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Video freezes after a few seconds

This is actually a continuation of a post I made almost a year and a half ago, trying to get video chat going so my mom can visit with her grandkids. The thread has been archived, so I can't post there but in case it helps here's the address:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1658017&tstart=0

We are both running Tiger 10.4.11 and iChat AV 3.1.9 (v446), although she's on a 1.25 GHz G4 with 1.5 GB of RAM, and I'm on a 1.8 GHz iMac G5 with 1 GB of RAM. We both have the exact same videocamera, Canon Elura 70, attached via Firewire. Both computers recognize the cameras fine, no problems there.

Anyway, my sister and I have tried 1,000 different things but nothing works. I can always see her but not hear her, and the connection is dropped after a few seconds, saying there's insufficient bandwidth to maintain the conference. She can't see me at all, but she can hear me. The chat usually ends with error -20 and sometimes -22. For instance, here's the log from our try today:

*2010-01-29 11:49:30 -0600: No data has been received for the last 10 seconds.*
*Audio channel info: local machine using 10.0.1.3:16386, expecting remote machine to send to 97.83.147.78:56754*
*Video channel info: local machine using 10.0.1.3:16384, expecting remote machine to send to 97.83.147.78:56752*
*****
*Chat ended with error -20*
*****
*Chat ended with error -20*
*****
*Chat ended with error -22*
*****
*Chat ended with error -22*


The thing is, we can video conference successfully (video and audio) with each other from separate rooms if we're both at her house, as well as from separate rooms when we're both at mine. However, when we're each at our own home, it won't work. She's got a download speed of 8.5, and mine is 8.3. Her upload speed is 1.01 and mine is 1.74.

I am connected through a router - SMC Barricade (SMC7004VBR), and a WebStar modem. We've both taken the tape out of our camera, set our bandwidth limit in iChat to none. System Preferences > Quicktime > Streaming is at 1.5Mbps. I've learned how to access my router settings but I don't see a DoS or SPI setting. It shows firewall features are disabled.

We've also tried to connect with Skype instead, and I was able to see my sister without it freezing. But she couldn't see me, so it still didn't fully work.

I'm totally at a loss. Any ideas? 🙂

Edit: Forgot to say her modem is an Ambit U10C018.

Message was edited by: laburke

iMac g5, Mac OS X (10.4.11)

Posted on Jan 29, 2010 9:34 AM

Reply
35 replies

Jan 29, 2010 2:13 PM in response to laburke

Hi,

iChat 3.x at both ends.
Can Login and show Buddy Lists
Can Send Visible Invites.
Can Start Video Chat but something says the Bandwidth is then not good enough.
Error Message.

Error 22 is is about Bandwidth (Your portion of what iChat can see of your Internet Speed).
This should be at least 100kbps both up and down for iChat 3 although around 256kbps is a more real world figure.

In iChat 3 and 4, iChat relies on the System Preferences > Quicktime > Streaming setting to judge the Internet Speed.
This gets read as 0kbps sometimes when set at the Automatic Setting.
The Intranet /LAN setting in Tiger for iChat 3 also returns Odd figures to iChat so we have long said set it to 1.5Mbps which your last post says it is.
I take it you must have restarted iChat f not the Mac(s) since you changed this setting ? (Just covering all bases)

Error 20 has its own message when the Chat fails placed on the chat window itself and in the Connection Doctor (Video Menu) and it's Errors tab.
Error 20 sometimes reads "Cannot get Video From Camera" Sometime it is the "No Data for 10 Secs"

Your copy of what I think is the Connection Doctor Error listing seems to show the 10 Sec Error message.
There is an issue here.

Between the routing device giving your computer the IP of 10.0.1.3 and the Internet IP at 97.83.blah.blah there is a port change.

There should not be.
This can be caused by two routing devices at one end.
Now you mention a SMC device and a Webstar Modem

Now the Port Forward site lists 192.168.2.1 as the default Access IP to use in a web Browser for the SMC
This makes me wonder where the 10.0.1.3 IP is coming from as a Router will normally be at 10.0.1.1 (Or at the top of the range such as 10.0.1.254 or 255)

Have you changed the range the SMC uses to miss the range the modem is using ?

I see the SMC cannot Forward enough ports for iChat but Can do UPnP (Universal Plug and Play)
Is it set to do UPnP ?

