GaBeech

Q: Late 2006 iMac, Lines, Kernel Panic, Freeze, Reboot, Restart, Serial W8 ?

Hello,

Let me start by explaining the method I am initially going to adopt in my search for answers;

•All of the keywords and more that would not fit in the title space, relate to my problem.
•I think the *iMac Serial* holds the key to mine and possibly a lot of other peoples search for answers.
•My second post will explain what I know about the Serial and the information it provides.
•I have a strong feeling that a lot of people who have the same or similar problems to me will have a Serial that begins with at least W8.
•I believe that a lot of affected machines will of been produced between 2006 & 2008, yet not confined to that window in time.
•So, to round up, I am looking for people who have had/are having the same/similar problems to the ones listed below.

•Small graphical glitches; Thin lines in random areas on the desktop, growing in number and intensity over time.
•Graphical glitches on, in and around Finder windows. Again, growing in number and intensity over time.
•Horizontal lines across entire screen. Again, growing in number and intensity over time.
•The odd Software Crash/System Freeze. (Which does not happen very often on the iMac we've grown to love)
•More frequent Software Crashes/System Freeze's. (Maybe it's all that freeware and plugins I've been playing with)
•Kernel Panic's, never had one before... it was a new one on me.
•Frequent Kernel Panics.
•System Freeze, recovering after being put to sleep and then woken.
•System Freeze, unrecoverable. Hard reset required.
•Exactly the same behavior after a full reinstall of OSX.
•Exactly the same behavior after wiping system drive with zero's, then a full reinstall of OSX.
•Exactly the same behavior after wiping system drive with zero's, then a full reinstall with a previous version of OSX.
•System Freeze requiring hard reset on nearly every occasion Time Machine was accessed.
•Shut iMac down completely, never to respond to Power Button being pressed again, even after trying to reset the SMC.


The above is a simplified list of key events on a relatively short journey from Perfect Machine to, 'will not power up'.


If you or anyone you know has gone through anything similar, I would love you to join this topic.

Yours,
GaBeech

iMac (20-inch Late 2006) 2.16 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo ~ x1600 Graphics, Mac OS X (10.6.3), Serial Number: W87070ACVUV (Check My Biography To See What A Serial Means)

Posted on May 26, 2010 8:36 PM

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Q: Late 2006 iMac, Lines, Kernel Panic, Freeze, Reboot, Restart, Serial W8 ?

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  • by R C-R,

    R C-R R C-R Oct 7, 2010 1:24 PM in response to pbcubed
    Level 6 (17,700 points)
    Oct 7, 2010 1:24 PM in response to pbcubed
    If I don't have enough data for a best guess, I can't make one, & that is where things stand for me for now. It would really help if more users with these symptoms would post the first 5 characters of the S/N's of the affected units.
  • by Michael Buday,

    Michael Buday Michael Buday Oct 7, 2010 1:59 PM in response to R C-R
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Oct 7, 2010 1:59 PM in response to R C-R
    R C-R wrote:
    1. It is a huge stretch to extrapolate three units as representative of a much larger sample!

    2. A design defect would affect every unit made using that design. A manufacturing defect would affect only those units manufactured with that defect, whatever it might be.

    If this much is not self-evident, there is no point discussing this further.


    On the contrary, it's a huge stretch to believe that three identical iMacs of the same vintage are not suffering from some kind of defect when all three died from exactly the same technical issue at roughly the same time (and all within 300 yards of each other - what are the chances?)

    Further, a design defect would only "potentially" affect every unit made of that design. You have no way of knowing what other factors are involved, such as temperature conditions, how many GFX intensive apps each user runs, etc. or even how many hours each day a user has their unit turned on. If we're assuming this is a "heat over time" related problem, then having the unit shut off for several weeks (for example) might extend the life of the unit.

    Regardless, I thought we were having a reasonable discussion about this topic. No need to get your knickers in a twist.
  • by elmac,

    elmac elmac Oct 7, 2010 2:24 PM in response to Michael Buday
    Level 5 (4,230 points)
    Oct 7, 2010 2:24 PM in response to Michael Buday
    Hi, as a watcher/reader on this subject/post, I am concerned that there is no mention of these issues being elevated & subsequently followed up in earnest to the top tech's @ Apple Customer Service?
    In all the time I have had Macs & had a few issues Apple have within a short period of time Replaced the faulty units..If these issues that you have appeared after the normal warranty I'm sure some have Applecare in which case the issue would be either remedied or the unit replaced...I doubt if all or any sample numbers would influence Apple..Each unit is dealt with on an individual basis, there are occasions where Apple have taken action on various out of warranty models..In my experience the tech's tend to say "never had this issue before" - Being as I have already Googled & trawled the Forums, I can respond with a "Really" then have a look at these articles...L
  • by NancyMac,

