8 Replies Latest reply: Nov 11, 2009 7:50 AM by abeas
abeas Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
I just got the Panasonic AG-HMC150. I have shot some footage at both 1080p24 and 720p24. I transcode the files to Pro Res in FCP and they look pretty good, I realize the panning isn't as smooth as 60i. I drag one of the files into the FCP timeline and let it automatically "optimize my settings" for the sequence. I have verified that it is 23.98fps and field dominance is none. I have tried selecting "share" and going straight to AVCHD from FCP, and also taking the original MTS file, and Apple Pro Res and dropping into Toast and trying that way. The footage just looks choppy, jiddery and unsmooth. I have seen enough movies in my life to know that when they pan, or have cars drive by, that movies 24fps looks a million times better. My Sony HDTV even accepts and displays 24fps, and when I press info on the TV remote when watching one of these AVCHD discs it in fact says 1080 (or 720) 24p. It just looks bad. Even taking the HDMI output from the camera and hooking up to the TV and playing from the camera looks lousy.
What am I doing wrong? I know a ton of post work goes into Hollywood movies, but why does their 24fps look nice and smooth and mine looks horrible? Do I need to render with pulldown in FCP or something. I can't figure it out. Any advice, suggestions?

iMac 20" 2.4 4GB Ram, Mac Pro 2x2.8 14GB Ram, iPod Touch 32GB, Mac OS X (10.6.1)
  • Jerry Hofmann Level 9 Level 9 (53,940 points)
    Play around with shutter speeds when you're shooting fast action. It will crisp out the movement a bit. Pick higher ones than what you've been using so far. If you're camera doesn't have the option of changing shutter speeds, you'll need to slow down a ton with your camera movement and with what you're shooting to achieve the film look you're after.

    Jerry
  • abeas Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
    Jerry that's helpful. Actually, I have been shooting with the shutter off. That would obviously explain a lot. Even with the shutter off, the images seem ok on my computer monitor. It's playing them on the **** HDTVs either HDMI out of the camera or from a burnt AVCHD disc that are killing me.
  • Jerry Hofmann Level 9 Level 9 (53,940 points)
    Experiment with those speed, then play on your TV set until you find the right combo...

    Jerry
  • Patrick Sheffield Level 7 Level 7 (29,175 points)
    Are you creating a 24fps (23.98) output? Then building a 23.98 DVD in DVDSP? (That's what Hollywood movies do). How are you watching it? Your DVD player will automatically insert a pulldown (which many modern TVs remove).

    Patrick

  • abeas Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
    Patrick,
    I am making AVCHD discs. I have tried through toast and from the FCP share option. I log and transfer in FCP and it makes it a 23.98 frame rate (shot at 720p24). Field dominance is set to none. I watch the AVCHD discs on a PS3 connected via HDMI to a Sony Bravia LCD HDTV that display and accepts 24fps material.....I've watched blu-ray discs for the past year at 1080p24. I haven't tried to make a DVD of the material because I don't want to lose the HD resolution. Maybe I should try doing that. Perhaps there is a problem with AVCHD discs playing at 24fps.
  • Jerry Hofmann Level 9 Level 9 (53,940 points)
    I don't make these disks, (no PS3, though Santa is coming!) But I really don't think that the AVCHD disks would have a problem playing 23.98 material. I think it's those Shutter speeds you need to play around with. If you've seen "Gladiator" this is how they made the fast movement in the fight scenes not be juddery.

    The camera shoots 24pn. It has no pulldown, so don't think is a pulldown removal problem either because in 24pn, there are really only 24 full frames there...

    Jerry
  • wallybarthman Level 3 Level 3 (690 points)
    I can tell you for a fact that encoding inside of Toast will not get you a 1080p24 file - if Toats does the encoding it adds pulldown to get to 29.97 fps.

    Have you verified that when you make the AVCHD disc from FCP Share that the encoded frame rate is set to 23.98?

    On a side note, I know this can be done as I've encoded 1080p24 footage inside of Compressor and then authored and burned it inside of Toast and it looks fine.
  • abeas Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
    I transcode through FCP to apple pro res, the files shows up as 1920x1080 24fps. Field dominance is none. I edit the video and then export as quicktime movie using current settings. The Pro Res file says 23.98 when played in quicktime so I know that's good. I simply then drop the file into Toast (10.0.4) and burn blu-ray disc, selecting DVD as the media. I noticed too I need to change the field dominance under the encoding tab in Toast to progressive, as automatic doesn't work. It only burns the top half of the image. Regardless, when I make these discs and play them on PS3, my TV's info says 1080/24p. Maybe my eyes aren't use to seeing 24fps. Does it sound like I am doing anything wrong in my workflow/encoding process.
    Again, good tip on the shutter speed Jerry.