On the Port Forward site there are two WebSTARs listed under Scientic Atlanta
DO you have either of these ?

I could also do with seeing an old log of an Error 20 log.
They are stored in You Home Folder/Library/Logs/iChatConnectionErrors

Can you post the bits down and only down to the line that starts " Binary Images for iChat"

Edit:
I checked the older thread and see I suggested UPnP then as well.
I can see it is not a routing Modem.

Can you tell me if there is a Wifi and Ethernet connection to the Router ? (at the same time )

User uploaded file

10:05 PM Friday; January 29, 2010

Please, if posting Logs, do not post any Log info after the line "Binary Images for iChat"

Message was edited by: Ralph Johns (UK)

Jan 29, 2010 2:47 PM in response to Ralph-Johns-UK

Wow, thank you so much for the detailed response. I'm actually feeling a little bit of hope that we might get this figured out eventually!

iChat 3.x at both ends.
Can Login and show Buddy Lists
Can Send Visible Invites.
Can Start Video Chat but something says the Bandwidth is then not good enough.
Error Message.


All true, except she has never been able to see me unless we're both in the same my house.

The Intranet /LAN setting in Tiger for iChat 3 also returns Odd figures to
iChat so we have long said set it to 1.5Mbps which your last post says it is.
I take it you must have restarted iChat f not the Mac(s) since you changed
this setting ? (Just covering all bases)


Right.

Have you changed the range the SMC uses to miss the range the modem is using ?


The only change I've made to anything recently is in iChat prefs: Under Accounts - Server settings, I changed the top port to 443 because regular iChat kept disconnecting at odd times and I read somewhere that it might help. But we had this AV problem long before that, and after.

I see the SMC cannot Forward enough ports for iChat but Can do UPnP
(Universal Plug and Play)
Is it set to do UPnP ?


I don't see anything that says UPnP. It says:
GATEWAY
IP Address: 192.168.2.1
Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.0
DHCP Server: Enabled
Firewall: Disabled

On the Port Forward site there are two WebSTARs listed under

Scientic Atlanta
DO you have either of these ?


No, it is a DPC2100.

I could also do with seeing an old log of an Error 20 log.
They are stored in You Home Folder/Library/Logs/iChatConnectionErrors
Can you post the bits down and only down to the line that starts " Binary Images for iChat"


Pasted at bottom of this post.

Can you tell me if there is a Wifi and Ethernet connection to the Router ? (at > the same time )


My husband's PC is connected to the router via Ethernet. The only other things connected to it are the modem and my Airport Express so I can get online with my Macs. (I used to have the iMac connected by Ethernet before I realized I had an Airport card. Duh.)

Thanks so much for your patience and help!

Here's the chat log:

Date/Time: 2010-01-29 14:05:49.036 -0600
OS Version: 10.4.11 (Build 8S165)
Report Version: 4

iChat Connection Log:
AVChat started with ID 2853609893.
0x63bb350: State change from AVChatNoState to AVChatStateWaiting.
Laura Macburke2: State change from AVChatNoState to AVChatStateInvited.
0x63bb350: State change from AVChatStateWaiting to AVChatStateConnecting.
Laura Macburke2: State change from AVChatStateInvited to AVChatStateConnecting.
0x63bb350: State change from AVChatStateConnecting to AVChatStateConnected.
Laura Macburke2: State change from AVChatStateConnecting to AVChatStateConnected.
0x63bb350: State change from AVChatStateConnected to AVChatStateEnded.
2010-01-29 14:05:45 -0600: Participant 0x63bb350: VC connection failed.
Chat ended with error -20
Laura Macburke2: State change from AVChatStateConnected to AVChatStateEnded.
Chat ended with error -20