    NancyMac NancyMac Oct 8, 2010 9:15 PM in response to elmac
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Oct 8, 2010 9:15 PM in response to elmac
    You sound like my brother, who does IT for a firm, and doesn't understand why apple didn't honor my applecare, and replace my "lemon". We (my brother and I) agree that I got the run around. I'd take my machine in, they would run tests and say the hardware is fine, so it wasn't covered by applecare. They said something was corrupting the OS, but never were able to identify what. Now that applecare has expired, I'm scr#@ed.
    How am I supposed to trust the quality of a new model? How am I supposed to trust their service?
  • by elice82@,

    elice82@ elice82@ Oct 9, 2010 4:13 AM in response to NancyMac
    Level 1 (9 points)
    Oct 9, 2010 4:13 AM in response to NancyMac
    I have got the same problem. I don't feel the need to buy a new Mac.
    I do know when you knock at Apple's door even with a laywer you'll not get any answers in return. Give me one good reason to buy a new iMac?

    In the beginning I told many in my family Mac is great!
    Now many in my family points fingers saying wow Mac is great when they have issue they aren't doing anything about it.
    *I felt ashamed.* I'm dissapointed, left in the cold, a diffently is wasn't the great switch expercience for me.

    To answer the three questions.

    1. Yes, I believe the GPU (graphic card) is more sensitive to heat then the other parts. I also think the CPU is more sensitive to heat because my iMac is running slow. But I do have got a weird ticking sound. I don't believe it's the Hard disc. More PSU. That is also known for dying in heat (TimeCapsule).

    2. Yes, I believe the tempertures are wrongly measure that why it's coolling too late. When the GPU get's to 59 celsius it start coolling, I believe it's hotter than that. Yes, it's a guess but compare it to a Macbook you'll get more higher tempertures never seen that with the iMac. To compare it to a Macbook isn't weird because it campact. But because is layed down it has got more space to give heat off to the air aroung it. Heat will go up.

    3. Yes, but it should have been good from the start. We shouldn't be the one speeding the fans. Changing the factory settings.
    Also fans how are speeding much faster at a long period are usally failing faster. More spins is less years that it will work.
  • by NancyMac,

    NancyMac NancyMac Oct 9, 2010 5:42 PM in response to R C-R
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Oct 9, 2010 5:42 PM in response to R C-R
    the first 5 characters are: W8639
  • by maitaimai,

    maitaimai maitaimai Oct 10, 2010 7:53 AM in response to R C-R
    Level 1 (10 points)
    Mac OS X
    Oct 10, 2010 7:53 AM in response to R C-R
    1. Not everybody who suffered these problems will end up here. Many will have bought a replacement. Many MacUsers use to buy every 2 or 3 years the latest Apple machines (some like my brother behave like addicts). Some may sell there old machine, some use it as a backup.
    2. We will never be able to get the data together here and the terms and conditions don't allow us to place an official inquiry here. Result: no real stats, no real figures and you will always have the possibility to state: all this is guesswork. You did this a year ago you do it now. In the meantime: several threads dealing with the issue, hundreds of users complaining. Each and every of these threads get stopped and archived. Result: Effort lost. You have to start a new one.
    3. Extrapolation is a standard method in statistics. If I find hundreds of users who suffer from the same problem and there had been over the last two years hundreds of them here in the discussions, it's easy to say that the problem is real and that the deduction that the problem behind is a hardware design problem is at least reasonable, demanding for an investigation by Apple
    4. Apple knows how many logic boards in the smaller iMacs and graphic units in the 24'' iMac had to be replaced via Apple Care and they may know how many people asked for help suffering from these problems asking for "Genius" support. These are the figures that could help us.

    That's wishful thinking. That my iMac suffers a hardware design problem, that's all to clear to me, in other words: it's a fact. If Apple would publish contrasted and plausible information that I only had bad luck with my machine I'm willing to accept this. As long as this doesn't happen, I can't recommend Macs like I did before.

    - I had a hard time to get an defective iPhone replaced
    - My iMac is a piece of crap (lost harddisk, optical drive and nearly the machine, the power supply was lousily mounted and overheating, my graphics unit is unstable)

    Macs a about 2 to 4 times more expensive. You can expect that the company is up to state when it comes to customer care. It isn't.

    I follow this thread from time to time and I did so within other threads dealing with the same problem. Problem description, possible causes: always the same. If Apple really had an plausible answer they would offer their care statistics on these series and everybody in here would accept his bad luck. I believe that they can't because they would have to accept that something went horribly wrong. So if you ask for stats, for numbers, for machines, ask Apple. Bad enough that we have to stand the hard time with the machine. That our plausible and contrasted reasons are called guesswork sounds cynical to me.

