Previous 1 2 Next 15 Replies Latest reply: Jan 29, 2010 8:33 AM by cornelius
PDS Level 1 Level 1 (70 points)
I want to install Tiger on my older G4. Unfortunately, my copy of Tiger is on a DVD and my G4 does not have a DVD drive. How can I update? Is there documentation somewhere on the Apple site that will help?

I've thought of using the optical drive on my other computer to reboot and install, but was told the target computer must have at least OS X 10.2 installed.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

PowerMac G4, Mac OS 9.2.x
  • Limnos Level 8 Level 8 (41,250 points)
    Is the DVD a black one or gray in color? Gray ones will only install on the model Mac with which they were supplied.

    Target disk mode (TDM) isn't dependent upon the OS but on the model computer used. When asking this kind of question it helps to be very specific about your computer models and systems.

    What you want to do (assuming the above criteria are okay) is borrow a DVD drive in another Mac. Put the host Mac in TDM, then select that Mac from your G4 as the start up drive. Your G4 will then start up from the DVD in the other computer.

    [How to use FireWire target disk mode|http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1661] includes description of hardware and software requirements.

    [What to do if your Mac doesn't enter FireWire Target Disk Mode|http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=75414], also read about [Open Firmware Password Protection|http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/openfirmwarepassword.html] which can disable Target Disk Mode.

    [Technical Note TN 1189|http://developer.apple.com/technotes/tn/tn1189.html#TargetMode] - driver details for TDM

    Installing OS X 10.4 'Tiger' on DVD-Challenged Macs Using FireWire Target Disk Mode @ http://lowendmac.com/misc/06/0710.html

    Installing Tiger Without a DVD Drive
    http://www.oreillynet.com/mac/blog/2005/05/thecats_mustachesinstalling.html

    How To: Installing Tiger Using FireWire Target Disk Mode
    http://www.applelinks.com/index.php/more/osx_odyssey_752_how_to_installing_tiger_using_firewire_target_diskmode/
  • PDS Level 1 Level 1 (70 points)
    Thanks.

    The Tiger disc is black.

    The G4, I believe, is a 'blue & white'. PCI, 400mhz
  • cornelius Level 6 Level 6 (17,825 points)
    The Blue and White is actually a G3 which probably had a processor upgrade. However, it will support Tiger even without an upgrade. Can you give us specs on the "other computer" which you plan to use?
    I've thought of using the optical drive on my other computer to reboot and install, but was told the target computer must have at least OS X 10.2 installed.

    As Limnos pointed out it should not matter what OS is on the Target computer. The only instance in which will matter is if you are using an upgrade disk, which will necessitate that OS X is installed on the computer to which you wish to install Tiger. You need the Full Retail Version of Tiger, and not an upgrade or gray computer specific disk.

    Here's how to proceed:
    • Boot the Mac with working optical drive in Firewire Target Disk Mode.
    • Insert install disk into Target Computer's optical drive. (You may need to install the disk before FW-TDM if you have a tray loader)
    • Connect computers via firewire cable
    • Option Boot computer to which you want to install (Blue and White).
    • Select Install Disk for startup and click on the straight arrow.
    • Proceed with Installation

    cornelius
  • Limnos Level 8 Level 8 (41,250 points)
    The G4, I believe, is a 'blue & white'. PCI, 400mhz

    Hmmm.. It sounds like somebody did a processor upgrade on a G3 Blue & White. If it is that model G3 then it doesn't do TDM (read links in earlier post about a computer not going into TDM). Go to the apple in the upper left corner, get info about the mac, then more and copy and paste the information (omit serial #) in a reply.
  • cornelius Level 6 Level 6 (17,825 points)
    Limnos:
    If it is that model G3 then it doesn't do TDM (read links in earlier post about a computer not going into TDM).

    Interesting point. However, if the B/W is the computer to which installation is being made it does not have to be in FW-TDM. The computer with the working optical drive will be the Target computer. Which means that the B/W will read the Target computer as an external optical drive.

    cornelius
  • Limnos Level 8 Level 8 (41,250 points)
    Good point Cornelius, and I knew that but in focusing on the details I had somehow gotten it into my head that the other computer was the B&W upgrade.