Video Conference Error Report:
34.059291 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
Event: conference
Subscription-State: terminated;reason=noresource
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0
]
[]
32.494025 @:0 type=4 (00000000/0)
[VC NO_REMOTEPACKETS]
[18]
30.067686 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
Event: conference
Subscription-State: terminated;reason=noresource
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0
]
[]
26.059537 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
Event: conference
Subscription-State: terminated;reason=noresource
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0
]
[]
24.061281 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
Event: conference
Subscription-State: terminated;reason=noresource
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0
]
[]
23.162985 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
Event: conference
Subscription-State: terminated;reason=noresource
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0
]
[]
22.576970 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
Event: conference
Subscription-State: terminated;reason=noresource
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0
]
[]
9.754589 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK199efcba4d7aa545
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 2 NOTIFY
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
Event: conference
Subscription-State: active;expires=3600
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Type: application/conference-info+xml
Content-Length: 205
]
[<c-i v="0" st="f" en="sip:user@uen0.0">
c<h>i</h><m t="a"/><m t="v"/>
c<h>o</h><m t="a"/><m t="v"/>
</c-i>
]
9.753208 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP m.0:56751;branch=z9hG4bK03684cb47799c88d
To: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
From: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 1 SUBSCRIBE
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
Expires: 3600
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0
]
[]
9.664868 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[ACK sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK158fdb603882a2ef
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 1 ACK
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0
]
[]
9.099356 @SIP/Transport.c:121 type=4 (00000000/0)
[INVITE sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK0589ec793bcf2336
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 1 INVITE
Contact: <sip:user@uen0.0>;isfocus
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Type: application/sdp
Content-Length: 536
]
[v=0
o=admin 0 0 IN IP4 uen0.0
s=u0
c=IN IP4 uen0.0
b=AS:2147483647
t=0 0
a=hwi:34:1:1200
a=bandwidthDetection:YES
a=iChatEncryption:NO
m=audio 16386 RTP/AVP 12 3 0
a=rtcp:16387
a=rtpmap:3 GSM/8000/1
a=rtpmap:0 PCMU/8000/1
a=rtpID:1892442351
m=video 16384 RTP/AVP 126 34
a=rtcp:16385
a=rtpmap:126 X-H264/90000
a=rtpmap:34 H263/90000
a=fmtp:34 imagesize 0 rules 15:352:288
a=framerate:20
a=RTCP:AUDIO 16387 VIDEO 16385
a=pogo
a=fmtp:126 imagesize 0 rules 20:160:120:160:120
a=rtpID:123999715
]


Video Conference Support Report:
34.059656 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
33.137083 @:0 type=2 (00000000/2)
[VC CALL_ENDEDCOUNT]
[17]
30.069301 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
26.059889 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
24.061489 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
23.164466 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
22.578864 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK6ddeb2cf73f6ce49
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 3 NOTIFY
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
11.029675 @:0 type=2 (00000000/2)
[VC VIDEO_STARTCOMPLETED]
[16]
11.029646 @:0 type=2 (00000000/2)
[VC VIDEO_INCOMINGCOMPLETION]
[11]
10.719451 @:0 type=2 (00000000/2)
[VC USE_INTERNALMIC]
[29]
10.650426 @:0 type=2 (00000000/2)
[VC USEDV]
[27]
9.763906 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK199efcba4d7aa545
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 2 NOTIFY
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
9.688386 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SUBSCRIBE sip:user@uen0.0 SIP/2.0
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP m.0:56751;branch=z9hG4bK03684cb47799c88d
Max-Forwards: 70
To: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
From: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 1 SUBSCRIBE
Contact: <sip:user@m.0:56751>
Event: conference
Expires: 3600
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
9.613321 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 200 OK
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK0589ec793bcf2336
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 1 INVITE
Contact: <sip:user@m.0:56751>
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Type: application/sdp
Content-Length: 413

v=0
o=lauraburke 0 0 IN IP4 m.0
s=u0
c=IN IP4 m.0
b=AS:2147483647
t=0 0
a=hwi:784:1:1800
a=bandwidthDetection:YES
a=iChatEncryption:NO
m=audio 56759 RTP/AVP 12
a=rtcp:56760
a=rtpID:-337239833
m=video 56757 RTP/AVP 126
a=rtcp:56758
a=rtpmap:126 X-H264/90000
a=RTCP:AUDIO 56760 VIDEO 56758
a=fmtp:126 imagesize 0 rules 15:160:120:160:120
a=framerate:15
a=rtpID:-362537079
]
[]
9.195704 @:0 type=2 (00000000/0)
[VC VIDEO_INCOMINGATTEMPT]
[3]
9.119168 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 180 Ringing
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK0589ec793bcf2336
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>;tag=1831371757
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 1 INVITE
Contact: <sip:user@m.0:56751>
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
9.118898 @SIP/Transport.c:1218 type=1 (00000000/0)
[SIP/2.0 100 Trying
Via: SIP/2.0/UDP uen0.0;branch=z9hG4bK0589ec793bcf2336
To: "Laura Macburke2" <sip:user@m.0:56754>
From: "u0" <sip:user@uen0.0>;tag=385103684
Call-ID: 7352bd3a-0d09-11df-b5ee-a3591bb813c4@66-227-184-124
CSeq: 1 INVITE
User-Agent: Viceroy 1.2
Content-Length: 0

]
[]
0.266057 @:0 type=2 (00000000/2)
[VC USEDV]
[27]
0.000000 @:0 type=2 (00000000/2)
[VC USEDV]
[27]

Jan 29, 2010 3:23 PM in response to laburke

Ok,

Several things get highlighted by your answers.