    Message was edited by: maitaimai

    Message was edited by: maitaimai
  • by R C-R,

    R C-R R C-R Oct 12, 2010 7:15 AM in response to maitaimai
    Level 6 (17,700 points)
    Oct 12, 2010 7:15 AM in response to maitaimai
    Where did you find the hundreds of users & multiple topics dealing with this same issue? I have followed this particular topic since it was started five months ago & in its ~215 posts less than a hundred different users have reported these symptoms. Some of the reports are so incomplete that it isn't even clear if the Mac they refer to is an iMac or a 2006 model. Fewer still have included even the first two characters of the serial number, which at least would tell us which factory the Mac came from, despite the request from the originator of this topic to provide serial number data in their replies. Some reports are so vague that it isn't clear if the Mac has all the symptoms mentioned in the first post or if the GPU or any other part of the hardware is what is malfunctioning.

    Extrapolation is indeed a standard method in statistics. However, the method only works if the data used for the extrapolation is reasonably accurate, complete, & representative of the data that would be collected from the entire set of items being studied. Otherwise, statistics can be very misleading: if one doesn't know what the data sample represents to begin with then the meaning of any extrapolation from it will be hopelessly ambiguous.

    In particular, if you are not careful to consider a representative sample, then any deductions based on it are likely to be wildly unrepresentative of the whole. This is known as statistical bias. Like it or not, you can't simply ignore it & hope to show anything besides pure guesswork.

    For this particular issue, it isn't too hard to find at least as many examples of users reporting none of these symptoms as those that do. It isn't as easy as looking only at topics like this one, which we would expect to be highly biased, but by looking at many different topics in the Intel based iMac forums & elsewhere on the web, it becomes obvious that a lot of users of 2006 iMacs post messages making no mention whatsoever of graphics artifacts, kernel panics, & so on.

    So, while we never be able to get comprehensive statistics about this issue, we can at least try to get the best data we can from those reporting it. This may prove nothing, but the more data we have to work with, the better we can understand its extent & probable cause. It is the only way we have to decide if this is a random or coincidental statistical phenomenon affecting relatively few users or something that correlates reasonably well with place or date of manufacture, usage patterns, average temperature, or whatever else we suppose is the common link among affected iMacs.
  • by Richard Lawton,

    Richard Lawton Richard Lawton Oct 12, 2010 7:42 AM in response to GaBeech
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Oct 12, 2010 7:42 AM in response to GaBeech
    Here is my update:
    Because I spoke to support about my issue around the end of my extended warranty, and was nice and prepared when I went to talk to an apple genius, apple agreed to cover this repair. I brought screen shots.

    4 logic boards and 2 new graphics cards later all is working normal now. There was a lot of inconvenience for me to get this fixed with a total of 10 trips to the Apple store with my machine due to parts being out of stock. I never complained.

    Apple support told me that to get this kind of repair done out of warranty was a manager at a genius bars discretion. I have always been nice and polite and I have always found them to be understanding and helpful.

    A genius told me that they had seen this failure on these models several years prior. The implication being that most who have had this failure saw it earlier. I personally think there was a quality/design issue with this configuration, since it did not last very long in cycle.

    I think others should refrain from hostile feelings. It won't help and it makes it unpleasant to follow this thread. I also think it is irrelevant how many this has happened to since it has occurred during normal use and within a reasonable expectation of life for the computer.
    I was fortunate to have spoken to Apple within the weeks following the end of my extended warranty.
    I always get care for this reason. Good luck to those of you with this problem.

    I would suggest asking a favor as a loyal Apple customer.
  • by maitaimai,

    maitaimai maitaimai Oct 12, 2010 7:54 AM in response to R C-R
    Level 1 (10 points)
    Mac OS X
    Oct 12, 2010 7:54 AM in response to R C-R
    Once there had been a famous congress man called Fillibuster that tried to talk and talk to prevent the final votation...
    As I wrote: Apple has the power to facilitate accurate data, they run the "Genius" service. You yourself, R C-R, should know that this topic was showing up in different threads over nearly two years now and you always did the same: Throwing the thing back to the user as opposed to what is the aim of the topic: urge Apple to investigate and to possibly acknowledge a problem due to hardware design and/or manufacturing problems. That's what people are asking for, for nearly two years now. As a volunteer you offered "help" more than 5 month ago
    You're frustrating users that suffer. Their problems are real problems and they ask to be taken seriously. That's not a problem where you volunteers can help out. That's behind of what you can do and offer. As simple as that. As I told you: We are not allowed to implement a real inquiry here. Apple in fact could offer the data about
    - failure rates
    - reasons
    - etc.
    If they were positive for them everybody in here and all the users that complained over the last two years would have to accept their bad luck. As you can't help you may read and follow the topic, that's your good right, you even may participate, but I have the right too, to just ignore you because of my experience and your inclination to reduce the problems to mere user problems that do not affect Apple. That's what your job may be in here and I'll have to accept this but I'm not giving to much on your opinion when it comes to late 2006 white iMacs and the hardware problems of these machines.

