RAID & FCP Questions

Question

Level 1

8 points

RAID & FCP Questions

I have been having trouble with multicam editing of AVCHD material and have been advised that the reason for the problems is the speed of my drives and RAID is recommended. For more information on this discussion see:

http://discussions.apple.com/message.jspa?messageID=10545204#10545204

So, I am considering putting three 1.5TB Seagate Baracuda 7200rpm drives in slots 2, 3, 4 and create a RAID of the three drives to overcome the drive R/W speed issue and hopefully be able to label this drive as "H:" for the reasons stated below. However, some serious considerations:

1. I have nearly 800GB of FCP project data (media) on the drive that is currently in slot 2 - AMEDIA_1.
2. I would like to remove that drive AMEDIA_1 then mount it in an external drive USB case and copy it (AMEDIA_1) to the newly configured RAID drive bank (hopefully labeled as "H:" drive) to resolve the slow R/W drive access problems.

So, my questions are:

A. Will the media being read from AMEDIA_1 from an external case be stripped via the RAID 0 utility so that the data is spread across the three drives to circumvent the problem I'm currently having?
B. Any problems RAID'ing 1.5TB drives or should I limit it to 1.0TB?
C. Any problems with my idea here?
D. Will my FCP's recognize the path to the respective files and media assuming I am able to label the RAID bank as Drive H: ?
E. If a drive fails in the RAID bank is the entire bank dead and all data lost?
F. Is there any question I should be asking that I am not since I'm not that up to speed on Mac nor RAID yet?

Thanks in advance to those who take the time to read and respond to this lost sheep and feel free to ask any questions for clarification.

SYSTEM: MacPro 2.8GHz Xeon Quad Core x 2, Nvidia 8800 GT 512MB, 4GB Ram, 1667 FSB, Snow Leopard 10.6.1?, Final Cut Suite 3, 7200rpm 320GB OS HDD.

Additional Info & Question: If possible, I will want to remove the Windows XP Pro partition if that is possible at the same time.

MacBookPro & Mac Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.1), MBP Parrellels WinXP & MP BootCamp WinXP, FCS3 and Avid Liquid Pro

Posted on Nov 10, 2009 9:48 PM

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Answer 1

Nov 10, 2009 10:05 PM in response to Penn-Ohio

A. Yes - the media copied from external HD to RAID will be striped it striped RAID is setup.
B. No
C. No
D. Yes - reconnect media and apply reconnection to additional files in relative path if necessary.
E. Yes
F. Simply question C. reworded. Same answer applies.

Backup your media in case one of the RAID stripes fail after you have transcoded your AVCHD media to Apple Intermediate Codec or pro res for better realtime performance in FCP.

Additional answer: you can not remove a partition without completely erasing and reformatting the hard drive.

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Answer 2

Penn-Ohio Author

Level 1

8 points

Nov 10, 2009 10:22 PM in response to  Certified

 Certified wrote:.....>
Additional answer: you can not remove a partition without completely erasing and reformatting the hard drive.

"Certified" Thanks for the quick response.

Relative to this would there be an advantage for me to remove Windows? I mean I could just format (which I think is "erase") that partition (drive) right? and use if for data storage of regularly used clips (like show intros, etc.)

Lastly, currently my workflow for the AVCHD files are:

1. Copy the SDHC card to an external miniHDD in a folder
2. Copy the folder on the miniHDD to the MEDIA drive
3. Verify that the .mts files play on both drives
4. Put the SDHC card back in service
5. Edit the project & export
6. Archive to BluRay disc(s) - or most often - Delete all project folders

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Answer 3

Nov 10, 2009 10:39 PM in response to Penn-Ohio

would there be an advantage for me to remove Windows? I mean I could just format (which I think is "erase") that partition (drive) right? and use if for data storage of regularly used clips (like show intros, etc.)

If Windows partition is FAT32 and you reformat to the same format then the partition will be limited to copying 2gig files at a time. You are recommended to reformat the entire drive to OSX Journaled using Disk Utility.app on your Mac.

Like I said before, transcode your AVCHD media to AIC or pro res for better realtime performance FCP editing. You can backup the folder that contains the .mts files ( for backup purposes only) but you should always transcode the AVCHD format to AIC or pro res.

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Answer 4

Penn-Ohio Author

Level 1

8 points

Nov 10, 2009 10:35 PM in response to  Certified

 Certified wrote:....> If Windows partition is FAT32 and you reformat to the same format then the partition will be limited to copying 2gig files at a time. You are recommended to reformat the entire drive to OSX Journaled using Disk Utility.app on your Mac.

