grayish tone, then you black level is off. This would absolutely prevent your screen from dimming as much as you are use to. If SL can not detect your display, it will use a generic profile that may or may not be appropriate for the screen (in your case not).

Using the F1 key, the very bottom setting should be "Screen Off". The very first step up (on mine) is about 10% lit (completely subjective guess). Still bright enough that I can easily read the display though.

Again, if you go through the profile setup manually with SuperCAL, you will see exactly what the brightness level curve is (you will actually see a graph). The process will only take a couple minutes and may point to a solution not previously considered.

Give it a try and get back with the results.

Good Luck
Gary

Sep 3, 2009 5:08 AM in response to Gary Sumlak

Gary Sumlak wrote:
Mmm, all quite perplexing.

You said you used a Profile created by a Spider2. Was that since upgrading to SL or prior? Although the article ref posted by A P P L says the old profile should still be valid, if you have not generated a new profile since installing SL, maybe try creating a new one.


Yes, tryed both solutions: an old profile, and a brand new one.

But, the more you describe the problem, the more it sounds like your 100% white is set too close to the black point, and the 0% white (black) is actually set to be in the gray tones, so that you can never achive 0% white while the display is on. As a reference, when you screen is off, the screen should look like what 0% white (black) should look like when the screen is on with a full range picture displayed. If black on the screen does not look "black", but a grayish tone, then you black level is off. This would absolutely prevent your screen from dimming as much as you are use to. If SL can not detect your display, it will use a generic profile that may or may not be appropriate for the screen (in your case not).


In fact, this is absolutely not related to profiles in my opinion. The problem is not color or white point issue, but clearly related to backlight range setting.

Using the F1 key, the very bottom setting should be "Screen Off". The very first step up (on mine) is about 10% lit (completely subjective guess). Still bright enough that I can easily read the display though.


That's right! But since Snow Leopard, and only with 9CC2 displays, the very first step is about 50% lit (subjective too)... Too bright for a first step 😉

Again, if you go through the profile setup manually with SuperCAL, you will see exactly what the brightness level curve is (you will actually see a graph). The process will only take a couple minutes and may point to a solution not previously considered.


I'll try this, but I'm pretty sure profiles can't do anything about the brightness range of the backlight for a display?

Good Luck


Thanks!

Snow Leopard changed the brightness range of MBP 13" ?

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