    To put things clear: I registered within these threads June 2009 for exactly the same reason we're discussing here. Back than I wrote about these problems like other users and in June 2009 there had been older threads dealing with exactly the same problems.

    Message was edited by: maitaimai
  • by a brody,

    a brody a brody Oct 12, 2010 8:06 AM in response to GaBeech
    Level 9 (66,889 points)
    Classic Mac OS
    Oct 12, 2010 8:06 AM in response to GaBeech
    My Late 2006 iMac while it hasn't had any of the experienced kernel panics, lines, freeze, reboot, restart symptoms, and does have W8, recently the airport card has lost its reception, and the optical drive no longer is able to read all movie DVDs properly. It already had its hard drive replaced because it died, and is out of warranty. Given its age, I'm tempted to see if the clock battery might need replacing as that can trigger other apparent failures which later prove to be fixed by a new clock battery. I've started a thread here:

    http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2611820&tstart=0
  • by R C-R,

    R C-R R C-R Oct 12, 2010 1:24 PM in response to maitaimai
    Level 6 (17,700 points)
    Oct 12, 2010 1:24 PM in response to maitaimai
    Throwing the thing back to the user as opposed to what is the aim of the topic: urge Apple to investigate and to possibly acknowledge a problem due to hardware design and/or manufacturing problems. That's what people are asking for, for nearly two years now.


    If that is what users hope to accomplish by posting here, then they are wasting their time. This is a user-to-user forum, not a user-to-Apple one. This has been mentioned repeatedly. The OP asks for data from other users because that is all users can do for each other here. While the hosts of the Apple forums do try to forward issues discussed here to Apple engineering when time permits, that is not their primary job, nor is there any guarantee that they can do so, especially since the Discussions staff is quite small compared to the other Apple user support departments whose primary job it is to resolve user issues.

    It is that much less likely that anything will get forwarded when the posts are varied, vague on the technical details, & lack even the small amount of info the OP requested, much less the kind of comprehensive info Applecare, Genius Bar staff, or feedback forms request.

    Simply put, it isn't about throwing it back to the user because it has always been here, & will always be here unless users contact Apple through the channels intended for that purpose. The only useful thing that posting here can do is furnish facts. All the rest of it, including all the speculation, threats, warnings, & complaints, do nothing to make anything any clearer or resolve anything.

    It all boils down to one thing: if you want to help users get this resolved, share all the relevant info you can about the exact nature of the symptoms you see, the steps (if any) you have done to identify their cause, & enough info to identify when & where your iMac was made.
  • by maitaimai,

    maitaimai maitaimai Oct 12, 2010 5:39 PM in response to R C-R
    Level 1 (10 points)
    Mac OS X
    Oct 12, 2010 5:39 PM in response to R C-R
    This is not a mere users to users forum. Your status R C-R is different. Everybody is wearing a uniform, like good old Zappa said, you too, so don't kid yourself and us.
  • by rkaufmann87,

    rkaufmann87 rkaufmann87 Oct 12, 2010 6:07 PM in response to maitaimai
    Level 9 (58,956 points)
    Photos for Mac
    Oct 12, 2010 6:07 PM in response to maitaimai
    maitaimai wrote:
    This is not a mere users to users forum.


    Sorry wrong, it is a user to user forum. Read the Terms of Use to your right and you will find that out!


    Your status R C-R is different. Everybody is wearing a uniform, like good old Zappa said, you too, so don't kid yourself and us.


    R-C-R's status simply indicates he has posted on the Apple Discussions forum many many times and has helped many people. That is how one achieves the status he has attained.
  • by R C-R,

    R C-R R C-R Oct 12, 2010 7:57 PM in response to maitaimai
    Level 6 (17,700 points)
    Oct 12, 2010 7:57 PM in response to maitaimai
    maitaimai wrote:
    This is not a mere users to users forum. Your status R C-R is different.


    This is in fact just a user-to-user forum. I'm just a another user, one who has participated in the forums long enough to learn the truth of that, as have many thousands of other users. The only special status I have here is from the points awarded to me not by Apple but by other users for what they consider the helpfulness of some of my replies to their questions.

    If how any of this works is unclear to you, refer to the Help & Terms of Use link that appears on every Discussions page.
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