That partition should have been NTFS since that's what Windows requires I would think right? I do know how to use the Disk Utility I think but I been told that I should always use OSX Extended for formatting. Is that not correct?

 Certified wrote:....> Like I said before, transcode your AVCHD media to AIC or pro res for better realtime performance FCP editing.

Somewhere I missed the AIC; what's that? Somehow all I been hearing is to do pro res hq. Also, with three streams I am unable to edit three camera shoots which are about 80+% of my productions so that is why I'm going to RAID and stripping to speed the R/W speed up which the RAID should take care of right?

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Answer 5

Nov 10, 2009 10:42 PM in response to Penn-Ohio

It would seem as though you require additional research and understanding. I advise you to do some reading up on the terms mentioned both here and in the original long-winded thread you linked to in your first post.

AIC = Apple Intermediate Codec. It's an acronym often used when rewriting something that has already been mentioned.

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Answer 6

Nov 10, 2009 10:45 PM in response to Penn-Ohio

This should work. Just make sure to keep the copy of the Amedia_1 just in case you have a problem with the Raid.

"So, I am considering putting three 1.5TB Seagate Baracuda 7200rpm drives in slots 2, 3, 4 and create a RAID of the three drives to overcome the drive R/W speed issue and hopefully be able to label this drive as "H:" for the reasons stated below. However, some serious considerations:"

Seagate baracuda are pretty sound. They come with a 5 year warranty. I have only had to send one back in 10 that I have bought. Keep in mind until they come up with something else hard drives can always fail for various reasons. So always back up. With a O raid with no redundancy, you are spreading the liability across three drives. You will get the speed you need but as long as you back up the work you will be fine. One of the things I do with raids is I only put media on them so I can replace it easier if necessary from my backup or original tape if you have it. Project, graphics, and anything else not media I put in a project folder on a what I like to call a work drive in a single slot. I also back that up if I do not have redundancy.

So, to sum up. Mount the Amedia drive in an external case.
Build a raid volume with the Baraccudas.
Copy (not move) the files to the raid "Volume"
Unmount the AMedia drive and set aside for safe keeping
Launch your project and reconnect the media in final cut when it prompts you to from the new raid volume.
Your speed problems should be solved.
(keep in mind that multicam editing need alot of speed the more cams you add)

Make sure you delete all window anything from your Mac. Window is a waste. The more you use Mac and FCP studio the more you will see what I mean. Boot camp and all that partition your Mac so you can run windows too is for indecisive suckers.

I will get off my soap box now.

Best of luck.

B Miller
Archetype HD Editorial LLC

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Answer 7

Nov 10, 2009 10:52 PM in response to Penn-Ohio

Oh and here is a good resource for systems, hardware and Raids. The blog http://www.hdforindies.com/

He as a pretty extensive archive of test configs. He has probably tested an internal striped raid like what you are doing and can tell you how fast and how reliable it is. Just use the search function to find the post you need

BCM

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Answer 8

Penn-Ohio Author

Level 1

8 points

Nov 10, 2009 10:53 PM in response to archetypehd

archetypehd wrote:
Make sure you delete all window anything from your Mac. Window is a waste. The more you use Mac and FCP studio the more you will see what I mean. Boot camp and all that partition your Mac so you can run windows too is for indecisive suckers. I will get off my soap box now. Best of luck. B Miller, Archetype HD Editorial LLC

Great. I wished I could remove that partition but sounds like I can't without rebooting the whole drive.

Thus, I will erase all that is in the partition and reformat the partition if that is possible and use it for regularly used media or titles to link too.

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Answer 9

Penn-Ohio Author

Level 1

8 points

Nov 10, 2009 10:59 PM in response to archetypehd

archetypehd wrote:
Oh and here is a good resource for systems, hardware and Raids......BCM

Thanks for the kind help. I will resource that. The whole Mac platform and FCP are all new to me and until Friday I have never had an issue with streaming data off drives even when I was running DVCProHD so this is a whole new area for my consideration. Thus, with the new format, the platform, and the new NLE (FCP) I'm like a sheep wandering around in the forest without even knowing that there is prey out there . . the prey being my ignorance on all this. However, slowly but surely I find some winners to chat with and eventually get it where the manual just doesn't seem to make it clear or doesn't have it. Thanks.

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Answer 10

Penn-Ohio Author

Level 1

8 points

Nov 15, 2009 7:55 PM in response to Penn-Ohio

Solved. I will set up a two drive RAID array in slots 3 & 4 and hopefully that will be enough to handle three streams of ProRes422 HQ 1920x1080. In the meantime I re-transcoded as DV25 SD and it's streaming that material just fine off one drive even thought it was acquired in 1920x1080 and looks great.

Thanks to all who helped.

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