1) I linked you to the base SCMC device's pages at PortForward.com
In the pic there of the Status Page it shows UPnP in the menu on the left and in the Middle section about what is On.

2) I also linked you to the Front Page of Port Forwarding.
This list several other models of the SMC device model number such as a ver 2
Can you confirm you have th Base Model ?
A Later Model and whether UPnP can be found in any of the menus ?
Also have you ever set up ports here for iChat ?

3) You first post in this thread list an IP of 10.0.1.3
IS this what appears in System Preferences > Network ?
Does this read " Using DHCP at the Configure IPv4 point (first Drop down) ?
Does the " Router IP" List 10.0.1.1 as the Router's IP ?

If you use the Utility in Applications/Utilities for accessing the Airport device from a Laptop, does it list the Airport's IP as 10.0.1.1 ?

4) Use this Site at both ends
http://www.ip-adress.com/
This will show you the IP from your IP that you have been Given (Public IP)
It will show the Buddy their IP.

Does it show you these numbers 66-227-184-124 (from the Log) ?
They maybe in reverse order but I think iChat 3 tells you them in normal sequence.

5)
You will notice you get this bit

[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0


In iChat 3 this port is supposed to be port 5060.
Despite this the call gets connected (However Briefly) as you have the algebra looking section.
(What does seem odd is this log does not note the PING)

Content-Length: 205
]
[<c-i v="0" st="f" en="sip:user@uen0.0">
c<h>i</h><m t="a"/><m t="v"/>
c<h>o</h><m t="a"/><m t="v"/>
</c-i>
]


What I think is happening is this.
The Modem does not route.
The Router does and I think you have the Airport Routing as well.
From here, for some reason the Mac is getting an IP from the Base Station via DHCP and the Airport is getting it's IP from the Router also using DHCP meaning that there are two DHCP Servers on your LAN (not Good).

From here it means that extra data is forced into the Header packets of the iChat data to route through both device meaning the ports get changed.

Now iChat 4 and 5 specifically check for this Dual set up as the Mac/iChat "sees" it as two connections to the Internet because the Airport (or any router) will pass on Routing Info from another router.

As you are connected to the SMC via Ethernet I would have expected the 192.168.1.x address to be seen as the Mac would have "seen" this as "Nearer"

Can you confirm the info I have asked for and also the layout of your LAN please ?

It is Late where I am and I am going Off line for a while.
It does not mean I have forgotten you or ignoring you.
I am just sleeping and other stuff in between.
I will get back to this in about 16 to 18 hours.

User uploaded file

11:22 PM Friday; January 29, 2010

Please, if posting Logs, do not post any Log info after the line "Binary Images for iChat"

Jan 30, 2010 10:55 AM in response to Ralph-Johns-UK

I'll try to answer your questions as best I can.

1) I linked you to the base SCMC device's pages at PortForward.com
In the pic there of the Status Page it shows UPnP in the menu on the left and in the Middle section about what is On.


UPnP is not in the menu on the left, just System, WAN, LAN, NAT, Firewall, Tools, Status. I'm pasting in all the status info in case it helps:

INTERNET
Cable/DSL: CONNECTED
WAN IP: 97.83.147.78
Subnet Mask: 255.255.254.0
Gateway: 97.83.146.1
Primary DNS: 68.115.71.53
Secondary DNS: 24.213.60.93

GATEWAY
IP Address: 192.168.2.1
Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.0
DHCP Server: Enabled
Firewall: Disabled

INFORMATION
Numbers of DHCP Clients: 1
Runtime Code Version:
v1.03 (Jun 12 2002 22:00:19)
Boot Code Version: V1.05
LAN MAC Address:
00-04-E2-51-75-EC
WAN MAC Address:
00-04-E2-51-75-ED
Hardware Version: 01
Serial Num: S236001161

2) I also linked you to the Front Page of Port Forwarding.
This list several other models of the SMC device model number such as a ver 2
Can you confirm you have th Base Model ?


