How to read a HFS floppy disk in Mac OS Catalina

We have an old Macintosh Classic II (circa 1992!) in good working condition. We're trying to figure out how to get files from that old Mac to a modern iMac running MacOS 10.15 Catalina.


As near as we can tell, we have two options:

  1. Copy files from the Classic onto a floppy disk and read them using a USB floppy disk attached to the iMac.
  2. Network the two Macs together and transfer files over the network.


But both approaches are harder than they look. Here are the challenges with each method, and the questions we need answered:


Floppy Drive: We can write from the Classic to a 3.5" 1.5MB floppy, which the Classic II formats in HFS format. But these floppies won't mount on the iMac running MacOS 10.15, because modern MacOS doesn't support the old HFS disk format.

    • Is there a utility out there that allows modern Macs to read HFS formatted disks?
    • Is there a Terminal command that will enable our iMac to read the HFS floppies?


Networking: We would need to find an old legacy networking device that enables Ethernet on the Classic II.

    • What networking device should we get? (For example, Farallon made a series of "Etherwave" adapters for Macs in the 90s. But we're not sure which exact model would work with the Classic II.)
    • Once we get Ethernet working on the Classic, how do we configure the system settings on the old and new Macs to enable simple file transfers?


Any suggestions from the wise and wonderful Legacy Mac community would be wonderful. Thanks!

Posted on Mar 15, 2020 4:47 PM

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Posted on Mar 16, 2020 10:30 AM

It's a good idea, except there are a fair number of old Mac data file formats that save all of their info to the resource fork, which does not copy from an old Mac to a PC. You end up with zero byte files.


Stuffit should work, though. Use Stuffit on the old Mac to create a .sit archive and copy that over to the new Mac. It could even be put on a DOS formatted floppy. Either the Stuffit Expander or The Unarchiver should be able to open it on the Catalina machine (both are available for free on the App Store).

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Mar 16, 2020 10:30 AM in response to Jan Hedlund

It's a good idea, except there are a fair number of old Mac data file formats that save all of their info to the resource fork, which does not copy from an old Mac to a PC. You end up with zero byte files.


Stuffit should work, though. Use Stuffit on the old Mac to create a .sit archive and copy that over to the new Mac. It could even be put on a DOS formatted floppy. Either the Stuffit Expander or The Unarchiver should be able to open it on the Catalina machine (both are available for free on the App Store).

Mar 15, 2020 7:51 PM in response to Adam J. Bezark

What happens if you copy the files onto a PC-formatted (MS-DOS, FAT) 1.44 MB floppy disk instead, and then try to read it via a USB floppy drive connected to the modern iMac? Depending on the Macintosh Classic II operating system, either an Apple File Exchange program (look for it in a folder on a 7.0.1 or 7.1 Tidbits system disk) or a PC Exchange control panel (part of System 7.5.x) will be required in order to write to a PC floppy.


There were SCSI-to-Ethernet adapters from manufacturers such as Dayna, but these devices (and the necessary software) can be difficult to find. It may be easier to try to locate an appropriate semi-old (pre-1998) Macintosh computer with Ethernet, to be used as an intermediate machine. The connection between the Classic II and this semi-old Mac can be via LocalTalk (in its simplest form, a MiniDIN-8M to MiniDIN-8M printer cable between the printer ports).



Mar 16, 2020 10:12 AM in response to Adam J. Bezark

>Harrumph! Certainly not.

:-)


The idea of having an (Internet-capable) Windows PC (with a floppy drive, Ethernet, and a serial port) as an intermediary may sound strange, but can actually be quite useful. For example, early versions of commercial Windows software like TransMac or MacDrive could handle HFS-formatted 1.44 MB floppy disks (a web search may even show details about an old freeware application called HFVExplorer). It is also possible to use an old PC to create a Mac-formatted floppy containing a ready-to-use StuffIt Expander installer. The PC could (using a special technique) create working/bootable Mac floppies from certain downloadable disk images. The serial port can be used with a suitable cable combination to create a null-modem link to the modem port of the Classic II. So, if you know someone with an old Windows (for example, XP) computer, you may want to buy or borrow it for some initial transfers in both directions.

:-)

Mar 16, 2020 8:42 AM in response to Adam J. Bezark

Hi,


First of all, which exact system version is installed on the Classic II?


The Tidbits diskette was one of the floppies in the System 7.0.1 or 7.1 set of disks. If you have one of these system versions, but not a set of floppies, have you checked whether the Apple File Exchange application possibly is somewhere on the hard disk (or if there is a set of system disk images there)? If System 7.5.x is installed, the PC Exchange control panel should be there (just make sure that it is in the right place, and active). With PC Exchange installed, Apple File Exchange is not used.


Yes, it may be worth testing the USB floppy drive with a Mac OS X 10.6 MacBook (the following article could perhaps be of interest in this context: https://siber-sonic.com/mac/newmillfloppy.html).


Alternatively, do you have access to an old external serial dial-up modem (with a suitable modem cable for the Classic II modem port)? Do you have a communications program (such as the communications section in ClarisWorks, or a dedicated terminal emulation application) on/for the Classic II?

Mar 16, 2020 9:28 AM in response to Jan Hedlund

The Classic II is running System 7.0.1 - and we don't have the system floppy disks. (We bought it online as a fun project.) We've combed thru the hard drive and don't see the Apple File Exchange application - and don't see any system disk images. We've tried PC-formatted disks -- that's how they came in the box of floppies we purchased -- but System 7.0.1 can't read them and just wants to format them as HFS.


I suppose one approach is to find/purchase an old set of System 7.5 floppies and install them manually (assuming they're still viable).


For now, our best bet may be to get the old 2006 MacBook working and see what version of OS X it's running. Still looking for the power adapter.


Will report back with results (and probably more questions). Thanks for the help!

Mar 15, 2020 9:53 PM in response to Jan Hedlund

Thanks for the suggestions. The Apple File Exchange idea sounds good... except I would need to write that Tidbits system disk to a HFS floppy on the Mac that downloads it, and that's the exact thing I can't do!


I guess I could try to buy a TidBITS system disk online somewhere and physically insert it into the Classic II to install the Apple File Exchange program.


Also, we have an old 2006 MacBook Core Duo - If we can get it running, maybe it can serve as an intermediary. (I think Mac OS X 10.6 can still read HFS drives?)

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How to read a HFS floppy disk in Mac OS Catalina

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