    OP: This is why it would help to know about both computers since we really need the full context.
  • PDS Level 1 Level 1 (70 points)
    Thanks for the info. I'll post computer info when I'm able to sit down in front of them later this evening. Linked info has been very helpful.
  • PDS Level 1 Level 1 (70 points)
    target computer is...

    Machine Name: eMac
    Machine Model: PowerMac6,4
    CPU Type: PowerPC G4 (1.5)
    Number Of CPUs: 1
    CPU Speed: 1.25 GHz
    L2 Cache (per CPU): 512 KB
    Memory: 512 MB
    Bus Speed: 167 MHz
    Boot ROM Version: 4.9.2f1

    machine for the install is...
    PowerMac G4 (PCI graphics)
    OS 9.2.2/400 MHz
  • cornelius Level 6 Level 6 (17,825 points)
    PDS:

    Thanks for the updated information. Your mentioning Blue and White threw me off, as that name is usually used to refer to a PowerMacintosh G3 with those colors. In any case, your eMac will serve fine as the target computer. If you have the full retail version you should have no problem with the installation. I suggest that you backup your data on the PCI Graphics. If you wish to retain OS 9 you will need to choose the option to Archive and Install. If you need step by step directions for installation, please post back and ask.

    cornelius
  • PDS Level 1 Level 1 (70 points)
    Cornelius:

    Sorry about the 'b&w' reference. Someone referred to it -- mistakingly obviously -- as such years ago. I should have double-checked first.

    Let me make sure I understand target mode correctly...

    I need to use the dvd drive in the eMac to install Tiger on the G4 (PCI Graphics). Do I need to put the eMac or the G4 in target mode?

    When testing last night, I was unable to place the G4 in target mode. (Firewire firmware is 2.8.5. Apple support paper did not list the G4 PCI Graphics as target mode capable.) The computer simply booted as usual even though I held the T key down at start-up.

    I then attempted to put the eMac in target mode and was able to do this without problem. The eMac hard drive and Tiger install disc showed as external volumes on the G4 screen. However, I was not able to boot the G4 using the Tiger disc. Both the eMac hard drive and the Tiger disc were grayed-out as bootable drives in the G4 Startup Control Panel.

    Am I missing something here?

    Thanks again for your help.
  • cornelius Level 6 Level 6 (17,825 points)
    Let me make sure I understand target mode correctly...

    Here, again, with specifics, are step by step directions.
    • Boot the eMac (with working optical drive) in Firewire Target Disk Mode.
    • Insert install disk into *eMac's (Target Computer) optical drive*.
    • Connect both computers via firewire cable
    • Startup *PowerMac G4 (PCI graphics)* and hold down Option key immediately after startup chime.
    • Select *Install Disk* for startup and click on the straight arrow.
    • Proceed with Installation
    Am I missing something here?

    Did you Option Boot the G4, as described above?

    cornelius
  • PDS Level 1 Level 1 (70 points)
    Unfortunately, still didn't work.

    After option boot, G4 still booted on its own. eMac and Tiger install disc are visible and accessible as you would expect, but I could not restart G4 from Tiger disc. Received error stating that Tiger volume was non-bootable. (I haved used that disc to boot the eMac in past, though, so I know the disc is bootable.) In Start-Up control panel option, both eMac and Tiger disc are viewable, but grayed-out.

    I booted G4 from the original 9.2 disc just to see what options I would have and to see if that would make a difference. Again, the eMac and Tiger install disc were visible and accessible, but I was unable to restart G4 from Tiger disc. Received same error stating that volume was non-bootable.

    I'm stumped. Is there a timing issue on exactly when to hold and release the option key after startup chime?
  • cornelius Level 6 Level 6 (17,825 points)
    After option boot, G4 still booted on its own.

    Do you mean you booted in the the Startup manager or that you could not boot into the Startup manager? Sounds like you attempted Option booting and it started up normally, booting from the internal HDD, is that correct?

    cornelius
  • PDS Level 1 Level 1 (70 points)
    Yes, I held down the option key after startup chime.
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