On the front of the router, that's all it says. Same on the bar code sticker.

A Later Model and whether UPnP can be found in any of the menus ?


I checked through all the menu items and can't find reference to UPnP anywhere.

Also have you ever set up ports here for iChat ?


No.

3) You first post in this thread list an IP of 10.0.1.3
IS this what appears in System Preferences > Network ?


Yes.

Does this read " Using DHCP at the Configure IPv4 point (first Drop down) ?


Yes.

Does the " Router IP" List 10.0.1.1 as the Router's IP ?


Yes.

If you use the Utility in Applications/Utilities for accessing the Airport device from a Laptop, does it list the Airport's IP as 10.0.1.1 ?


Yes.

4) Use this Site at both ends
http://www.ip-adress.com/
This will show you the IP from your IP that you have been Given (Public IP)
It will show the Buddy their IP.


Mine: 97.83.147.78
Sister's: She's not home now to check, I will get it ASAP.

Does it show you these numbers 66-227-184-124 (from the Log) ?
They maybe in reverse order but I think iChat 3 tells you them in normal sequence.


Does ip-adress.com show those numbers? No.

You will notice you get this bit
[NOTIFY sip:user@m.0:56754 SIP/2.0

In iChat 3 this port is supposed to be port 5060.
Despite this the call gets connected (However Briefly) as you have the algebra looking section.
(What does seem odd is this log does not note the PING)
Content-Length: 205
]
[<c-i v="0" st="f" en="sip:user@uen0.0">
c<h>i</h><m t="a"/><m t="v"/>
c<h>o</h><m t="a"/><m t="v"/>
</c-i>
]


What I think is happening is this.
The Modem does not route.
The Router does and I think you have the Airport Routing as well.
From here, for some reason the Mac is getting an IP from the Base Station via DHCP and the Airport is getting it's IP from the Router also using DHCP meaning that there are two DHCP Servers on your LAN (not Good).

From here it means that extra data is forced into the Header packets of the iChat data to route through both device meaning the ports get changed.

Now iChat 4 and 5 specifically check for this Dual set up as the Mac/iChat "sees" it as two connections to the Internet because the Airport (or any router) will pass on Routing Info from another router.

As you are connected to the SMC via Ethernet I would have expected the 192.168.1.x address to be seen as the Mac would have "seen" this as "Nearer"


You seem to have typed this whole section in Swahili, which I unfortunately do not speak 😀

Can you confirm the info I have asked for and also the layout of your LAN please ?


When you say layout, do you mean something beyond what I've listed regarding what's connected to the router and how? I'm not sure if that's what you need. Cable goes to modem, modem goes to router. Also connected to router: Airport Express and PC. iMac and PowerBook connect via Airport. Let me know if that's not what you're looking for.

It is Late where I am and I am going Off line for a while.
It does not mean I have forgotten you or ignoring you.
I am just sleeping and other stuff in between.
I will get back to this in about 16 to 18 hours.


I hope you had a good night's rest! I forgot you're like 6 hours or so ahead of us. I appreciate your help.

Jan 30, 2010 2:10 PM in response to laburke

Ok,

Lets start with a translation of Swahili.

Imagine your house is at a corner plot between Main Street and Side Avenue.
Lets go one step further and say the plot is large enough that it could have the postal address of 30, Main Street and 1, Side Street.

Now to get Post you house has to have a number. As far as the Postal service is concerned it has to be one or other of the numbers the Plot can have.
So in effect either number 30 Main Street "Disappears" or number 1 Side Avenue does.
The local Town Maps may make the distinction which one it is (In fact the decision may well take place in the planning department before the house is built).

Physically on the ground the clue maybe which road the drive goes to.
Lets say though that your drive is curved and comes in form either road past the front door of the house.
A local postman can still count houses in both roads and work out the potential numbers of the plot has.
However you describing to a friend on how to get there may come along Side Avenue and go nowhere near Main Street until they get to your house.

What I am trying to illustrate here is that depending on your view point your house can be considered to be in two places.
The Postman may not start at 1, Side Street when he gets to do that road (if that is the local towns view of the number).
The Build order of Main Street and Side Avenue may place the plot in Side Avenue but the Planners may call it 30, Main Street.

Now lets talk about routers.
Have a look at the second pic (a slow to change animated .gif ) on this page

You will see that the Modem gets the Public IP from the Internet (ISP)
It then issues IPs to computers and routers that are connected to it because in this case it routes.
However there is a router that is also issuing IPs to the Computers.
Because of the way the router works it will pass on anything from the modem including the IPs it is issuing - so the physical layout will appear to go through the router.

This is called Subnets.
There is the Modem Subnet in which Everything sits (Green Box)
There is the Router Subnet (Pink box).

Now, what you have is two Subnets but from your 1st router (not the modem as in the Pic) plus the Airport Express.

It appears from the Info on the SMC router that if it is doing DHCP (Issuing IPs), that is has been Limited to One IP

GATEWAY
IP Address: 192.168.2.1
Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.0
DHCP Server: Enabled
Firewall: Disabled

INFORMATION
Numbers of DHCP Clients: 1


This probably is given to the Airport Express due to the order they were powered On at one stage. If it is the case that on the DHCP Server page of the Modem it states the DHCP Pool is just one IP (Start and End will be the same number) then the Airport will get that number and will explain why your computer gets an IP from the Airport Express.

So the data flow is from the Internet - to the modem - to the router - to the Airport Base Station - back to the router - to your computer.

Now to do that the data has to have info that says send me to the 97.83.xxx.xx bit and pass me to the LAN IP 192.168.2.1 and then pass me to 10.0.1.1 for delivery to 10.0.1.3
This info is held in what are called Header packets. It holds the IP to go to info and the port the computer at that end is supposed to be able to handle it on.
How it gets directed is controlled by the devices method of doing NAT (Network Address Translation).

It seems though in iChat's case if it goes through two devices doing NAT something happens to the port info and the port gets changed.

Has that made things clearer for you ?

<hr>

On the SIP port front as that was in the bit considered Swahili.

iChat uses different ports to do different bits.
With an AIM or Apple Name the Buddy List logins in on port 5190 by default using the TCP Protocol.
It also uses this port on the UDP Protocol to get Buddy List feed back and do File Sending.

When you do an A/V chat it sends Visible Invite to your Buddy on port 5678 on the UDP Protocol.
When they accept that iChat moves to do the SIP Process.
This starts with an SIP Invite on port 5060 in iChat 3 (and 2).
If it gets this part accepted it moves to negotiating the ports for the Video and Audio Streams both In and Out in ichat 3 so four ports.
The first choices for these are 16384-16387 although it can be any four in row up to 16403 as the last port.

What SIP does.

SIP = Session Initiation Protocol.
iChat, in this case, contact a server called SNATMAP.mac.com run by apple just for iChat.
As Your Buddy accepts the Visible Invite his/her iChat contacts the SNATMAP server as well.
The server handles a Text based set of instructions that act like an old telephone exchange operator connecting the call.
You pick up the phone and say call so-and-so the operator calls the operator at the other end who calls the person who agrees and you get connected.

In the Logs you may see "120 Trying" "180 Ringing" and "200 OK" and the Cseq bit read INVITE and then ACK then MESSAGE.

The MESSAGE in this case is to "Go Video" (or audio) and you get connected.
Part of getting there is to confirm the A/V ports so you see port 16384 listed against a = Video and 16385 for Audio. These are the Out streams and then it will list two ports for the Incoming
Note for iChat 4 and 5 Users
The Video and Audio is streamed on one port from both ends so you will see port 16402 listed as it also starts at the highest port of the options it can use


iChat also confirms where the Visible Invite went to is the same place the SIP Invite gets a response from.
It does this by sending a PING.
The Log if it fails should List a PING after the Cseq bit gets to MESSAGE.

However iChat 3 will often show the Algebra looking section to say it has connected (in SIP at least) and you will get the Connection sound you have set in the iChat Alerts section. A sort of soft "Whaong" noise is default.


I am going to stop here.

I want to make sure you have a handle on this before we try to straighten out the LAN a little (Just a tiny bit) and open the ports in the SMC for iChat which should speed the process up and stop the Error 30 and 22s

If it helps break down any questions in to separate posts.

User uploaded file

10:10 PM Saturday; January 30, 2010

Please, if posting Logs, do not post any Log info after the line "Binary Images for iChat"

Jan 30, 2010 3:26 PM in response to Ralph-Johns-UK

You will see that the Modem gets the Public IP from the Internet (ISP)
It then issues IPs to computers and routers that are connected to it because in this case it routes.
However there is a router that is also issuing IPs to the Computers.
Because of the way the router works it will pass on anything from the modem including the IPs it is issuing - so the physical layout will appear to go through the router.

This is called Subnets.
There is the Modem Subnet in which Everything sits (Green Box)
There is the Router Subnet (Pink box).


I more or less get this part now, thanks to your detailed explanation and the pic!

The rest, well, it's still pretty fuzzy, even after reading it carefully three times and rereading your previous post. I mean, I can sort of follow the steps in the process as you explain, but I'm not sure what it means for me or what it is that needs to be done to "fix" it.

Does the fact that I changed the port to 443 make things worse? Like I said, we couldn't video chat before or after I made that change, but I'm just wondering.

I want to make sure you have a handle on this before we try to straighten out > the LAN a little (Just a tiny bit) and open the ports in the SMC for iChat
which should speed the process up and stop the Error 30 and 22s


Let's say I have a handle on it, but it's like the handle on a Barbie doll's purse rather than a good sturdy door handle. 🙂 I'm sorry you have to explain everything to this dummy, but at least I hope you know I really do appreciate your time.

Jan 31, 2010 11:58 AM in response to laburke

Ok,

You buy a service from an ISP.
They give you an IP and you have to have a device that logs in to that IP with your ISP Login details.

Sometimes a Modem can do this (DSL Ones do on the whole)
Sometimes they are just Modems and the Logging in part is passed to another device. (most Cable modems do it this way).

What would then happen is the Router would give out as many IP addresses as you had devices (Computers and more routers).
Any secondary routers would then be set to either create Subnets for a reason (like different departments in an Office block) or be in Bridge Mode (Meaning they don't route but allow for either Wifi Expansion or physical Ethernet ports to hook devices up).

The IPs in the form of xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx allow for each section to be between 1 and 255 (i.e 1.1.1.1 through to 255.255.255.255)

LAN Devices (Domestic routers and modems that route and obviously Airport devices) have some parts or ranges of IP restricted just for them.
These are in three groups
10.xxx.xxx.xxx like your particular Airport device
192.168.xxx.xxx like your router is using.
And a group between 172.16.xxx.xxx and 172.32.xxx.xxx

Now, your router is only giving out One IP (I believe to the Airport Extreme) of 192.168.2.2 most likely.
The Airport is giving out potentially 255 IPs to your computers.

AS the Router is shipping all data to the Airport device the physical route for your Mac's iChat Data is for outgoing stuff is

To the Router via Ethernet.
From there to the Airport device as the computer is getting an IP from there.
From there, on the Airport's IP to/from the router, the data goes to the router again.
From there it goes to the Outside world (Via the modem that converts the Ethernet Stuff into the Cable or phone line stuff).

Think of it this way.
A kid leaves his bedroom to go out and see his mother in the living room.
He moves on to the father who controls things.
He points the kid in the right direction which happens to be past the mother who puts on his outside coat.

At this point your router is not putting on the Outside coat bit (Not opening ports) (problem one)

As you are a grown up this checking via father and mother and retracing your steps around the house are inefficeint. (problem two)

Dealing with Problem 2 first
AS the Airport Extreme can have the Routing it does turned Off in such a Way that it becomes a Wire Access Point ( A hub that goes wireless basically) we need to find out if the SMC router will work if the DHCP Server range is increased from 1 to at least 2 and preferably enough for the computers and the Airport device.

In a web Browser can you access the set up pages of the SMC and find the DHCP page and change the range from just One IP to at least as many as the computers you have and one for the Airport ?

There should be an Apply or Save option.
You may go Off Line for a few seconds whilst this happens.

If it works can you then tell me if the IP in System Preferences > Network has changed to 192.168.2.something ?

User uploaded file

7:57 PM Sunday; January 31, 2010

Please, if posting Logs, do not post any Log info after the line "Binary Images for iChat"

Jan 31, 2010 1:13 PM in response to Ralph-Johns-UK

Hi Ralph,

AS the Router is shipping all data to the Airport device the physical route
for your Mac's iChat Data is for outgoing stuff is
To the Router via Ethernet.
From there to the Airport device as the computer is getting an IP from there.
From there, on the Airport's IP to/from the router, the data goes to the
router again.
From there it goes to the Outside world (Via the modem that converts the
Ethernet Stuff into the Cable or phone line stuff).


Thank you, this helps. The only thing is, Am I misunderstanding what you mean above, because the iMac is NOT connected to the router via Ethernet. Just thought I'd better clarify that in case that's where the hang-up is.

I can't find a way in any menu to change the DHCP client number from 1 to 4, which is what I'd need with 3 computers and the Airport. It just lists the specs under Status:

INFORMATION
Numbers of DHCP Clients: 1
Runtime Code Version:
v1.03 (Jun 12 2002 22:00:19)
Boot Code Version: V1.05
LAN MAC Address:
00-04-E2-51-75-EC
WAN MAC Address:
00-04-E2-51-75-ED
Hardware Version: 01
Serial Num: S236001161

Here's what the DHCP client log says, though, also under Status at the SMC site:

ip=192.168.2.100 mac=00-14-51-70-F1-D0

That's the only entry in that log.

Under LAN settings, it says:

You can enable DHCP to dynamically allocate IP addresses to your client PCs, or configure filtering functions based on specific clients or protocols.The Barricade must have an IP address for the local network.

LAN IP
IP Address 192.168.2.1
IP Subnet Mask 255.255.255.0
DHCP Server Enabled

Lease Time 1 week

IP Address Pool
Start IP 192.168.2.100
End IP 192.168.2.199
Domain Name ______

I don't know if this helps. Thank you!

Jan 31, 2010 1:40 PM in response to laburke

Hi,

I was under the impression that the computer was connected to the SMC router and then the Modem

I am connected through a router - SMC Barricade (SMC7004VBR), and a WebStar modem.>/s>

Later you seem to confirm that on another Ethernet port was the Airport Extreme supplying Wifi to several other computers and a PC.
I can see now the PC is Ethernet to the Router and the Macs are Wifi
That will straighten out the LAN as far as you are concerned.
I presume that there is Only one DHCP Client showing as th PC is Off (There are 100 IPs listed in the range)
IP Address Pool
Start IP 192.168.2.100
End IP 192.168.2.199


This would allow the PC to get One IP when it is On and the Airport to have another as it is On all the time.
The Airport if you access it with the Airport Utility in Applications/Utilities should show it is getting 192.168.2.100 from the Router.

So.
What is problem two from the way I had interpreted what you had said has gone away.

Problem one of making sure iChat is allowed through the Airport Base Station and Router effectively remains.

OK.
So the Address Pool (Range) has already been limited from a potential 255 IP Addresses (Less the router's own) to just 100 (192.168.2.100 through and including 192.168.2.199).

It can stay at this but personally I would reduce it to a smaller group. (Enough for the computers, the Airport Base Station and any visiting computers you may have plus Wifi able phones and games consoles)

Do you know how to access the Airport Extreme's set up pages with the Airport Utility ?

User uploaded file

9:40 PM Sunday; January 31, 2010

Please, if posting Logs, do not post any Log info after the line "Binary Images for iChat"

Jan 31, 2010 2:25 PM in response to Ralph-Johns-UK

I was under the impression that the computer was connected to the SMC router
and then the Modem


I'm sorry, I did word that badly. In a couple of subsequent posts I did mention that the iMac used to be connected by Ethernet until I realized it had wireless ability, but our conversation has been so long I can see how it would easily be missed! My apologies.

Do you know how to access the Airport Extreme's set up pages with the Airport Utility ?


I think so. I see Airport Setup Assistant and Airport Admin Utility. Neither will accept the password to change settings, though.

BTW, remember it's an Express, not an Extreme, if that makes a difference.

Jan 31, 2010 2:32 PM in response to laburke

Hi,

Sorry the Strike-through should have been limited to the bits at the top.

Ok, Airport Admin Utility is the one you want.
They are combined on Leopard and Snow Leopard into one thing that can both Edit (What you want to do) and Set up a new network.

So If I remember correctly you get the little pop up window list an Airport Base Station and asks fro you to confirm it's IP address ?
Is it at this point it asks for a Password ?

(I don't have an Airport and I am trying to remember things people have told me and posted about this)

User uploaded file

10:32 PM Sunday; January 31, 2010

Please, if posting Logs, do not post any Log info after the line "Binary Images for iChat"

Video freezes after a few seconds

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